J-11 is it that good?

Discussion in 'China' started by ptldM3, Oct 11, 2009.

  1. ptldM3

    ptldM3 Regular Member

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    Chinese sources claim the J-11 is superior to both the SU-30MKK and the SU-30MKI, i find it hard to beleive. Aparently the J-11 uses lots of composite material the reduce both weight and RCS. Furthermore, the WS-10A engine is supposedly "superior" to the AL-31, but if it's so superior why does China continue to purchase jet engines from Russia? Moreover, the Chinese claim that even their AA weapons are superior to anything Russia has. Finally the J-11 is reputad to have a superior radar, is this true?

    So how does the J-11 stack up against the, for instance, the SU-30mki, SU-35, or even the SU-30MKK in terms of radar, weapons, ect.

    Are the Chinese full of it or is the J-11 really that good? Personally i think the J-11 is overrated.
     
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  3. Martian

    Martian Respected Member Senior Member

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    I think it's hard to make any comparisons with confidence. China does not disclose the capability parameters of her latest weapons systems. For military enthusiasts, we are left with guesswork most of the time.
     
  4. badguy2000

    badguy2000 Respected Member Senior Member

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    SU30,old SU35 and SU37 all used canards.

    but new Su35 and J11B both abandon canard. Su27SM for Russia self also abandoned canards.:icon_salut:

    frankly speaking, the flankers with canards such as su30,old su35 and su37 are just tech-testing platforms to Russians ,to a certain extent.

    After developing su30,old su35 and su37, Russian may find that it is wrong to fix canards on flankers ,so its new su35 and Su27sm for Russian airforce give up canards

    at first,CHinese J11B gave up canards.
     
  5. p2prada

    p2prada Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

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    No Chinese official has claimed the J-11 to be superior to the original Flankers. The PLAAF still consider the Su-30MKK to be their best aircraft.
     
  6. badguy2000

    badguy2000 Respected Member Senior Member

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    from the start, PLAAF's SU30MKK is not for air-controll,but for air strike.

    Su30MKK as well as JH7 and H6 belongs to PLA's long-range air-striking force

    air-controll is the duty of su27,J11,J11B and J10.
     
  7. p2prada

    p2prada Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

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    The MKKs are multirole. They may provide escort for the other strike fighters in the PLAAF and also work as strike aircraft. It's obvious to anybody that multirole aircraft are more advanced than an Air-superiority aircraft. Capability is debatable. The Su-27s are older while the Su-30MKK are newer. The J-10s and J-11s are still not ready.
     
  8. bengalraider

    bengalraider DFI Technocrat Stars and Ambassadors

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    the Chinese have made steady progress on improving their aircraft industry from the very beginning. if the J-11 is better it is simply the fruition of their efforts . i would like to remind all concerned that the Chinese are masters at stealing and copying technology there is no telling what tech may have been stolen and incorporated into the J-11, the J-11 may or may not be overrated but for the sake of us all (Chinese included) i hope we never have to find out.
     
  9. badguy2000

    badguy2000 Respected Member Senior Member

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    you viewpoints is questionable .

    air-controling bird concentrating all its design for air-fighting.

    the configure and design of M-role birds has to make a move for the duty of air strikes.
     
  10. Vladimir79

    Vladimir79 Defence Professionals Defence Professionals

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    So do I...

    And just where are these composites made? The only aviation composites in China are owned by Airbus.

    WS-10A doesn't even work well enough to field, so it is a little hard to be superior to a combat tested engine.

    Considering their most advanced missile, PL-12, uses first generation R-77 seekers and data links, it is a little hard to swallow.

    Considering the Paks won't even buy Chinese radar, you be the judge.

    It has been stated by Russian officials the J-11 is Su-27SK clone. Considering this is Cold War tech, it is quite obsolete.

    I agree, it is quite overated.
     
  11. Vladimir79

    Vladimir79 Defence Professionals Defence Professionals

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    Chinese J-11... aka Su-27SK never had canards to give up. Su-30 is still uses canards as the Su-30MK. China opted not to get canards on Su-30MKK due to not being able to afford the heavier more modern radar which required canards. Su-27SM never had canards because that is modernisation of original Su-27.
     
