Sukhoi PAK FA

Arihant Roy

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Seems like Russians use IRST instead of DAS in front section.
Nope.

Russians also use a system which is similar to DAS in some functionalities and coverage. It's the 101 KS-U system . There are in total four apertures providing 360 degree coverage.

2 single sensor aperture just below the aft portion of cockpit facing sideways

2 twin sensors aperture. 1 under the nose and one oon the dorsal surface just forward of the twin vertical stabs.

There are two IIR sensors, KS-P which are meant for terrain following and night time flight at low levels. It provides high def IR imagery to the HUD .

What makes Su-57 special compared to both F-22 Raptors and F-35 is the presence of KS-O which is a laser based DIRCM. Two such turrets are present. This makes Felon almost invincible to the threat of IR guided Bvraam and wvraam.

The electro optical suite has been designed and developed by UOMZ .

Su-57 is in a class of its own. Better than Raptor in some respects and head and shoulders ahead of the Lightning .
 
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Arihant Roy

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We will be buying Su-57 Felon in good numbers , around 100 or even more in the next two years. After Item-30 engine completes developmental and user trials and enters operational service in 24.
 

StealthFlanker

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What makes Su-57 special compared to both F-22 Raptors and F-35 is the presence of KS-O which is a laser based DIRCM. Two such turrets are present. This makes Felon almost invincible to the threat of IR guided Bvraam and wvraam.
The electro optical suite has been designed and developed by UOMZ
Northrop Grumman actually developing a DIRCM system intended to be add to F-35 in block 5, though to be fair, the DIRCM system might not be added since the high power laser weapon will be added later on, full filling both defensive and offensive role.
ThNDR-NorthropGrumman.jpg

F-35 laser weapon.PNG


Su-57 is in a class of its own. Better than Raptor in some respects and head and shoulders ahead of the Lightning
Depending on what aspect you are talking about. In kinematic sure. In other aspect? Nope.
For example: one unique point that set F-35 apart from F-22 and Su-57 is the ability to carry self propelled jammer such as SPEAR-EW and MALD-J/V/N
 

FalconSlayers

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There are chances that we will buy the Felon? Many are saying but idk, we will need one for sure as I don’t think we have the industrial capacity to make fighter aircrafts, I mean our Tejas has been in production since 2016 yet only half of the order is complete, how are we going to make 83 MK1A, 200 MWF, 100 SPORT, 125 AMCA, ORCA etc?
 

Killbot

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There are chances that we will buy the Felon? Many are saying but idk, we will need one for sure as I don’t think we have the industrial capacity to make fighter aircrafts, I mean our Tejas has been in production since 2016 yet only half of the order is complete, how are we going to make 83 MK1A, 200 MWF, 100 SPORT, 125 AMCA, ORCA etc?
36 sport max (if any), 120 MWF, 120 AMCA and no ORCA. It's doable, considering AMCA will be assembled by Private sector, and there will be multiple production lines for Tejas 1A and MWF. As for sport, AF hasn't expressed any commitment towards it yet, so that is a big question mark.
 

Arihant Roy

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Northrop Grumman actually developing a DIRCM system intended to be add to F-35 in block 5, though to be fair, the DIRCM system might not be added since the high power laser weapon will be added later on, full filling both defensive and offensive role.
View attachment 66828
View attachment 66829


Depending on what aspect you are talking about. In kinematic sure. In other aspect? Nope.
For example: one unique point that set F-35 apart from F-22 and Su-57 is the ability to carry self propelled jammer such as SPEAR-EW and MALD-J/V/N
Am aware of the NG system. Infact NG is the first OEM to come up with DIRCM in USA. The LAIRCM for the C-17 . BAE joined the fray much later. Now we have ITT systems too

My point being Su-57 is flying with the 101KS-O since around 2013. I may be off by a year. But the thing is it's a mature system with its performance validated and proven . The Russians tried out different optics configurations on the various frames and ultimately zeroed in on the config we see in 511.

Where the DASS is better is that it's a FLIR sort of a system with high resolution. It allows the pilot to have 360 degree IR vision . The 101KS-U on the other hand is a strict missile warning system in the UV band .


There are many aspects besides kinematics . It's just a matter of time before KTRV comes up with similar systems. Even if I am to consider that KTRV doesn't come up with such a system of miniature expendable jammers and ea weapons , we will be incorporating our own variants of SAAW with the Su-57 . And a jammer based on the SAAW platform will be developed soon.

