Mosque at Ground Zero? Plan angers NY

Discussion in 'International Politics' started by Oracle, May 18, 2010.

  1. Oracle

    Oracle New Member

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    NEW YORK: An ambitious plan to build a mosque right next to New York’s Ground Zero is prompting hope — and anger — in a city that has been scarred by terrorism.

    There’s little to see now at the site, an abandoned clothing store two blocks from the former World Trade Center where nearly 3,000 people died on September 11, 2001.

    But Feisal Abdul Rauf, a New York imam and a leader of the project, says the planned multi-storey Islamic center will transform both the drab lower Manhattan street and the way Americans have looked on Muslims since 9/11.

    Boasting a mosque with sports facilities, a theater and possibly day care, the center would be open to all visitors to demonstrate that Muslims are part of their community, not some separate element.

    "There’s nothing like this that we know of in the United States," Rauf said. "This will be a community center for everyone, not just for Muslims, but non-Muslims."

    The Islamic center is part of Rauf’s program, called the Cordoba Initiative, meant to build bridges between the West and the Muslim world.

    But because of the proposed mosque’s location, just around the corner from the gaping Ground Zero hole, Rauf’s call for peace is seen by some as a battle cry.

    "The outrage continues," says website www.nomosquesatgroundzero.wordpress.com under a close-up of the collapsing Twin Towers.

    Accusing the Cordoba Initiative of trying to "sneak it through," the protest site says the center will "cast a rude shadow over Ground Zero."

    Others compare the idea to building a German cultural center at Auschwitz.

    "Spitting in the Face of Everyone Murdered on 9/11," writes Blitz, a self-described "anti-jihadist newspaper."

    http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...d-Zero-Plan-angers-NY/articleshow/5942406.cms
     
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  3. dulce bellum inexpertis

    dulce bellum inexpertis Regular Member

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    Isnt this just what makes sensitivity to other religions feel like idiocy? Christians are not allowed to build a church in Saudi Arabia, neither in Mecca nor anywhere else in Saudi Arabia, but Muslims demand the right to build mosques at ground zero, in Rome, on top of temples in Jerusalem, like they did with the dome of the rock, in India they broke temples and built mosques, in Serbia they do the same until now, destory churches, bomb Synagogues in Tunisia, but what do muslims want? The right to build a mosque right next to the spot where the worse terrorist attack on American soil was carried out by muslims, the ground zero area of New York City, where the twin towers were brought down by Islamic Jihadists on Tuesday, September 11 2001!

    Imagine this, the best view of Ground Zero, which is like what you said, a sacred spot for many now, will be from that Islamic center! Now some extremist muslimites, and anti American pacifists from all over the world can gather on the 15th story of that Islamic center, and marvel at what Al Qaida accomplished! I find it revolting to say the least!!!! Who in their right mind in 1950 would ever have suggested a Shinto temple above the Arizona at Pearl Harbor
    What a world we live in!
     
  4. F-14

    F-14 Global Defence Moderator Senior Member

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    i agree with the People on this it should not be allowed near the ground zero
     
  5. ahmedsid

    ahmedsid Top Gun Senior Member

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    Isnt this an Old News? The Center has been allowed and its no more a News AFAIK. This is a Double post too, We have discussed this before too I feel in another thread

    And Dulce- Churches are not allowed in the countries you mentioned coz they have openly declared themselves to be non secular. Let America Declare itself to Shed its Secular Image, and I too will support what you say. But Dont Show the Double Standards as usual! America is not a Christian Fiefdom, as of now, atleast not in the Constitution. Have a look at your Constitution and come back. Until you change the core of it, whatever you said is just a rant of an illiterate soul, not aware of where the rest of the world lives!

    Thank God, there arent many Americans like you, otherwise, the whole muslim world would have been nuked, because some racists feel, thats the way the world needs to be!

