The Real Reason Russia is Warming Up to Pakistan

Yumdoot

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Haaiyn, how do we share interests/ideas/values with US?

And what are these shared interest/values/ideas?

Please tell me, I would like to drop it right away. :p

And how is this shared interest/values/ideas, any different in the case of so called Right Wing, from the condition of Pakis who also love the people who fcuked them up for good?

Also Russians already have the Iranians by their side. And for good. And mind you only shared borders across the Caspian. These two simply never needed shared interest/values/ideas. So much for the Warm Waters Port theory. :pound:

Arre theek hai bhai, people can have their favourite places to visit on the globe, favourite hang outs but how the hell does that translate into shared interest/values/ideas.
 

Sakal Gharelu Ustad

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Haaiyn, how do we share interests/ideas/values with US?

And what are these shared interest/values/ideas?

Please tell me, I would like to drop it right away. :p

And how is this shared interest/values/ideas, any different in the case of so called Right Wing, from the condition of Pakis who also love the people who fcuked them up for good?

Also Russians already have the Iranians by their side. And for good. And mind you only shared borders across the Caspian. These two simply never needed shared interest/values/ideas. So much for the Warm Waters Port theory. :pound:

Arre theek hai bhai, people can have their favourite places to visit on the globe, favourite hang outs but how the hell does that translate into shared interest/values/ideas.
Means preference of Indians match with Americans. Where would you prefer to live and work?

But even on a strategic level:
- containment of China
- development of India
 

Yumdoot

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Means preference of Indians match with Americans. Where would you prefer to live and work?
India.

Where I already am both by choice and by Bhawaan Ki Daya sey.

And where I intend to keep my children too and theirs and so on and on and on...

But even on a strategic level:
- containment of China
- development of India
So you are saying that China can be contained if we cooperate with the US in containing China.

But then didn't the US nearly made China what it is today?
 

Sakal Gharelu Ustad

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India.

Where I already am both by choice and by Bhawaan Ki Daya sey.

And where I intend to keep my children too and theirs and so on and on and on...
But if someone puts a gun to your head to make a choice between Russia and US, you will choose US!!

So you are saying that China can be contained if we cooperate with the US in containing China.

But then didn't the US nearly made China what it is today?
They want to contain China, which means they would help us grow. Does India want to contain China? May be or may be not. But does it want to grow? Yes.
 
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Yumdoot

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But if put a gun to your head to make a choice between Russia and US, you will choose US!!
Then I will choose to live. :p

Neither Russia nor US.

But does India really feel that insecure about the Chinese / Gun.

My guess is we can take them on even without US.

Let me put it like this Paki-India size difference was less than the China-India size difference. US tried to make up for that difference. That did not stop Pakis from getting fair treatment at Indian hands. So how exactly would US help us, considering China is the gun at our collective heads.

OTOH Iraq was smaller than Iran and yet Iran did not exactly win despite its greater size. And then US killed off Iraq. :devil:

OTstillanotherH Russia itself is much smaller today than US. And yet US finds itself unable to stop Russia in the only theater US choose to challenge Russia.

OTstillanotherH the piddly little Vietnam smacked both US and China when their time came.

So how exactly did US help countries take on China (the Gun in your example).


They want to contain China, which means they would help us grow. Does India want to contain China? May be or may be not. But does it want to grow? Yes.

Does India gets to 'steal' technology?
Does India gets a MFN status?
Does India gets to deal with Pakis?
Does India gets to keep the NGOs out?
Does India gets to enjoy cheaper Oil from Iran?
Does India gets inside some NPT like exclusive Club?
Does India gets to import MTCR denied tech (which BTW we will be offered aplenty now that we don't need MTCR denied tech)?
Does India gets to have cheaper weapons (we actually by FMS which is more expensive comparatively)?

So what exactly do we get towards this 'help' for the growth?
 

Sakal Gharelu Ustad

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Let me put it like this Paki-India size difference was less than the China-India size difference. US tried to make up for that difference. That did not stop Pakis from getting fair treatment at Indian hands. So how exactly would US help us, considering China is the gun at our collective heads.
Do you even read again what you write!!

You really think China is so far ahead of us!! If it were it would have already taken away Ladakh and Arunachal.
 

Yumdoot

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Idiot both countries are BIGGEST DEMOCRACIES.Not those any fu*** Rus/chi/pak/saudi
Both countries respect CITIZENS RIGHTS .Not those any fu*** Rus/chi/pak/saudi
Indians want to live in do business in US..Not those any fu*** Rus/chi/pak/saudi
Both countries will fight against china in future.
Both countries are respected in the world as soft powers(US hard too).Not those fu*** Rus/chi/pak/saudi


Those small toys are doesn't make an issue,above are..
Bh@$|)K, Mere say uljhe ga to pachtayega. I will chase you to your personal hell and then keep you there for the rest of your natural life :)


You only cited purported commonalities when you actually claimed 'shared'

Here are the sources for you regarding what it means.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/share?s=t
http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/shared

Granted even if we have some commonalities, how does our Citizen Rights and Businesses depend for their survival and growth on our fulfilling this whorepanthi.