It's a matter of time before we buy the Su-57. As soon as the next chief comes in . AMCA is still some distance away.

And Berkut and Jo on Forum has deliberated extensively on the various pros and cons of Su-57 vis a vis the F-35 and F-22. I need not say anything here .
 

panzerfeist1

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Am aware of the NG system. Infact NG is the first OEM to come up with DIRCM in USA. The LAIRCM for the C-17 . BAE joined the fray much later. Now we have ITT systems too

My point being Su-57 is flying with the 101KS-O since around 2013. I may be off by a year. But the thing is it's a mature system with its performance validated and proven . The Russians tried out different optics configurations on the various frames and ultimately zeroed in on the config we see in 511.

Where the DASS is better is that it's a FLIR sort of a system with high resolution. It allows the pilot to have 360 degree IR vision . The 101KS-U on the other hand is a strict missile warning system in the UV band .


There are many aspects besides kinematics . It's just a matter of time before KTRV comes up with similar systems. Even if I am to consider that KTRV doesn't come up with such a system of miniature expendable jammers and ea weapons , we will be incorporating our own variants of SAAW with the Su-57 . And a jammer based on the SAAW platform will be developed soon.

It's a matter of time before we buy the Su-57. As soon as the next chief comes in . AMCA is still some distance away.

And Berkut and Jo on Forum has deliberated extensively on the various pros and cons of Su-57 vis a vis the F-35 and F-22. I need not say anything here .
I mean the F-35 does use flares and chaffs(have not seen that with the Su-57 AFAIK) but I think after the next gen DAS is put in we will say later equipment like a mini-missile APS and a higher power DIRCM on the F-35. The newer Su-57 versions will get newer avionics, weapons and engines so of course I cant wait for those since I sort of have an idea what they might be. They seem to have a solid path such as more of their military companies are experimenting with photonic radars, research and development of how the Klevok-D2 will exceed the performance of a 100km Hermes missile or the task of downsizing a hypersonic missile for a internal weapon configuration give us a good grasp where they might be in missile technology and also what seems to be a possible breakthrough in stealth like metamaterials offering transparency to radio waves. Since the testing is in 2022-2024 I don't know which maks airshow will show a possible display of those new things if India does reconsider or not purchasing the 2nd version
 

Arihant Roy

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I mean the F-35 does use flares and chaffs(have not seen that with the Su-57 AFAIK) but I think after the next gen DAS is put in we will say later equipment like a mini-missile APS and a higher power DIRCM on the F-35. The newer Su-57 versions will get newer avionics, weapons and engines so of course I cant wait for those since I sort of have an idea what they might be. They seem to have a solid path such as more of their military companies are experimenting with photonic radars, research and development of how the Klevok-D2 will exceed the performance of a 100km Hermes missile or the task of downsizing a hypersonic missile for a internal weapon configuration give us a good grasp where they might be in missile technology and also what seems to be a possible breakthrough in stealth like metamaterials offering transparency to radio waves. Since the testing is in 2022-2024 I don't know which maks airshow will show a possible display of those new things if India does reconsider or not purchasing the 2nd version
The F-35 uses a towed decoy system . It is incorporated in the ventral surface or rather the belly and has its own LO doors . A very clever system.

Klevok D2 will strictly be ground based. Work has just started on it . There is a compact hypersonic a2g missile which can be carried internally already in the works for Su-57. Then there are ultra long range air to air missiles . Iz810 which will outrange even the much vaunted but now cancelled TTT missile of the USAF .

The Su-57 has a hell lot of advantages over both the F-22 and F-35 .
 

StealthFlanker

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Klevok D2 will strictly be ground based. Work has just started on it . There is a compact hypersonic a2g missile which can be carried internally already in the works for Su-57. Then there are ultra long range air to air missiles . Iz810 which will outrange even the much vaunted but now cancelled TTT missile of the USAF .
Triple target terminator or T-3 is a technology demonstration program and not a weapon program, it wasn't cancelled, it reached the end. What was cancelled is the NGM. There are 2 others Ultra long range air to air missile in the development for USA F-35 and F-22, which is LREW (long range engagement weapon) and AIM-260 Joint Advanced Tactical Missile , it is uncertain if Iz810 can out range them or not. Outside US, F-35 also integrated with Meteor which has insane range thanks to its 12:1 turn down ratio and ramjet engine. And there is JNAAM which is basically Meteor with AESA seeker.
 