    I honestly feel decades later, this phase of Islam will vanish, and Islam will come back to being a religion of peace, as it was intended. Do we speak of the "Inquisition" The Christians conducted, killing Scientists and Free Thinkers and poor women in the name of Religion? No! So this too shall pass! God Speed
     
  6. ajtr

    ajtr Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    There is a difference of sky and earth between USA and Saudi arab.One Is declared secular democratic state other is Declared islamic state.
     
  7. ahmedsid

    ahmedsid Top Gun Senior Member

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    And that is because, some loonies claiming to be Muslims did something horrible and all the muslims in USA should pay the price?
     
  8. ajtr

    ajtr Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    Are mosques allowed in Vatican???Just a question???
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2010
  9. ahmedsid

    ahmedsid Top Gun Senior Member

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    You Mean, Vatican City? I dont think there are mosques
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2010
  10. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

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    Back to the same old question. Anyways liberal muslims like me denounce violence and suicide is unislamic. Those committing suicide are not even given proper last ritual as per islamic tradition and they are also buried separately. But the extremists have a different take on it. Problem is that no one wants to listen to liberals like me but only want to talk about what the extremists do or want to do or what they talk about. Isnt the world aware that these extremist minded people are even persecuting even liberal muslims and killing them?

    A mosque at groud zero if made would be a bridge between the west and liberal Islam. Shows the plural society that America is and not the Islam that bought down the twin towers.
     
  11. ahmedsid

    ahmedsid Top Gun Senior Member

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    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/534947.stm


    Israel condemns Vatican in mosque row


    Israel has rejected accusations by the Vatican that it is creating religious divisions by allowing a mosque to be built close to a major Christian shrine in Nazareth.

    The Foreign Minister, David Levy, condemned the criticism as ''very grave'' and said Israel had done all it could to stem the dispute.
     
  12. ajtr

    ajtr Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    Yeah vatican..mixed it up with venice..my mistake..edited...
     
  13. ahmedsid

    ahmedsid Top Gun Senior Member

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    Yes, No one will Listen to you Yusuf, not because they are ignorant, but because they are prejudiced and want you off the face of the earth, just like the terrorists too dream of doing to liberals like you. So yes, you are between a rock and a hard place!

    Luckily for people like us, the muslims who are the first to condemn the violence of the loonies, there are not many like Dulce and his likes out there. Yes they do have a voice and are heard too, but there are more good folks out there too, just that, they too like us, are not heard much!

    Many are using the predicament Islam is in, to make it a reason to start another crusade against it, and wipe it off, because this is the best time for them to do so!
     
  14. ahmedsid

    ahmedsid Top Gun Senior Member

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    I dont think there is, you might see folks saying Vatican is tooo small to accomodate a mosque and all, but I dont frankly know. I dont want a mosque in Vatican, because the Christians have their reasons for it, and we should respect it.

    Read up the Article about Israel and Vatican row too. Its interesting. I just posted a para from it, the rest of it is good to read
     
  15. F-14

    F-14 Global Defence Moderator Senior Member

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    da that is the point a bunch of lunatics did it and we cant say that all Muslims are terrorist to people who lost their families in that blood bath the core point is that watch your actions because they define your country , your religion and all that you are
     
  16. dulce bellum inexpertis

    dulce bellum inexpertis Regular Member

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    Mr. Ahmed, in my post, I have mentioned 2 countries: Japan & KSA. As far as I know, Japan is a secular nation, a democratic nation, while Saudi Arabia is as you rightly say, an Islamic state.
    Our reservation on the mosque is the people responsible for the horrific act on WTC, did it the name of their religion, and we can not allow a monument to be built to conumerate that very religion. In the name of their god, these people are consistently killing civilians, commiting atrocities, waging jihad, and all these things, I am pretty sure you must be well aware of.

    Many person can tell, that 2 blocks from ground zero is to many a slap in the face, not by the people who are building it, but by those who waged a war against our very way of life in the name of this very religion.
    We welcome the moderate voice of islam, we encourage it, but that does not give anyone the right to abuse this freedom.

