Three Gitas ?

pmaitra

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I hope u know that the city of DWARAKA was found in the sea near Gujarat. It was the Archeological Department of India who found this and they dated it also. So, if Dwaraka is real then Mahabarata is real.
True. Dwarka is real, so is Saraswati river, which is scientifically proven. I am not taking a stand here. All I am saying is that part of it may be true while part of it may have been modified over the ages.
 

Known_Unknown

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sesha_maruthi27

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In the photo (courtesy ASI) above, An underwater archaeologist of the ASI examines an ancient structure off the shore of Dwaraka; a circular structure on the shore at Dwaraka; fragment of an ancient structure found underwater; remains of an ancient structure in the forecourt of the Shri Dwarakadhish Mandir (temple).

Over 21000 years old evidence of Lord Shri Krishn's Dwarka/Dwarika Nagri have been found which proves that Sanatan Vedic Dharm is the oldest civilization in the world. It all started and developed in the holy land of Aryavrat/Bharat (misnomer: India) since eons together. The researchers and scientists busted the Myth of Aryan Invasion also in many video evidence given below.

Please also read,

1. Scientific Verification of Vedic Knowledge and its proofs ॐ नमः शिवाय defines my life: Scientific Verification of Vedic Knowledge and its proofs

2. The Myth of the Aryan Invasion--- ॐ नमः शिवाय defines my life: The Myth of the Aryan Invasion


JANMASHTAMI DAY - the birthday of Lord Krishna. On this day we remember the celestial and immortal message of Lord Krishna given by him to Arjuna on the battlefield of Kurukshetra. Bhagavad Gita contains the guiding principles for every Hindu, nay every human being regardless of his religion, every day for every moment of his life. Lord Krishna told Arjuna on the battlefield of Kurukshetra: 'All paths lead to ME'. It is because of this universality that it has found favour with all Classes and Schools for centuries. Nowhere perhaps, with the possible exception of Mathura Vrindavan in UP is Janmashtami celebrated with that kind of elemental passion which it arouses in the State of Gujarat. The ancient and timeless Krishna Temples at Dakore in Kheda District and Dwaraka in Jamnagar District of Gujarat have attracted throngs of devotees of Lord Krishna for thousands of years.

Lord Krishna is better known in India's cultural and religious history as the King and Emperor of Dwaraka. According to ancient Hindu mythology, Dwaraka was a new country founded by the Yadava clan of chiefs who fled from the Surasena Kingdom due to fear from the king Jarasandha of Magadha. It was the brainchild of Vasudeva Krishna, the great personality of the Dwapara Yuga. The territory of Dwaraka includes the Dwaraka Island, many neighbouring islands like the Antar Dwipa and the mainland area neighbouring the Anarta Kingdom, making it similar to Greece having many islands and a mainland forming its territory. The kingdom was situated roughly in the north-western region of Gujrat state. Its capital was Dwaravati (near Dwarka, Gujarat). The Mahabharata does not mention Dwaraka as a kingdom but rather as the capital city of Yadavas who ruled the Anarta Kingdom. It was also known as Dwaravati. It was also a port-city, having trade relations with many sea-faring nations. The name Dwaraka, in Sanskrit means a gate or a gateway. It could be that this ancient port-city was a gateway for foreign sea-faring kingdoms into the Indian mainland and vice versa.

Dwaraka is one of the seven Holy Cities Ayodhya, Mathura, Haridwar, Benares, Kanchi, Ujjain and Dwaraka. Dwaraka's majesty and beauty have been described by many poets and writers, saints and sages of ancient India. It is referred to as Golden City in Srimad Bhagavad Gita, Skanda Purana, Vishnu Purana, Harivansha and Mahabharata. It was the capital of Lord Krishna's Kingdom. All the Islam-embracing, Christianity-coveting and Hindu-hating perverted pseudo secularists in the Government of India and all the political parties would be shocked to know that Dwaraka is not just a legend or the product of a figment of imagination but a real, concrete and terrestrial truth. Dwaraka was a well-planned city with a modern and technologically advanced harbour suitably designed to deal with the marine traffic of large ships entering the port.

