Finland's courts crack down on hate speech and inciting hatred

Discussion in 'Europe and Russia' started by Ray, Nov 29, 2014.

  1. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    We have of late been on this forum about the ethics, human rights and all that we should learn from Europe to including Finland.

    Well, this is a great expose of the ethic, human rights and so on in Europe with particular reference to this aspect in Finland.

    If a country with a very low density of population per sq Km and a population size way lower than even one of our metros can get into each other's hair and hate people because of the minor differences, then it is surprising that Europeans grandstand and tell Indians what they should and hector on their perceived omission and commissions of India.
     
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  3. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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  4. jouni

    jouni Senior Member Senior Member

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  5. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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  6. jouni

    jouni Senior Member Senior Member

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  7. jouni

    jouni Senior Member Senior Member

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    Those stamps were sent deliberately to Russia, to show them how retarded they are.
     
  8. pmaitra

    pmaitra Moderator Moderator

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    Actually, it proves how retarded the senders are.
     
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  9. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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  10. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    Actually, even the Finns are retarded going by your standard of retards of not appreciating gays.

    The Finns have just scraped through a legislation allowing same sex marriage, showing that there is a large number who do not find same sex marriage acceptable.

    I am not a prude. Homosexuality is OK, but same sex marriage? What extra facility does that give apart from being a life long homo with the same homo.
     
  11. ghost

    ghost Regular Member

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    Sir,

    I think a person should be free to decide and express whom he love(emotionally)and want to make love (physically).Homosexual and bi -sexual are part of civilization ,only difference is that they are not allowed to come out in open regarding their sexual preference,there is much more to homosexuality beyond sex. Sex should be left to to consenting adults, what they want to do with each other in private.It's not business of yours or society in general.There is a lot to a civilization than sexual preference of some individuals;there is lot to contribute to civilization beyond one sexual preference.Love and sex comes from one feeling , you should not punish someone for expressing his natural feeling until it violate freedom of others. I consider myself an alpha male ,but this does not mean that I should not respect others feeling and love if they do not match mine perception of love . No one choose to be homosexual ,it's what they are born with, it's what they are,why ridicule someone that too for their choice of "love". PLEASE FOCUS ON EMOTION RATHER THAN SEX IN SUCH KIND OF RELATIONS.I support @jouni in this, it is human to respect one choice of love irrespective of cast,creed ,religion and sex.It's not some "morally repugnant ideology" but who they are.You and I don not have the right to give lecture to others on what their sexual and love preference should be;to each to his own.There is nothing being kept out of Russia,homosexual will remain in Russia ,with only difference that they will not be able to express love in public like you and me,there love will be confined to behind doors.

    Regarding civilization:
    In another indicator of the liberal Hindu heritage, Kama Sutra, a classic written in the first millennium by Sage Vatsyayana, devotes a whole chapter to homosexual sex saying "it is to be engaged in and enjoyed for its own sake as one of the arts." Besides providing a detailed description of oral sex between men, Kama Sutra categorizes men who desire other men as "third nature" and refers to long-term unions between men.


    Prof. Bharat Gupt, a classicist and dharmashastra scholar held a talk at Delhi's Habitat Centre on November 25 on "Hindu View of Homosexuality." He examined the issue along with a fellow speaker and discussant Dr. Come Carpentier of France. He observed that talking about the rights of the homosexual/gay individuals seems to be one of the major agendas of social reforms in India today. Many people think that ancient Hindu ideas were entirely compatible with the views of modern European and American notions. According to Prof. Gupt The ancient Hindu society did not consider the homosexuals as perverts or sinners. As the term, tritiiya-prakriti or third nature describes them, they are being themselves, they are being natural.
     
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  12. jouni

    jouni Senior Member Senior Member

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    They can get married, and have/adopt children. Also now they are officially at the same level with the rest, which is very important. Also because Finland is between east and west, this was one of the last things were Sweden was ahead of Finland. We hope to see some Indian couples to get married here, if it is not possible in India.
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2014
  13. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    Why should two men who are not naturally engineered to have children adopt children?

    Children are not playthings like cars.

    A child must develop a societal psychology and be constructive to society. For that one has to have a mixed gender upbringing.

    But then, I reckon in Europe, men are more adoptive in substituting women in all respect and so maybe I am not right in my surmise.

    @ghost

    Indeed, that is why I am saying homosexuals can do what they want so long as they do it in private.

    I would even go to the extent that they can do it in public if there were 'all gay' clubs and such like same sex areas of personal bonding.

    However, same sex marriage and adopt children?

    It is said that child psychology is built up for comprehension of societal responsibility if they can appreciate the relative genetic pluses and minuses and the gender contribution towards a harmonious societal interface.

    There have been cases of children brought up by wolves.

    A feral child (also called wild child) is a human child who has lived isolated from human contact from a very young age, and has little or no experience of human care, of human loving or social behaviour, or, crucially, of human language.

    10 Feral Human Children Raised by Animals
    http://www.smashinglists.com/10-feral-human-children-raised-by-animals/

    While these may not be the examples for homosexual upbringing of adopted children, but then being deprived of what would be termed as 'natural family' i.e. having a mother and father, may have some negativity in societal interface.

    Children of divorced parents are to known to have their own trauma and ghosts that are not contributive to societal intermingling since some psychological void influences their behaviour.