  12. Quickgun Murugan

    Quickgun Murugan Regular Member

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    Yep you are right. Unless an official statement about the J-11B specs comes out, all will only remain fan boy statements.

    But definitely the current J-11B rumor specs are suggesting it to be in the league of Su-35.
     
  13. Martian

    Martian Respected Member Senior Member

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    "But definitely the current J-11B rumor specs are suggesting it to be in the league of Su-35."

    I think the reason that many people are speculating and watching the developments is because China throws a lot of money at these projects.

    Ten years ago, none of us would have imagined that China would have a 052C destroyer, KJ-2000 AWACS, J-10, Type 093 SSN, Type 094 SSBN, Type 99 tank, etc. China's continuous double-digit increases in her military budget have produced all these new toys for us to look at.

    A reasonable person would think that it's only a matter of time before China's large monetary resources bring about new changes to her J-11B and other fighter programs.
     
  14. badguy2000

    badguy2000 Respected Member Senior Member

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    yes, CHina has not enough money while India has...:twizt:
     
  15. Vladimir79

    Vladimir79 Defence Professionals Defence Professionals

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    Considering India has poured $8.5 billion into Su-30MKI and China only $1.3 billion for Su-27SK, I think the figures are clear.
     
  16. p2prada

    p2prada Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

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    What are you talking about? The F-35 is a better air-superiority fighter than the F-22. Even then the F-35 is a multirole fighter highly optimized for strike.

    The Su-30 is superior to the Su-27 in almost every aspect. Even your MKKs are excellent birds and surpass the capabilities of your old Su-27s. Right now, the MKKs are the best fighters in the PLAAF inventory. Why else do you think the PLAAF uses the MKK for SEADs?

    The J-10, J-11 and Su-27 are used for air superiority simply because their technological requirement is low. All they need to do is detect, track and shoot.

    Similarly, the Russian version of PAKFA will be technologically inferior to the the Indian version because the Russians mainly want a single seater PAKFA for air superiority. The Indian version will be far more capable with 2 pilots.
     
  17. p2prada

    p2prada Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

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    10 years ago, they were all in development. All of them are old toys that were already developed by other countries. India and China are playing catchup. If you readup on stuff US and Russia are making, then you will find our developments a serious drain on resources.

    Money only helps a little. Experience teaches the most. Go to any corporate in the world. You will see that the scientists working in their R&D labs are the most pampered lot in the world. This is done so that the scientists don't quit.
     
  18. p2prada

    p2prada Stars and Ambassadors Stars and Ambassadors

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    The $8.5Billion was before cost escalation. Now it should be around $9-9.5Billion. Soon to be another $1.5Billion for 50 new MKIs.
     
  19. Martian

    Martian Respected Member Senior Member

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    "The F-35 is a better air-superiority fighter than the F-22"

    "The air force's main advocacy and lobbying group posted a new presentation to their website today. The brief is titled, "F-22 vs. F-35 comparison", and the conclusions are heavily stacked in favor of the former." See F-22 vs F-35: no contest - The DEW Line

    I think most people agree that the F-22 is clearly superior to the F-35. Otherwise, the F-22 wouldn't cost so darn much. The F-22 is expensive to the point that it got canceled.
     
  20. venom

    venom DFI Technocrat

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    The Present N011M Bars radar on Su-30Mki is far superior to anything the chinese have......The best fighter which the chinese have Is Su-30MK3 which is inferior to Su-30Mki & regarding the RCS of Su-30Mki, it had been reduced to
    4 m2. Su-30Mki Is a "HIGHLY UPGRADED & MODIFIED VERSION Which has Indian, Russian, French & Israeli avionics & Su-30Mki combines the features from Su-37 & Su-35.It is tailor-made for Indian specifications.The MKI variant is often considered to be a customized Indian variant of the Sukhoi Su-35.
     
  21. Vladimir79

    Vladimir79 Defence Professionals Defence Professionals

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    ^^ Where did you get 4m^2?^^
     

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