Cannabis-- Path to enlightenment??

Singh

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@Singh

Can you name any tantrik writing prescribing bhang ?

And what is this Vam Tantrik ?
I think you are conflating medicine men and tantriks. Tantriks, Aghoris, Nihangs etc. don't adequate usage of bhang for the general public as such.

Vama Marg is the left hand path.

Bhang is used for its medicinal qualities.
 

Singh

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Those suffering from glaucoma or increased intra-ocular pressure are prescribed marijuana by actual Doctors too.
 

Sakal Gharelu Ustad

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You are implying that Aghoris are addicted to addictive substances with narcotic qualities which leaves them in an inebriated state making them unable to act towards achieving liberation.

Too many implications and assumptions.
I know it can be valid path to achieve it. But how successful are these people? It is a broad and probably not so relevant question.
 

Singh

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I know it can be valid path to achieve it. But how successful are these people? It is a broad and probably not so relevant question.
I haven't met an Aghori nor do I know enough about them. But I have heard and read about many a Aghori who are revered/respected by many "godmen".
Even amongst Aghoris there are different types...
 

Bhadra

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I think you are conflating medicine men and tantriks. Tantriks, Aghoris, Nihangs etc. don't adequate usage of bhang for the general public as such.
Tantra simply means methodology of doing things and that includes mendicants..

Vama Marg is the left hand path.
Ah ! that is but literal and meaningless translation .. that too not correct .. there is nothing called left hand or left side ways in Vam marga.

Bhang is used for its medicinal qualities.
Ok .. so how is it connected with tantra ?
 

Singh

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Tantra simply means methodology of doing things and that includes mendicants..

Ah ! that is but literal and meaningless translation .. that too not correct .. there is nothing called left hand or left side ways in Vam marga.
Sir,

As per my understanding any path which includes worship/ propitiation of Shakti is classified as Tantra. Although it is too wide and broad a classification.

From what I understand Vama-marga translates to Left Hand Path.

However, you obviously are much more qualified to explain, would request you to please to enlighten.

Ok .. so how is it connected with tantra ?
From my understanding intoxicants play a pivotal role in vama marga.
 

Bhadra

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Sir,

As per my understanding any path which includes worship/ propitiation of Shakti is classified as Tantra. Although it is too wide and broad a classification.
No Sir, then what about Vishnu Tantra, Shaiva Tantras which are large in numbers and Budhist Tantra which are so large in numbers .. in fact Vajrayana is wholly tantric in its basics, orientation and practice .. there are great tantrik names there like sages Nagarjuna, Tilopa, etc etc.

The schools which revolve around worships of Shakti are called Shakta ( as against Shaiv or Shavites)
but all shakta schools are not tantrik. for example Devi Mahtamya of Markandeya purana genrally called as Durga shaptashati may be tantrik or non - tantric or Viashanavite. Godess Tara in Budhism or Padamavati under Jainism may or may not be tantric.
Tantra has a philosophy, basic cosmology, and ontology which when followed makes the path tantric and the essence of that power of letters and mantra.

From what I understand Vama-marga translates to Left Hand Path.
Vam Marga is a philosophy in itself and has its own ontology and beliefs. However generally it revolves around worship of Das Mahavidyas with ultimate worship of Mahakali ( Vam marg) or Rajrajeshwari Tripura Sunadari ( generally Dakshina marg). Even there worship of Mahavidyas can be carried out by Dakshina marga or Vam marg. The difference is between what constitute of liberation and what will bring about emancipation and liberation. For example Shankaracharya worshipping Tripurasunadri differs from Vam marga in philosophy and essence and in basically and ultimately being different in the mantra. Reading Soundarya Lahiri etc would explain it.....
it results in differentiation of stages and methods of attaining nearness of the God or Goddess.

However, you obviously are much more qualified to explain, would request you to please to enlighten.
No sir, the subject is too deep to be knowledgeable. I am just a theoretician.



From my understanding intoxicants play a pivotal role in vama marga.
The aim of Tantra is to detoxify the body and mind from all impurities, illusions and untruth and lead the mind to the truth and realisation which is the true path of liberation of the soul and merging it with the ultimate soul / Shakti.... so the use of intoxicants may or may not be recommended therein.. Generally Shakti puja may involve many rituals but ultimate aims is related to awakening of the primordial power called Kundalini..

No path including those of the great saints is untouched by the great philosophy of tantra .... tantra literally meaning a vehicle or a machine or a web of power centres and is but only a means and not the end.
 