    Likewise, an abused child of a 'normal family' too can have aberrations in psychological terms and hence not conducive to societal harmony.
     
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  14. jouni

    jouni Senior Member Senior Member

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    Don't worry, you think like 92 of our 201 members of our Parliament. That was their argument also. It is a matter that divides people.
     
  15. jouni

    jouni Senior Member Senior Member

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    @ghost, great post. I think that when you scratch the surface of modern India, underneath is a great and open society waiting to emerge. Alexander the Great was also bisexual and he I guess is wellknown in India.
     
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  16. Ray

    Ray The Chairman Defence Professionals Moderator

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    Good for them.

    But if the remainder felt otherwise, that is also good.

    A society that has a falling sperm count, it requires innovation to keep the country going by having same sex marriage and have adoption by those homos.

    In this connection this study is pertinent
    The annual changes in temperature are of crucial importance for Finland's climate. It is natural to distinguish seasons using a thermal criteria, with seasons defined by the daily mean temperatures of 0°C and 10°C. With this criteria the lengths of seasons can vary greatly from year to year.....

    In summer the mean daily temperature is consistently above 10°C
    http://en.ilmatieteenlaitos.fi/seasons-in-finland

    Further, they also require to have adopted children from developing countries since they can't have children of their own.

    Be a bisexual. No big deal.

    Be a homo. No big deal.

    But adopt children?

    Why not, I have explained.
     
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  17. jouni

    jouni Senior Member Senior Member

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    Studies show that same sex parents have no negative effect on children.
     
  18. Razor

    Razor CIDs from Tamilnadu Senior Member

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    Your statement is false, or to be more precise, not complete.

    As of now, the best science can say is that the causes of homosexuality can be a varying mix of biological factors like genes and environmental factors like psychology, societal contact and so on.

    It is undeniable that children learn a lot from their parents. So parents who are homosexual will knowingly or unknowingly pass some ideas and some children may knowingly or unknowingly accept some of those ideas. Why let children born to other people be filled with these ideas ?

    Also homosexuality decreases reproductive success. So from an evolutionary perspective as far as the reproductive stand point is concerned, homosexuality is a defect.

    Not to mention the greatly increased risk of spread of STDs.

    And finally, polls have consistently shown that in countries like Russia, China and India, and a vast chunk of E. Europe (including NATO Poland) and Mid-East, homosexuality is not at all welcome by the public; only a small minority is acceptive of homosexuality and its virulent spreading through Western propaganda apparatus.
    Why should the West be allowed to preach to us what we may or may not do ?
    Who the ---- are they to preach to us ?

    Not sure why you brought in religion into this, but okay.

    How many texts of "Hinduism" discuss Homosexuality ? Kamasutra ? Manusmriti (third gender) ? What else ?

    How many discuss them in a 1.) positive manner (I doubt any), 2.) negative manner and 3.) neutral manner.

    Forget "Hinduism", that is a Western term.
    How many core texts of the Vedic system discuss homosexuality in a positive manner and how many of them discuss them in a kinda "these exist, now moving to next topic" manner ?
     
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  19. ghost

    ghost Regular Member

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    Sir,

    Even though what you say have some truth in it,but it is not the complete truth.

    The child homosexual will adopt will be an orphan,and it is better to grow up under love and care of two individuals of same sex than to grow without none.I agree it might get complicated for child at some point of time ,but I think he can be explained the truth when he becomes mature enough to understand.

    At the end of day ,most of the homosexual are children of normal parents,brought up under normal condition.Important point is it's not what they choose, it's what they are born with.Hence I don't think it will have such effect on them ,as ample example of opposite sex relationship will be available in the society . It's our inner urge which decide to whom we are attracted to,and that urge cannot be controlled or guided by anyone not even by us.

    Regarding your philosophy of being brought up by wolves,it's unfair .

    1 First there is a difference between humans and wolves.We can communicate.

    2 The child will be exposed to human society ,rather than being confined to only same parents.A child also learn and adopt from society as much he learn and adopt from home.Unlike wolves where he was only confined to jungle.


    3 Children raised by single parents do grow up normal.

    4 At the end what matter most is love ,care,and proper upbringing by one parents.This is no where related to one sexuality or sexual preference.


    Just like we" straight" still need marriage to declare our commitment to each other to the whole world,in same manner I think homosexual should be allowed to declare their commitment to each other through marriage in society.As per our constitution :we should not discriminate on basis of sex,religion,caste or race.In India homosexual are given the status of third sex.Supreme Court recognizes transgenders as 'third gender' - The Times of India
     
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  20. Razor

    Razor CIDs from Tamilnadu Senior Member

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    Very brave. Congratulations.

    Actually, since you guys care so much about the homos, instead of sending stamps, why don't you just give a free pass to the homos in Russia and everywhere else to settle in Finlands.
    That way the Finns can be happy, the homos can marry, be happy, adopt poor helpless kids, do whatever they want and everybody else in other countries will also not care.
    Why don't you do this instead of sending homo stamps to Russia.

    Well, of course we know the answer. It's not because you give a damn about homosexuals but you simply want to foment revolutions, create trouble and cause problems for Russia.
     
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  21. Razor

    Razor CIDs from Tamilnadu Senior Member

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    Define negative effects.

    Who created the norms for negative and positive effects ?
     
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