One of the verses in the Bhagavada says: 'The yellow glitter of the golden fort of the Dwaraka City in the sea throwing yellow light all round looked as if the flames of Vadavagni came out tearing asunder the sea'. Then came the deluge and Dwaraka 'A City of Gold' vanished under water. Around 1500 BC, the whole Western course of India disappeared along with Lord Krishna's Capital City of Dwaraka. This is how it was described by Vedavyasa in the Mahabharata: 'The sea, which had been beating against the shore, suddenly broke the boundary that was imposed on it by nature. The sea rushed into the City of Dwaraka. It coursed through the streets of the beautiful city. The sea covered up everything in the city. I saw the beautiful buildings becoming submerged one by one. In a matter of a few moments it was all over. The sea had now become as placid as a lake. There was no trace of the city. Dwaraka became just a name; just a memory'.

The ruins of ancient Dwaraka city have been found under the sea following recent oceanographic studies conducted near the modern temple-city of Dwaraka. The first Archaeological excavations at Dwaraka were done by the Deccan College, Pune and the Department of Archaeology, Government of Gujarat in 1963 under the direction of an outstanding Archeologist of Ancient India H.D. Sankalia. It revealed the existence of many artefacts, hundreds of centuries old. The Archaeological Survey of India (ASI), conducted a second round of excavations under the direction of Dr S R Rao, a world renowned Underwater Archeologist. Dr S R Rao is to the discovery of the ancient town of Dwaraka, what Isaac Newton is to the Law of Gravitation or Albert Einstein to the Theory of Relativity.

Between 1983 and 1990, the well-fortified township of Dwaraka was discovered, extending more than half mile from the shore. The township was built in six sectors along the banks of a river. The foundation of boulders on which the City's walls were erected proves that the land was reclaimed from the sea. What is amazing is that the general layout of the City of Dwaraka described in the ancient texts agrees with that of the submerged city discovered by the Marine Archaelogical Unit. (MAU) of The Archaelogical Survey of India (ASI), which carried out its work under the guidance and supervision of Dr S R Rao.

The discovery of Dwaraka by Dr S R Rao confirms that the descriptions found in the text of the Mahabharata and other important Sanskrit texts regarding Dwaraka are true. It also means that the Mahabharata is NOT A MYTH but an important source of information for studying the ancient history of India. T R Gopalakrishnan has succinctly summarised the importance of the excavations and discovery of Dr S R Rao: 'The strongest Archaeological support comes from the structures discovered under the sea- bed off the coast of Dwaraka in Gujarat by the pioneering team led by Dr S R Rao, one of India's most respected Archaeologists. An Emeritus Scientist at the Marine Archaeology Unit of the National Institute of Oceanography, Dr Rao has excavated a large number of Harappa sites including the Port City of Lothal in Gujarat.
 

SPIEZ

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Really? So since Disneyland is real, is Mickey Mouse and Donald Duck real too? Since Gotham city is real (Gotham, Nottinghamshire - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia), so Batman is real too? :D
Now if we start bashing other religions would you feel the same . How about Christianity???

And Jesus Christ making infinite loafs of bread and wine ? Or Accounts of Jesus arriving 200 years after He had passed away!!

Please do not start talking gibberish about faith of people.
 

Known_Unknown

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Now if we start bashing other religions would you feel the same . How about Christianity???

And Jesus Christ making infinite loafs of bread and wine ? Or Accounts of Jesus arriving 200 years after He had passed away!!

Please do not start talking gibberish about faith of people.
Who's bashing? Can you point out the fallacy in my logic? Someone claims that if Dwaraka exists, then so must Mahabharata. Then we know for a fact that Disneyland exists, so why can't we infer that Donald Duck and Mickey Mouse also exist? What is the difference? :laugh:
 

SPIEZ

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Who's bashing? Can you point out the fallacy in my logic? Someone claims that if Dwaraka exists, then so must Mahabharata. Then we know for a fact that Disneyland exists, so why can't we infer that Donald Duck and Mickey Mouse also exist? What is the difference? :laugh:
You don't mess with Faith of other people, If you don't agree with what he says that's fine. If you have a problem with what Gita says than mind your own Fing business.
 

Zebra

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Really? So why did it take more than 2,500 years after the war for the first stories of the Mahabharata to appear in writing? There's absolutely ZERO mention of Mahabharata, or even of Krishna for that matter in any Hindu texts before around 500 BC.

