Kaveri Engine

[Kchontha]

I don't think so.
Safranized Kaveri is mainly your Kaveri (with your blades, your metal parts,...)but with the pince of salt of Safran engeneer to make it run at all altitudes and all regimes.

To produce a wealthy engine is a kind of alchimy : you can't find all in the books or with mathematical formulas. You need some inspiration, and you need to make some mistakes before so as to learn from them.

India wanted to produce its own high performance engine was a highly difficult task. Better to begun with gas turbine for ships for exemple.

Who told you that safranised kaberi is mainly Kaveri? Safran/Snecma is clinging for the 2nd time for helping GTRE due to turbofan engine business opportunity it will have in India in the near future and 1 billion Rafale offset it has to obliged; this is business partnership. India will produce its own turbofan engine with or without anybody help.

 

[TPFscopes]

Who told you that safranised kaberi is mainly Kaveri? Safran/Snecma is clinging for the 2nd time for helping GTRE due to turbofan engine business opportunity it will have in India in the near future and 1 billion Rafale offset it has to obliged; this is business partnership. India will produce its own turbofan engine with or without anybody help.

SAFRAN is not the partner in KAVER Project. It is roped in just to tackle the hiccups which are being raised at high throttle.
After Project being finalized,it will be producedby Indian side.
But there may be a new development K9+ or K10 Engine under SAFRAN & GTRE JV

 

[salute]

I think Safran is working on two versions :
1) using the Indian technology (ie your own metallurgy, own machining process...).
2) using the Safran technology (more advanced blade mono crystal alloy, new machining process, new FADEC? composite ?...). In this case it's unlikelly we will givee you know-how... you will have to purchase these components to Safran from France.

you mean something like sweden does with its engine for gripen ,

ge core and rest are their own made components .

 

[TPFscopes]

you mean something like sweden does with its engine for gripen ,

ge core and rest are their own made components .

Don't you think 1 BN USD is quite high, to think in that way?

 

[salute]

Don't you think 1 BN USD is quite high, to think in that way?

not according to BON PLAN ...............................................................................

 

[smestarz]

There is nothing like SAFRANISED kaveri,
As per the obligations of Offset, Safran has to deliver its expertise in Kaveri project, it will be Safran which helps in certification. Safran will have no IPR on Kaveri, please note. Try not to get on everybodys nerves by spreading false stories.

About New GTRE - SAFRAN engine,, there is no plans for this at present. Safran wishes it has the big size of the pie, but it all depends on how the GoI moves ahead.

It is also rumoured that even Russia would be interested to share its engine tech as part of PAKFA obligation. So that would mean sharing tech of purpose built 5th Generation engine instead of a 4th gen engine. M-88 is nice but Kaveri after reducing some weight would be ideal for many of fighter projects.

I don't think so.
Safranized Kaveri is mainly your Kaveri (with your blades, your metal parts,...)but with the pince of salt of Safran engeneer to make it run at all altitudes and all regimes.

To produce a wealthy engine is a kind of alchimy : you can't find all in the books or with mathematical formulas. You need some inspiration, and you need to make some mistakes before so as to learn from them.

India wanted to produce its own high performance engine was a highly difficult task. Better to begun with gas turbine for ships for exemple.

 

[TPFscopes]

It is also rumoured that even Russia would be interested to share its engine tech as part of PAKFA obligation. So that would mean sharing tech of purpose built 5th Generation engine instead of a 4th gen engine.

There is nothing special about your rumoured Al-41/Izdeliye-30 except higher thurst. M-88 is quite efficient and economic , it also provide a very low IR signature and supercruise to RAFALEs.

All rumours about FGFA deal will be cleared soon

 

[TPFscopes]

DETAILED DESCRIPTION ABOUT M-88's low IR SIGNATURE TECHNOLOGY

Rafale’s infrared signature is less than that of its competitor due to it’s two channel engine cooling ,a blast of cool air bypasses from fan of jet engine to around the engine exhaust which makes it difficult to lock on with infrared missiles a the cooler air shields hot exhaust to some extent , thus preventing higher infrared emissions.

On M88, you have extra nozzles, rods, fluid, perhaps pumps/pump capacity being higher, actuators and hydraulic lines are sized to activate both set of nozzles, engine casing thickness is not optimized for weight gain but reliability and durability, etc.