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Arihant Roy

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Triple target terminator or T-3 is a technology demonstration program and not a weapon program, it wasn't cancelled, it reached the end. What was cancelled is the NGM. There are 2 others Ultra long range air to air missile in the development for USA F-35 and F-22, which is LREW (long range engagement weapon) and AIM-260 Joint Advanced Tactical Missile , it is uncertain if Iz810 can out range them or not. Outside US, F-35 also integrated with Meteor which has insane range thanks to its 12:1 turn down ratio and ramjet engine. And there is JNAAM which is basically Meteor with AESA seeker.
The tech proven out and validated in TTT will ultimately find their way in AIM-260 or LREW. Or some future Bvraam.

The Ruskies have done quite some work on the ramjet variant of R-77M. And the new R-77M is said to have a longer range than AIM-120D. You may argue about the range but the actual range will be equal to if not less than the D. The jointly developed SFDR will soon find its way into an all new air to air missile . It's a JV between NPO Mashinostroyeni and DRDO. So it's just a matter of time .

The Russians have already demonstrated the presence of CUDA /Peregrine sized missiles . Or rather the missile came to the fore during the celebrations in KTRV of their founding anniversary.
 

panzerfeist1

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Current sources of the k-77m have shown 193kms so I am assuming the ramjet version will be significantly more. The only reason I have brought up the klevok-d2 is that its speeds are estimated higher than Hermes with twice the payload weight and more than 50% range increase while the f-35 displays new missile projects I am just rubbing my hands in anticipation of the new weapons from the 2nd su-57 variant.
 

Lancer

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We will be buying Su-57 Felon in good numbers , around 100 or even more in the next two years. After Item-30 engine completes developmental and user trials and enters operational service in 24.
Are you sure? That would be excellent. Absolutely necessary and practical - for several reasons.
 

panzerfeist1

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Although this might be old information, I see it as something rather crucial and I dont think it was announced here but it is now worth bringing up. Су-57 — круговое зрение и 10 тонн вооружения | Авиация России (aviation21.ru)

"He explains that the aircraft has already received six fundamentally new missiles, and by 2020 it will receive six more. Four missile samples are placed inside the fuselage in a special compartment. New air-to-air missiles are: RVV-MD (short-range), SD (medium-range) and DB (long-range). In total, more than 10 new models of aircraft weapons have been developed for the Su-57.

Borisov Obnosov clarifies, without naming specific figures, that the range of missiles for the Su-57 exceeds the previously created samples twice. And this is a very good result, especially since to reduce the visibility of missiles on them, as well as on the Su-57 itself, a special radio absorbing coating is applied."


So every air to air missile(RVV-MD,SD and DB) and air to ground missile that has been deemed as new back in February 2018 when his announcement came out as in the aircraft having fundamentally new weapons he announced that there will be 6 more newer ones.

Air-to-air guided missile RVV-MD | Catalog Rosoboronexport (roe.ru) and Air-to-air missile RVV-SD | Catalog Rosoboronexport (roe.ru) RVV-BD (K-37M not available for export) He included these 3 existing air to air missiles that already existed with the Su-57 So I am assuming the other 3 that existed are more than likely air to ground missiles. I believe that the ramjet version of K-77M will be twice the range of export RVV-SD because the K-77M currently has a 193km range claim.

Sukhoi Su-57 - Wikipedia The only 3 air to ground missiles that stick out to me are the kh-58,35 and 59 which were considered new as of feb 2018(latest variants) will have twice the ranges which will also more than likely mean more speed. kh-59mk2(domestic) is like 550kms subsonic speeds, Anti-radiation missile Kh-58UShKE | Catalog Rosoboronexport (roe.ru) this 2007 missile with barely any changes in range and speeds even with later variants might have double ranges therefore increased speeds. Kh-35 - Wikipedia the kh-35U was fundamentally new for the Su-57. The previous created samples are the newest ones(therefore latest variants) that have existed pre feb-2018 since his announcement so the multiply range twice 6 new missiles are probably what's going to be on the 2nd variant 2022-2024 Su-57(was going to get newer weapons anyways) during its testing with new avionics and engines assuming Borisov Obnosov the CEO of tactical missiles was not drunk off his ass talking to reporters.
 

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