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Sakal Gharelu Ustad

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No Sir, then what about Vishnu Tantra, Shaiva Tantras which are large in numbers and Budhist Tantra which are so large in numbers .. in fact Vajrayana is wholly tantric in its basics, orientation and practice .. there are great tantrik names there like sagae Nagarjuna, Tilopa, etc etc.

The schools which revolve around worships of Shakti are called Shakta ( as against Shaiv or Shavites)
but all shakta schools are not tantrik. for example Devi Mahtamya of Markandeya purana genrally called as Durga shaptashati may be tantrik or non - tantric or Viashanavite. Godess Tara in Budhism or Padamavati under Jainism may or may not be tantric.
Tantra has a philosophy, basic cosmology, and ontology which when followed makes the path tantric and the essence of that power of letters and mantra.



Vam Marga is a philosophy in itself and has its own ontology and beliefs. However generally it revolves around worship of Das Mahavidyas with ultimate worship of Mahakali ( Vam marg) or Rajrajeshwari Tripura Sunadari ( generally Dakshina marg). Even there worship of Mahavidyas can be carried out by Dakshina marga or Vam marg. The difference is between what constitute of liberation and what will bring about emancipation and liberation. For example Shankaracharya worshipping Tripurasunadri differs from Vam marga in philosophy and essence and in basically and ultimately being different in the mantra. Reading Soundarya Lahiri etc would explain it.....
it results in differentiation of stages and methods of attaining nearness of the God or Goddess.



No sir, the subject is too deep to be knowledgeable. I am just a theoretician.





The aim of Tantra is to detoxify the body and mind from all impurities, illusions and untruth and lead the mind to the truth and realisation which is the true path of liberation of the soul and merging it with the ultimate soul / Shakti.... so the use of intoxicants may or may not be recommended therein.. Generally Shakti puja may involve many rituals but ultimate aims is related to awakening of the primordial power called Kundalini..

No path including those of the great saints is untouched by the great philosophy of tantra .... tantra literally meaning a vehicle or a machine or a web of power centres and is but only a means and not the end.
Isn't tantra more closely related to Kundalini awakening? Both in Hinduism and Buddhism.
 

sob

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From my understanding Marijuana has 4 distinct forms :

Bhang - leaves
Ganja - female plant flowering "tops"
Hashish - resin
Charas - resin specially treated in "sheepskin"

The first two varieties find mention in ayurvedic, folk and regional medicine. They are also used by certain spiritual disciplines such as Nihang Sikhs, Tantriks etc. Prepared in a certain manner they suppress certain urges, in others they expand appetitte, and some use them for mild "psychonautic" purposes.

The last two varieties have a very high concentration of psychoactive substances. They are used as painkillers, "drugs", psychonautic experiences. Again these forms are also used by certain spiritual disciplines esp the aghoris and vam tantriks.

Marijuana and its forms certainly have some merits and are much less harmful and addictive than other legalized substances.
I can personally attest that after having Ganja, I used to feel voraciously hungry.
 

Singh

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I can personally attest that after having Ganja, I used to feel voraciously hungry.
Ganja not only increases your appetite but also increases your ability to digest food. Hence medical marijuana for cancer (chemotherapy) patients.
 

Bhadra

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Awakening Kundali is not a difficult job, and is "secular".
"Secular" always used to be a political concept simply meaning that state will not be influenced nor will influence religion (meaning thereby the Church).

In India this word "secular" has become omnipotent scoundrels refuse. How can Kundali become secular when it has been found and recognised by religion including Buddhism, Churches, Judaism and even Islam. Religion is religion whether it believes in existence of God or something else. Atheism itself is religion because it Believes in (belief) non existence of something. There is nothing secular there. There is nothing secular in the realm of mind and thought.
 

Singh

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No Sir, then what about Vishnu Tantra, Shaiva Tantras which are large in numbers and Budhist Tantra which are so large in numbers .. in fact Vajrayana is wholly tantric in its basics, orientation and practice .. there are great tantrik names there like sages Nagarjuna, Tilopa, etc etc.

The schools which revolve around worships of Shakti are called Shakta ( as against Shaiv or Shavites)
but all shakta schools are not tantrik. for example Devi Mahtamya of Markandeya purana genrally called as Durga shaptashati may be tantrik or non - tantric or Viashanavite. Godess Tara in Budhism or Padamavati under Jainism may or may not be tantric.
Tantra has a philosophy, basic cosmology, and ontology which when followed makes the path tantric and the essence of that power of letters and mantra.