India unofficially joined US camp.Yes our Right wing is pro US.
 

Yumdoot

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Do you even read again what you write!!

You really think China is so far ahead of us!! If it were it would have already taken away Ladakh and Arunachal.
I gave you real life examples of size differences (both population size and economic size) where ultimate winning and losing had nothing do with those size differences.

I don't care where China is - ahead of us, behind us or equal to us. That was your injection into the whole argument. You cited China as a Gun on our heads. Unless off course that was not an analogy and mere smalltalk when you asked me the following.
But if put a gun to your head to make a choice between Russia and US, you will choose US!!
Now you are yet to explain anything of your own while I am trying to explain my own stance.
 

Sakal Gharelu Ustad

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I gave you real life examples of size differences (both population size and economic size) where ultimate winning and losing had nothing do with those size differences.

I don't care where China is - ahead of us, behind us or equal to us. That was your injection into the whole argument. You cited China as a Gun on our heads. Unless off course that was not an analogy and mere smalltalk when you asked me the following.


Now you are yet to explain anything of your own while I am trying to explain my own stance.
I did not say China is gun to our heads. I said US wants to contain China and will help India. Now whether Indian wants to contain China or not is a different story!!

You brought up the size difference between India-Pak to say US can do nothing if China bullies us. And I said China cannot bully us because we are above the threshold retaliation level to stop China. So, the difference between China-India is much less than India-Pak. Now you don't want to engage in small talk while you were the one who brought it up by comparing us to Pak in Indo-China relationship.

Any sane person on this thread, would like to live in US because of the livelihood opportunities and freedom that US offers. Some people might have other fantasies, I can't do anything about them!!
 

Yumdoot

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Bh@$|)K I know more Indians working in saudi,more sickulars want relations with Porki,Socialist or Out dated persons with Rus and Commies with China but at the end of the day all those countries are not use-full for India's progress/path/future except US&West.MODI&RW knows it and they joined hands with US, that is final.
Man you are such a slave that even in swearing you imitate your opponent. :pound: No wonder you suck for US. :devil:

But then again. If Indians are in Saudi or US then are they there because they are needed there. Or are they there because they are beggars.

What exactly is your point? Do people have to love the country they work in? Even at the cost of their own histories?
 

Yumdoot

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I did not say China is gun to our heads. I said US wants to contain China and will help India. Now whether Indian wants to contain China or not is a different story!!

You brought up the size difference between India-Pak to say US can do nothing if China bullies us. And I said China cannot bully us because we are above the threshold retaliation level to stop China. So, the difference between China-India is much less than India-Pak. Now you don't want to engage in small talk while you were the one who brought it up by comparing us to Pak in Indo-China relationship.
Now you are being kifayati with facts. I gave you 4 examples all of which I stand by. Not just the one you chose to read into

I also gave you the following 3 more examples to help understand that we Indians need not fear China at all. And for some reason you chose to ignore all these three:

OTOHIraq was smaller than Iran and yet Iran did not exactly win despite its greater size. And then US killed off Iraq. :devil:

OTstillanotherHRussia itself is much smaller today than US. And yet US finds itself unable to stop Russia in the only theater US choose to challenge Russia.

OTstillanotherH the piddly little Vietnam smacked both US and China when their time came.


Any sane person on this thread, would like to live in US because of the livelihood opportunities and freedom that US offers. Some people might have other fantasies, I can't do anything about them!!
Ok I guess I am an insane person on this thread.

But believe me people actually live in India already. Forget wishing most of them cannot even point out where US is on the map. And they do not care. They do not go about cursing their lives for being in India nor do they go about their lives wishing to be in US.

And those who desperately want to be out of India are always allowed to go settle any place. Off course so long as the other country wants these people. Has been so in this part of the world since apes became man. That is how the world got peopled!!!

Coincidently these poor people of India, also allow the people going out, to come back if they so wish. An arrangement approved by all sides of the political divide. In fact the BJP had some time back declared that India is the natural refuge for all Hindus. Which is just as well.

So is it really about livelihood opportunities and freedom that US offers (in both cases India offers more). Or is this about something else you want to say but find hard to express.
 

Sakal Gharelu Ustad

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Now you are being kifayati with facts. I gave you 4 examples all of which I stand by. Not just the one you chose to read into

I also gave you the following 3 more examples to help understand that we Indians need not fear China at all. And for some reason you chose to ignore all these three:

OTOHIraq was smaller than Iran and yet Iran did not exactly win despite its greater size. And then US killed off Iraq. :devil:

OTstillanotherHRussia itself is much smaller today than US. And yet US finds itself unable to stop Russia in the only theater US choose to challenge Russia.