Maybe Ganesha was lazy, and took 2,500 years to write the story. :laugh:
Can you back your story with some source please
1) it take more than 2,500 years .
2) There's absolutely ZERO mention of Mahabharata, or even of Krishna for that matter in any Hindu texts before around 500 BC.



btw , pmaitra is right , it was told before it actually happened.
 

Known_Unknown

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You don't mess with Faith of other people, If you don't agree with what he says that's fine. If you have a problem with what Gita says than mind your own Fing business.
F the faith of other people. If other people believe BS and want to force it down my throat as the "truth", you're damn right I will point out the gaps in their logic. And since you're unable to point out the "fallacy in my logic", let me educate you, the reason is that there is none.

If someone makes a claim on a discussion forum, they should be prepared to back it up. I don't very much like people who proudly come and announce to the whole world that they are the ultimate repositories of all knowledge about a certain subject, and when asked to explain, scurry away and hide behind excuses of "faith" and such. It's called a "discussion/debate forum" for a reason. If you're going to hide behind "faith" everytime debates your claim, then might as well just quit the forum and save everyone the hassle.
 

SPIEZ

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F the faith of other people. If other people believe BS and want to force it down my throat as the "truth", you're damn right I will point out the gaps in their logic. And since you're unable to point out the "fallacy in my logic", let me educate you, the reason is that there is none.

If someone makes a claim on a discussion forum, they should be prepared to back it up. I don't very much like people who proudly come and announce to the whole world that they are the ultimate repositories of all knowledge about a certain subject, and when asked to explain, scurry away and hide behind excuses of "faith" and such. It's called a "discussion/debate forum" for a reason. If you're going to hide behind "faith" everytime debates your claim, then might as well just quit the forum and save everyone the hassle.
You are going Off topic, this debate is about 3 versions of Gita, I suggest you stick to that alone.
 

Singh

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From what I understand, the original unaltered texts are preserved through oral traditions or "intuitively". Unfortunately most of these texts then are not available for consumption of the masses.

===


"What we know as the The Gita is actually a collection of verses written by three different ideological groups !"
:facepalm:

LB if I say you can pass your exams by working hard, by working smart or by cheating. does this make me three different people ? :lol:
 
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Known_Unknown

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Can you back your story with some source please
1) it take more than 2,500 years .
2) There's absolutely ZERO mention of Mahabharata, or even of Krishna for that matter in any Hindu texts before around 500 BC.



btw , pmaitra is right , it was told before it actually happened.
Sure, here's some info from wiki:

The oldest preserved parts of the text are not thought to be appreciably older than around 400 BCE, though the origins of the story probably fall between the 8th and 9th centuries BCE.[SUP][2][/SUP] The text probably reached its final form by the early Gupta period (ca. 4th c. CE).[SUP][3][/SUP] The title may be translated as "the great tale of the Bhārata dynasty". According to the Mahabharata itself, the tale is extended from a shorter version of 24,000 verses called simply Bhārata.[SUP][4][/SUP]
[SUP][/SUP]

The background to the Mahabharata suggests the origin of the epic occurs at a time "after the very early Vedic period" and before "the first Indian 'empire' was to rise in the third century B.C.". That this is "a date not too far removed from the eighth or ninth century B.C."[SUP][2][/SUP][SUP][9][/SUP] is likely. It is generally agreed that "Unlike the Vedas, which have to be preserved letter-perfect, the epic was a popular work whose reciters would inevitably conform to changes in language and style,"[SUP][9][/SUP] so the earliest surviving components of this dynamic text are believed to be no older than the earliest external references we have to the epic, which may include an allusion in Panini's fourth century BCE grammar (Ashtādhyāyī 4:2:56).[SUP][2][/SUP][SUP][9][/SUP] It is estimated that the Sanskrit text probably reached something of a "final form" by the early Gupta period (about the 4th century CE).
I was off by about 100 years (400 BC compared to 500 BC) :)

About Krishna, also from wiki:

The earliest text to explicitly provide detailed descriptions of Krishna as a personality is the epic Mahābhārata which depicts Krishna as an incarnation of Vishnu

.
....................
In early texts, such as Rig Veda, there are no references to Krishna, however some, like Ramakrishna Gopal Bhandarkar attempted to show that "the very same Krishna" made an appearance, e.g. as the drapsa ... krishna "black drop" of RV 8.96.13.[SUP][26][/SUP][SUP][27][/SUP] Some authors have also likened prehistoric depictions of deities to Krishna.


