Sukhoi PAK FA

Austin

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Look at more recent developments and working ahead from UAC

UAC :: Strategy/Plans of Development :: Main Provisions of the Development Strategy of JSC "UAC"

Also from recent statements from Medvedev

Medvedev Calls for Civil Aerospace Shake-Up | Russia | RIA Novosti

Speaking at a goverment meeting, Medvedev said Russian airlines need to take delivery on around 1,300 aircraft in the period to 2020 and that obsolescence is an increasing problem. The average age of Russia's civil aircraft is 17 years, he added.

"On the world aviation market, Russia as a whole is not in a bad position, partly because of what we've done in the last few years," he said. "We are in the top three, but that's not a God-given placing and we need to get stronger, and of course we should get civil aviation technology moving," he said. "In all, the state program plans production of 3,300 airplanes and 5,500 helicopters for civilian and military aviation, and also 33,000 aircraft-engines," he said.
 

average american

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Indian Air Force lost 30 fighter aircraft, 10 choppers in three years Track record so far not so good. Indian Air Force lost 30 fighter aircraft, 10 choppers in three years
Indian Air Force (IAF) has lost a total 30 plus fighter aircraft and 10 helicopters in crashes in last three years which left 26 defence personnel including 13 pilots dead, government told the Lok Sabha today.

When consulted about the high MiG-21 accident rate, Russia pointed out that India had insisted on manufacturing many of the spare parts needed to keep MiG-21s operational, and many of these parts were not manufactured to Russian specifications. While Russia does not have a reputation for making the highest quality equipment, their standards are often higher than India's. It's no secret that much of the military equipment made in India is pretty shabby by world standards.

Source: NEW DELHI - 12 December 2011 - The Economic Times News
 

WMD

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Indian Air Force lost 30 fighter aircraft, 10 choppers in three years Track record so far not so good. Indian Air Force lost 30 fighter aircraft, 10 choppers in three years
Indian Air Force (IAF) has lost a total 30 plus fighter aircraft and 10 helicopters in crashes in last three years which left 26 defence personnel including 13 pilots dead, government told the Lok Sabha today.

When consulted about the high MiG-21 accident rate, Russia pointed out that India had insisted on manufacturing many of the spare parts needed to keep MiG-21s operational, and many of these parts were not manufactured to Russian specifications. While Russia does not have a reputation for making the highest quality equipment, their standards are often higher than India's. It's no secret that much of the military equipment made in India is pretty shabby by world standards.

Source: NEW DELHI - 12 December 2011 - The Economic Times News
and how many F-22s u hav lost since induction,
In April 1992, the second YF-22 crashed while landing at Edwards Air Force Base, California. The test pilot, Tom Morgenfeld, escaped without injury. The cause of the crash was found to be a flight control software error that failed to prevent a pilot-induced oscillation.[277]

The first crash of a production F-22 occurred during takeoff at Nellis Air Force Base on 20 December 2004, in which the pilot ejected safely before impact.[278][279] The crash investigation revealed that a brief interruption in power during an engine shutdown prior to flight caused a malfunction in the flight-control system;[280] consequently the aircraft design was corrected to avoid the problem. All F-22s were grounded after the crash; operations resumed following a review.[281]

On 25 March 2009, an F-22 crashed 35 miles (56 km) northeast of Edwards Air Force Base during a test flight,[282] resulting in the death of Lockheed test pilot David P. Cooley.[45][283] An Air Force Materiel Command investigation found that Cooley momentarily lost consciousness during a high-G maneuver, then ejected when he found himself too low to recover. Cooley was killed during ejection by blunt-force trauma from the aircraft's speed and the windblast. The investigation found no issues with the F-22's design.[284]

On 16 November 2010, an F-22, based at Elmendorf, Alaska, lost contact with Air Traffic Control.[285] The aircraft was discovered to have crashed; the pilot, Captain Jeffrey Haney, was killed.[286] The F-22 fleet was restricted to flying below 25,000 feet, before being grounded completely, while the accident was investigated.[287] During the summer of 2011, more wreckage from the crash site was recovered; the accident has been attributed to a malfunction in the bleed air system that shut down the aircraft's Environmental Control System (ECS) and On-Board Oxygen Generating System (OBOGS).[288] The OBOGS, which is fed by engine bleed air, was apparently shut down automatically in response to an engine overheat condition detected by the main computer.[289] The accident review board, however, ruled the pilot (wearing bulky cold-weather gear and nightvision goggles) was to blame for the accident, as he did not react properly and did not engage the emergency oxygen system.[290][291] Schwartz has called the Pentagon Office of the Inspector General investigation of the report "routine",[292][293] but did not assign blame to the pilot.[294] The pilot's widow sued, claiming the aircraft has defective equipment.[295][296] In response to the accident investigation results, the engagement handle for the emergency oxygen system was redesigned to improve location and grasping, and the emergency oxygen system should engage automatically when OBOGS is shut down due to an engine failure.[297] The aircraft's manufacturers reached a settlement with the pilot's family.[298] On 11 February 2013, the DoD's Inspector General released its report on its investigation, finding that the USAF had erred in assigning blame to Haney for the crash and stated that the USAF's conclusions were contradictory, incomplete, or "not supported by facts." In response, the USAF stated that it stood by its accident investigation conclusions.[299]

On 15 November 2012, an F-22 crashed near Tyndall Air Force Base, just south of Panama City, Florida. The pilot ejected safely and no injuries were reported on the ground. The cause of the accident is unknown.[300][301]

On 7 December 2012, an F-22 from the 199th Fighter Squadron sustained $1.8 million in damage to its horizontal stabilizers while landing at Joint Base Pearl Harbor-Hickam. The aircraft was returning from participating in a missing-man formation at a memorial event commemorating the attack on Pearl Harbor.[302][303]

Lockheed Martin F-22 Raptor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 

A chauhan

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@Mods,

Some underestimating Americans have sh!tted this thread, please delete OTs & chest thumping posts.
 

average american

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It has been recognized since the time of ancient Greece that people have a tendency to react badly to a person who delivers bad news, especially when the person who actually caused the unwanted event is not accessible or when the calamity is a natural occurrence.

