1979 China's J-10 wood model preceded Israeli Lavi program

Discussion in 'China' started by Martian, Mar 25, 2016.

  1. Martian

    Martian Respected Member Senior Member

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  3. Martian

    Martian Respected Member Senior Member

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    The J-10 wood carving is important for the following reasons.

    The J-10 wood carving showed that most of the J-10 characteristic designs had already existed in China in 1979. None of these features were copied from the Israeli Lavi.

    The usual allegations have been that the J-10 copied the Lavi in its air intake placement beneath the fuselage. The shape of the J-10 spine has been said to resemble the Lavi. The distinctive tail has also been mentioned to resemble the Lavi.

    However, the 1979 child's wood carving showed that all of these Lavi-like features had already been designed into the J-10 by 1979. This is one year before the Lavi program was even conceived.

    Canards on the J-10 were no surprise, because canards had already existed on the Chinese J-9.

    Finally, the J-10 is a full delta-wing. This is consistent with China's J-7, J-8, and J-9 delta-wing design. In contrast, the Israeli Lavi is a clipped delta-wing design.

    In conclusion, the J-10 is clearly an indigenous Chinese design. The subsequent similarities with the Lavi had already been in existence by 1979. The wing shapes are different. You cannot point to a list of features that China supposedly copied from the Lavi. China got there first in 1979.

    [​IMG]
     
  4. Martian

    Martian Respected Member Senior Member

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    Top 5 Reasons that the Israeli Lavi is a copy of China's Chengdu J-10/F-13 jet fighter

    1. According to GlobalSecurity, China's F-13 program started in 1971. By 1979, a child's wooden model of the F-13 showed the J-10's distinctive rectangular air intake under the fuselage and the distinctive J-10 spine. A 1980 toy model of the Chinese F-13 showed the distinctive tail of the J-10. Since the Israeli Lavi program was not initiated until 1980, the distinctive design elements of the Chinese J-10/F-13 preceded the Israeli Lavi by many years. This is the CHRONOLOGICAL argument. Which came first? The Chinese J-10/F-13 came years before the Israeli Lavi.

    2. The FINANCIAL argument is that China's J-10 program is well-funded. Only a well-funded program could have developed all of the cutting-edge fourth-generation technologies for the fighter jet. Since the Israeli Lavi was on a shoe-string budget and canceled, the Israeli Lavi obviously benefited from China's well-funded J-10 program. This argues that the three Israeli Lavi prototypes could never have been built without Chinese technological help.

    3. This is the TECHNOLOGICAL argument. For the sake of argument, let's assume the Chinese J-10 is a copy of the Israeli Lavi. If true then China would depend on Israel for further development of the J-10. This means the Chinese government would somehow find a way to keep funding the Lavi. The fact that China's J-10B is progressing without a concurrent Israeli Lavi upgrade shows that the J-10 program is independent of Israeli technology.

    The death of the Israeli Lavi and the continuous improvement in J-10 technologies prove that the J-10 program was the source of the fourth-generation fighter technologies. Not the poorly-funded and defunct Israeli Lavi.

    4. This is the HISTORICAL and EXPERIENCE argument. China started building jet fighters with the J-5 in 1956. China had thirty years of experience in building jet fighters (e.g. J-5, J-6, J-7, J-8, J-9, and J-10) by the 1980s.

    In contrast, Israel had very limited experience in building only one prior fighter (e.g. IAI Kfir) in 1973.

    China had almost twenty more years of jet-fighter design experience than Israel.

    5. This is the HIGH TECHNOLOGY argument. Which country is more high-tech? Is it China or Israel? Clearly, China is the more militarily high-tech country. China built the advanced indigenous WS-10A turbofan jet-fighter engine. Israel has never built an indigenous turbofan engine.

    Take a careful look at the CHRONOLOGICAL, FINANCIAL, TECHNOLOGICAL, HISTORICAL and EXPERIENCE, and HIGH TECHNOLOGY arguments. It should be obvious that the Israeli Lavi is a copy of China's advanced Chengdu J-10 jet fighter.
     
  5. abingdonboy

    abingdonboy Senior Member Senior Member

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    Typical commie propoganda.

    You can't whitewash history:

    [​IMG]



    [​IMG]
    Song Wencong in front of a J-10 with a Lavi type aircraft model


    [​IMG]

    Song Wencong in front of a J-10 real size mock up aircraft with a Lavi style intake
     
  6. Martian

    Martian Respected Member Senior Member

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    Try reading the first three posts in this thread.

    The Israeli Lavi copied the J-10, which existed earlier.
     
  7. abingdonboy

    abingdonboy Senior Member Senior Member

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    Riiiiiiiight, because a child saw his dad's blueprints just laying around, entered into a wood shaving competition and just happened to be photographed with all the proof one needs to validate this.


    Again- typical commie propoganda.
     
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  8. Martian

    Martian Respected Member Senior Member

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    Are you blind?

    The Israeli Lavi air intake is identical to an F-16. It is a round semi-circle.

    The Chinese Chengdu J-10 air intake is rectangular and the air intake is supported by three vertical struts on the side.

    The air intakes for the two planes are completely different.
     
  9. Panjab47

    Panjab47 सर्वाग्रेक्षत्रियाजट्टादेवकल्पादृढ़व्रता|੧੫| Banned

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    Isn't it still made of wood? :lol:
     
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  10. Rajaraja Chola

    Rajaraja Chola Regular Member

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    Oh. The differences between them are so much that J10 represents an moon while Lavi, an sun.
     
  11. Indx TechStyle

    Indx TechStyle Perfaarmance Naarmal Senior Member

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    Israel copied F-16 not J-10.


    This 30 character rule really sucks.
     
  12. BON PLAN

    BON PLAN -*- Senior Member

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    A F16 (or japan F2) with a rectangulair air intake. Far from delta+canards Lavi !
     
  13. Illusive

    Illusive Senior Member Senior Member

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