Chandogya Upanishad
(3.17.6) Composed around 900BC-700BC[SUP][citation needed][/SUP] mentions Vasudeva Krishna

as the son of Devaki and the disciple of Ghora Angirasa , the seer who preached his disciple the philosophy of 'Chhandogya.' Having been influenced by the philosophy of 'Chhandogya' Krishna in the Bhagavadgita while delivering the discourse to Arjuna on the battlefield of Kurukshetra discussed about sacrifice, which can be compared to purusha or the individual.
[SUP][28][/SUP][SUP][29][/SUP][SUP][30][/SUP][SUP][31][/SUP]
Yāska's Nirukta, an etymological dictionary around 6th century BC, contains a reference to the Shyamantaka jewel in the possession of Akrura, a motif from well known Puranic story about Krishna.[SUP][26][/SUP] Shatapatha Brahmana and Aitareya-Aranyaka, associate Krishna with his Vrishni origins.[SUP][32]

[/SUP]

Pāṇini, the ancient grammarian and author of Asthadhyayi (probably belonged to 5th century or 6th century BC) mentions a character called Vāsudeva, son of Vasudeva, and also mentions Kaurava and Arjuna which testifies to Vasudeva Krishna, Arjuna and Kauravas being contemporaries.[SUP][28][/SUP][SUP][33][/SUP][SUP][34][/SUP]
 

Zebra

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Sure, here's some info from wiki:

[/SUP]



I was off by about 100 years (400 BC compared to 500 BC) :)

About Krishna, also from wiki:
1) wiki is taking about only The oldest preserved parts .

What about the system of Shruti and Smriti .

Shruti – that which has been heard
Smriti – that which has been remembered

2)The Vedas , they can not say any thing about Krishna .
They only says Neti - Neti ( infact they are not clear anout Krishna ) They just says this is not - this is not ( Neti- Neti ). You can find it in SRIMAD BHAGAVATAM (Bhagavata Purana); the story of Krishna .
 

niharjhatn

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It is probably true that the mahabharata (as it largely exists today) was composed relatively recently (~500 BC); however, it is equally likely that some of the stories it was based on were millenia older. I find it virtually impossible to believe that the mahabharata was composed by one man... and looking at it from a strictly historical perspective, it is likely that the form as which is has survived today is an amalgamation of these different stories. The only other text that came close (and has been much more extensively scrutinized!) are the Iliad and the Odyssey; also appears at a similar time period.

The aggregation and translation of the mahabharata is highly linked to sanskrit - hence why you see variant forms of the mahabharata present in other cultures - extending as far as south east asia (following the spread of sanskrit through the region) - almost proving that oral forms of the mahabharata existed, but further, continual refinement occurred in India. I daresay an interesting study would be the examination of such cross-cultural forms of the mahabharata, looking at specifics, linguistic differences, etc and a better temporal analysis of the origins formed.
 

sesha_maruthi27

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Who's bashing? Can you point out the fallacy in my logic? Someone claims that if Dwaraka exists, then so must Mahabharata. Then we know for a fact that Disneyland exists, so why can't we infer that Donald Duck and Mickey Mouse also exist? What is the difference? :laugh:
Shut up you idiot, never hurt the sentiments. You are starting to make a communal riot. Never talk ill about someone elses faith. You don't have the right to do so. You people don't know about " MAHA RISHI JESUS" either. Stop your blabaring. First try to know about "MAHA RISHI JESUS" then u talk. But never try to hurt others feelings. You don't have that right. If you do sa then you may get booked for provoking a communal riot. Please be careful.
 

sesha_maruthi27

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I request the MODS to stop this person from posting and he must be put in the prison for provoking a communal riot in DFI. This is ridiculous, he has no right to hurt the feelings of others.
 

Param

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I think it is impossible for any common man , to write this kind of scripture .

So I believe - avatar of lord and that is Vyasa is the author of the Mahabharata .

Ganesha wrote down as Vyasa's dictation .
:pound: I did not know he worked as a Steno.
 

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