This is costly in terms of weight but it does have a very strong effect on the IR signature of the engine.

IR signature of M88

Reduced IR signature of RAFALE

 

[square]

There is nothing like SAFRANISED kaveri,
As per the obligations of Offset, Safran has to deliver its expertise in Kaveri project, it will be Safran which helps in certification. Safran will have no IPR on Kaveri, please note. Try not to get on everybodys nerves by spreading false stories.


.

correct................................

presently only one aggrement of $2 million is executed for certification of kaveri....

safren try hard to bring drdo to agree on new engine with m88 core , but then , as latest as on may 2017 , safren cheif has clearly stated on a interview with forbes that drdo is relectent to let it baby go.

 

[TPFscopes]

correct................................

presently only one aggrement of $2 million is executed for certification of kaveri....

safren try hard to bring drdo to agree on new engine with m88 core , but then , as latest as on may 2017 , safren cheif has clearly stated on a interview with forbes that drdo is relectent to let it baby go.

Will you please share the link?

 

[square]

Will you please share the link?

do not quote me again...

i don't like you.....

make a cbi enquire .....whole nation would like to know !


do not quote me again.....

 

[TPFscopes]

do not quote me again...

i don't like you.....

make a cbi enquire .....whole nation would like to know !


do not quote me again.....

If you want privacy than you should get out of the forum.

You like me or not is not an issue but fake claims can't be tolerated.
And don't ever spread rumours

Understand?
Hope you Better understand the issue...

 

[BON PLAN]

you mean something like sweden does with its engine for gripen ,

ge core and rest are their own made components .

I think on Gripen is quite a fully US engine (I'm not sure).
But on Viggen, the RM8 was heavily derived from a civil JT8D core, with a powerfull swedish PC

 

[BON PLAN]

Facts are that Kaveri failed to perform as demanded. Specialy in high altitude tests.
Safran give a help to solve the problems (at least in form of engeneering consulting, maybe a little bit more. Or far more... who knows?).

Some called that a Safranized Kaveri. another way to say a "tuned Kaveri by Safran"

 

[tharun]

I think on Gripen is quite a fully US engine (I'm not sure).
But on Viggen, the RM8 was heavily derived from a civil JT8D core, with a powerfull swedish PC

Gripen engine is a derivative of GE's F404 ,And it is not fully US engine.
Finally it is a mixed engine technology from US and made by british company called GKN with suppliers from EU.

 

[Kchontha]

Drdo/GTRE in partnership with Safran is developing a 98Kn thrust (with afterburning) turbofan engine by using m88 core and retaining upto 60% of the engine components from kaveri to power Tejas mk1a and mk2 MRCA. All these modified Comoments (including second generation single crystal turbine blades) will be co-developed with the help of military technical mentoring by safran. This new unnamed turbofan engine is always referred to as safranised Kaveri.

 

[TPFscopes]

Gripen engine is a derivative of GE's F404 ,And it is not fully US engine.
Finally it is a mixed engine technology from US and made by british company called GKN with suppliers from EU.

yes, it is.
For RM8: Pratt & Whittney and Volvo (GKN)
For RM12: GE and Volvo (GKN)
but I want to add something that The Engines was designed by swedish Volvo Aero but later in 2012 GKN takeover it.
http://www.gkngroup.com/investorrelations/News/Pages/GKN-plc-completes-Volvo-Aero-acquisition.aspx

 

[TPFscopes]

Drdo/GTRE in partnership with Safran is developing a 98Kn thrust (with afterburning) turbofan engine by using m88 core and retaining upto 60% of the engine components from kaveri to power Tejas mk1a and mk2 MRCA. All these modified Comoments (including second generation single crystal turbine blades) will be co-developed with the help of military technical mentoring by safran. This new unnamed turbofan engine is always referred to as safranised Kaveri.

this is only a speculation.
.....................

 

[Kchontha]

this is only a speculation.
.....................

What can you say other than this================?

 

[Vijyes]

Whether gripen engine is ge f404 or not, it definitely is not Swedish engine. It has imports from USA big time, especially in critical components. Its non critical component like nut and bolt or even the FADEC (software) may be Swedish. But by all means gripen is not worth buying