OTstillanotherH the piddly little Vietnam smacked both US and China when their time came.
I don't need to rubbish all your claims because the premise you were building was too shaky. I just said India stands to benefit if US wants to contain China. Period.

Now how Vietnam gave China and US a bloody nose does not matter. India stands to gain by partnership with US if US wants to help India to counter China. All your examples do not pertain to the discussion. On top of that India is not a small puny country which can be compared to the above examples you cited. So, I can be kifayati because other points are useless.


Ok I guess I am an insane person on this thread.

But believe me people actually live in India already. Forget wishing most of them cannot even point out where US is on the map. And they do not care. They do not go about cursing their lives for being in India nor do they go about their lives wishing to be in US.

And those who desperately want to be out of India are always allowed to go settle any place. Off course so long as the other country wants these people. Has been so in this part of the world since apes became man. That is how the world got peopled!!!

Coincidently these poor people of India, also allow the people going out, to come back if they so wish. An arrangement approved by all sides of the political divide. In fact the BJP had some time back declared that India is the natural refuge for all Hindus. Which is just as well.

So is it really about livelihood opportunities and freedom that US offers (in both cases India offers more). Or is this about something else you want to say but find hard to express.
Common person in India may care for nothing but they love their mobile phones and technology. And US and other western countries are at the frontier of such technologies. So they may not explicitly like to go to US but would anyday prefer technology and some democracy over Russian gundaraj(Putin's slavery) and bankruptcy.
 

Mad Indian

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Common person in India may care for nothing but they love their mobile phones and technology. And US and other western countries are at the frontier of such technologies. So they may not explicitly like to go to US but would anyday prefer technology and some democracy over Russian gundaraj(Putin's slavery) and bankruptcy.
Its always funny when anti american anti capitalist socialist/prorussian fanboys bitch about USA in US owned/derived technologies. It will be even more funny when they get their paisa from USA and bitch about capitalism and what not.

Either way, we should do whatever it takes to help us and grow, be it help from Rus or USA
 

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Any sane person on this thread, would like to live in US because of the livelihood opportunities and freedom that US offers. Some people might have other fantasies, I can't do anything about them!!
:tsk:

Sir,

Call me a blind nationalist.

But I feel like it is necessary to stand and say it clearly that I was born in this "mitti" and die in same , serving with utmost strength.

Don't take it personally, but I don't like the generalization you made out.
 

Mad Indian

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But I feel like it is necessary to stand and say it clearly that I was born in this "mitti" and die in same , serving with utmost strength.

Don't take it personally, but I don't like the generalization you made out.
What he meant was , compared to Rus
 

Yumdoot

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I don't need to rubbish all your claims because the premise you were building was too shaky. I just said India stands to benefit if US wants to contain China. Period.
But I gave you options. Not premise.

I could argue out easily even the one you chose. But looks like you have had enough of that conquest. :)

Now how Vietnam gave China and US a bloody nose does not matter. India stands to gain by partnership with US if US wants to help India to counter China. All your examples do not pertain to the discussion. On top of that India is not a small puny country which can be compared to the above examples you cited. So, I can be kifayati because other points are useless.

Several points taken serially:

Well if Vietnam did not give them a bloody nose then why do these people remain so pissed off with Viets.

And how are you so sure of US helping us out with China containment. If containing China was the prime motive then why did they get themselves so intertwined with the Chinese. It makes little sense to finance a mercantilist Chinese currency policy and then complain that the chinese have grown too much. India's China policy cannot remain beholden to American wishes and whims. Tomorrow the Americans will again change places. Who cares for their support.

Again to repeat I did not give you options from merely the small puny sized countries. I gave you examples from among peer group with both sides occupying the either side of a continum. You can compare India with Russians or even Americans. But are not puny by any standard. That example was there for your ease too.

Common person in India may care for nothing but they love their mobile phones and technology. And US and other western countries are at the frontier of such technologies. So they may not explicitly like to go to US but would anyday prefer technology and some democracy over Russian gundaraj(Putin's slavery) and bankruptcy.
Arre bhai, every single Indian also loves Sunny Leone but that does not mean people will bring Sunny Leone into their homes.

True we buy a lot of mobiles but our people buy it only because lines of communication non-mobile times required migrants to travel. Mobiles have cut down the communication times and efforts. It is the savings in time and effort that is required and wished for and not US slavery. As you presume.

Besides even the Russians use mobiles and technology then why cannot the Americans love the Russians :devil:

Are you sure being on the same page for the time being on technology constitutes some alignment necessity.

Ok good night for today.
 

Yumdoot

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But I feel like it is necessary to stand and say it clearly that I was born in this "mitti" and die in same , serving with utmost strength.
Ditto that.:hail:

But are you sure you want to weight in.

Now they will give you a leftist tag and hold out a rightist tag as a bone to walk towards. That is demeaning and then you will have to give it back just as hard. Esp. now that you are in.
 

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