    You are telling me about my constitution, I'm well aware of it, thank you. I come from a long line of War veterans, people who fought to preserve our way of life, our freedom, our rights, and our allies.
    I have served my country proud in the war against terror, and the people I have fought, I can tell you about them, that they come blazing guns at us in the name of their religion.

    Rightly as you said, decades later, this phase of Islam will vanish, we feel perhaps that will be a better time to erect a mosque, rather than at a time when still wars are being fought, by people who commit crimes in the name of Islam, and those fighting for their free society.

    "the whole muslim world would have been nuked"
    As a soldier, I can tell you there is no such war waged by us against any muslim. We are out there fighting the terrorists, the jihadis, and this is only paranoia. There are people (who are not followers of Islam) who are against or display hatred towards this religion, but their numbers are few, and they are considered as extrememists and they are not the guys planning our missions.

    Do we speak of the "Inquisition"

    No one is denying what crusaders did, but then again, we can also not deny what the muslim conquests have done in the past.
    We do not let our past define our actions, we are fighting against the terror that is there in the present day world.

    Myself, I am an atheist, and I do not fight for religion, I fight for my country and its freedom.
    So if you will excuse me, but I do feel in the present day, such an act, of erecting a monument to celebrate the Lord in whose name jihadis killed many men, killed my compatriots, is not something that I can agree with.

    "And that is because, some loonies claiming to be Muslims did something horrible and all the muslims in USA should pay the price?"

    Perhaps, if you had served alongside of us in Afghanistan, in Iraq, and other parts of Mid-East, you would see, that the numbers or rather ratio of "loonies" to the population is not few.
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2010
  17. dulce bellum inexpertis

    dulce bellum inexpertis Regular Member

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    also I'd like to ask you one thing....

    you say KSA has declared itself as a non-secular state...
    So you are suggesting, it is okay to prohibit freedom of religion??
     
  18. Yusuf

    Yusuf GUARDIAN Administrator

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    Thats what the state of KSA is doing.
    But then the US does not mind doing business with it and call it ally while it preaches democracy elsewhere. Geopolitics!!!
     
  19. ajtr

    ajtr Veteran Member Veteran Member

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    American conveniently Create Terrorists and encourage Jihad to wage wars on other countries when it suits its interest and when the same mujahedeen attack them they claim ti wage war on terror on terrorists.and when they are unable to defeate them they invent terms like good taliban bad taliban.How convenient.....:happy_2:
     
  20. dulce bellum inexpertis

    dulce bellum inexpertis Regular Member

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    Yes, US created and used Al-Qaeda in the past, to fight the soviets, to fight communism.
    But when you say that " when the same mujahedeen attack them they claim ti wage war on terror on terrorists."
    In this case, are you suggesting we should not fight back against the terrorists? And it is these terrorists who are using their religion, it is them who started the events leading to this war. We are fighting these terrorists only, not the religion.

    Good Taliban & Bad Taliban.

    I can tell you this, when we are given a mission, we are ordered to neutralize the enemy. As a soldier, we try to take them prisoners, we do not differentiate. If we are unable to capture them, we shoot to kill, unless necessary to take them prisoners for intel. Whether we give favorable treatment to certain prisoners in return for valuable intel, that may or may not be happening.

    Again I have expressed my opinion on the Mosque near ground zero issue, Im not here to give slack to anyone or on any religion. And I'm only looking for genuine opinions of people here on how they feel.
     
  21. dulce bellum inexpertis

    dulce bellum inexpertis Regular Member

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    Yes, KSA is treated as an ally in the mideast, and as you correctly pointed out it is for geopolitical reasons.
    But my opinion on the mosque is as a civilian, I see all treaties and agreements between countries as based on reciprocity.

    USA is not perfect, it has its flaws just like anybody else. But then again USA is not a religion or a holy place.
     

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