Vam Marga is a philosophy in itself and has its own ontology and beliefs. However generally it revolves around worship of Das Mahavidyas with ultimate worship of Mahakali ( Vam marg) or Rajrajeshwari Tripura Sunadari ( generally Dakshina marg). Even there worship of Mahavidyas can be carried out by Dakshina marga or Vam marg. The difference is between what constitute of liberation and what will bring about emancipation and liberation. For example Shankaracharya worshipping Tripurasunadri differs from Vam marga in philosophy and essence and in basically and ultimately being different in the mantra. Reading Soundarya Lahiri etc would explain it.....
it results in differentiation of stages and methods of attaining nearness of the God or Goddess.


No sir, the subject is too deep to be knowledgeable. I am just a theoretician.


The aim of Tantra is to detoxify the body and mind from all impurities, illusions and untruth and lead the mind to the truth and realisation which is the true path of liberation of the soul and merging it with the ultimate soul / Shakti.... so the use of intoxicants may or may not be recommended therein.. Generally Shakti puja may involve many rituals but ultimate aims is related to awakening of the primordial power called Kundalini..

No path including those of the great saints is untouched by the great philosophy of tantra .... tantra literally meaning a vehicle or a machine or a web of power centres and is but only a means and not the end.
Sir,

I wrote about tantra and immediately realized that I should've prefaced it with colloquial classification. You are absolutely right that tantra is not relegated to Shakti worship and not all Shakti worship is tantrik in nature.

I also agree with your assertion that each school has a different conception and understanding of liberation. I in particular endorse your last line.

However, I would like to proffer a few points and anecdotes

Shankarcharya accepted Shri Worship after his visit to Kashmir, the ancient centre of Shri Vidya.

Intoxicants play a major part in Vama Marga. And as for purity, refer to Shankarcharya meeting with Shiva disguised as Chandala in Kashi.

Awakening Kundali in and of itself is not a big deal imho. But channelizing it, and harnessing it is.

Same with using Vama-Marga items, it is not for everyone. The pitfalls are too great, but the chance of acceleration to progress is also there.

True Aghoris ultimately imho are some of the great exponents of Sri Vidya and esp Surya Vigyan.
 

Singh

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"Secular" always used to be a political concept simply meaning that state will not be influenced nor will influence religion (meaning thereby the Church).

In India this word "secular" has become omnipotent scoundrels refuse. How can Kundali become secular when it has been found and recognised by religion including Buddhism, Churches, Judaism and even Islam. Religion is religion whether it believes in existence of God or something else. Atheism itself is religion because it Believes in (belief) non existence of something. There is nothing secular there. There is nothing secular in the realm of mind and thought.
Your first statement sir is incorrect.

Secular also means mundane.
Secularism means a political concept where there is a separation of church and state.

For eg. India is a secular state. When I go to movies I am indulging in a secular activity.

==

I meant secular in the sense that even if you are not a theist or a religious person or a believer your kundali can be awakened. Kundalini exists whether you believe it or not.
 

Bhadra

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@Singh
absolutely bang on target... but how does it matter if it is secular or not ... the moment one thinks of it in terms of being this or that .. there is a veil of artificiality presented to mind which is an obstruction to reality ...

hence it neither this nor that...... that is what Vedas say : Neti Neti..

Bulla Ki Jana main kaun ? is cry someone gave subsequently..
 

Abhijat

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Those suffering from glaucoma or increased intra-ocular pressure are prescribed marijuana by actual Doctors too.
So , are you implying that , those capitalist-leeches are , devouring common people , of a natural analgesic ?
 

Abhijat

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@Singh, as marijuana use, recreational/medicinal is banned in India, because of Psychotropic Substances act 1985, said to be peer pressure from Uncle Sam on government.

Now , as non-communicable diseases are increasing , and due to the high use of "pain killers" in such , and lack of resources to access such , by poor family , is minimal .

So , isn't capital greed , taking away a natural analgesic from common person ?
 

Singh

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@Singh, as marijuana use, recreational/medicinal is banned in India, because of Psychotropic Substances act 1985, said to be peer pressure from Uncle Sam on government.

Now , as non-communicable diseases are increasing , and due to the high use of "pain killers" in such , and lack of resources to access such , by poor family , is minimal .

So , isn't capital greed , taking away a natural analgesic from common person ?
Indian laws are screwed up. Look up the morphine controversy.
 

prohumanity

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Marijuana lobby in full swing.....make the youth DUMB and keep making billions in profits. This is how pathological capitalism works...your sons and daughters addicted to Marijuana and we control your land, your economy and your wealth. Make the Indian youth dumb..let them stay high and they wont be able to think what is in the interest of their nation. It will be easy to rule them...new type of Opium wars..
 

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