"shooting the messenger" is an automatic response,
 

A chauhan

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It has been recognized since the time of ancient Greece that people have a tendency to react badly to a person who delivers bad news, especially when the person who actually caused the unwanted event is not accessible or when the calamity is a natural occurrence.

"shooting the messenger" is an automatic response,
I am not asking to shoot you but your unnecessary criticism of Russian tech and US chest thumping which is simply irritating and off topic as well.
 

shuvo@y2k10

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Well for a new aircraft like f22 it has a very high crash rate.also this thread was for disscussion of pak-fa.Some american members are turning this thread into some sort of personal vendetta against russian deefence products.For them my advice is to open a new thread just to satisfy their hatred for russian and leave threads like these for some serious discusions.
 

lookieloo

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It has been recognized since the time of ancient Greece that people have a tendency to react badly to a person who delivers bad news, especially when the person who actually caused the unwanted event is not accessible or when the calamity is a natural occurrence.

"shooting the messenger" is an automatic response,
Again, you need to chill. Most of the information on PAK-FA (for or against) is drivel conjured forth by over-nationalistic fanboys. Very little is actually known about it, and most of that comes from whatever the Russians feel like telling us. When India gets its hands on a prototype, we'll know more. Until then, there's no point in trying to bruise egos just because everyone gives you a hard time about the F-35/F-22 (which have to deal with their problems in public).
 
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average american

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Will be a common occurance with a plane going through midlevel testing. I am not critical of the T50 or PAK FA as much as I am skeptical of the technological/industrial/research ability of Russia to build advanced aircraft or even support with quality spare parts the ones they have now. A good example is the TU160 Tu-160 Dying From Spares Shortage or indian/russian submarines StrategyPage Error Page 2 notice I dont just rely on my opinion or what I want to believe.

Warplanes: India Battles Russia Over Quality Control

India Battles Russia Over Quality Control
Next Article → NAVAL AIR: Robotic Little Bird Goes To Sea

August 21, 2012: India has made public yet another complaint about the Su-30 fighters it buys from Russia. This time it's an unspecified "design flaw" in the electronic flight control system for the aircraft. This bit of information was made public because India has found that more discreet communications about these matters results in little or no action from the Russians.
 

lookieloo

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Another malfunction has been seen in the f-35 engine and the entire f-35 fleet is grounded.Maybe the americans in this thread should look in their own backyard and stop criticising others.

Pentagon grounds its entire fleet of F35 fighter jets - The Times of India
I know, I know... woe is us (insert requisite weeping and gnashing of teeth here). :sarcastic: Us F-35 customers get to read about it all, every test-point in Codeone and every problem Aviation Week.

By contrast, a search for "t-50" on Sukhoi's own website produces this>> Sukhoi Company (JSC) - Search

And a search for "pak-fa" produces likewise>> Sukhoi Company (JSC) - Search

Nary a word but this>> Sukhoi Company (JSC) - News - News
Hell, that's no more detail than what was available on the F-35 back in 1996, before the prototypes were even built. Lockheed can only dream about this level of un-accountability.

So yes, I agree that "[A]mericans in this thread should look in their own backyard and stop criticising others," but I also take comfort in the fact that we are at least allowed to look in our "back yard."

Back to business: Here's something I came across the other day on the Fixed-wing antenna array (L-band?) http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,15626.msg170589.html#msg170589 Maybe someone with more technical expertise could explain it to us.
 

shuvo@y2k10

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There are several problems with f-35 which the americans here might agree.One of them is the very ambitious fact that it intended to develop a 3 in one fighter.Another is what i don't really understand the logic of a one engine fighter especially when all the other fifth gen projects are twin engines(chinese j20,j-18 ,pak-fa,f22,amca etc). Even the f-18 which the f-35 is supposed to repalce is twin engine.Also i would also likely to contest any claim that americans are open to criticism when it comes to huge military wasteful expenditure.The f-35 is getting a huge public criticism because from the right from the word go it was an international programme and international partners are now having second thoughts about walking out of the programme.We have also seen several independent aviation expert criticising f22 for it's low sortie rate,poor quality ram and other factors but the pentagon has managed to keep those criticism under raps from widespread media scutiny.same is the case with future combat system program and land warrior programme which has to finally cancelled due to huge cost overruns and unrealistic targets and these programmes have also never received widespread media scrutiny.
 

Daredevil

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Guys, please stick to the topic - PAK-FA fighter. For other issues use related threads or open a new thread. Anymore off-topic posts will be deleted.
 

p2prada

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By contrast, a search for "t-50" on Sukhoi's own website produces this>> Sukhoi Company (JSC) - Search

And a search for "pak-fa" produces likewise>> Sukhoi Company (JSC) - Search
Don't see what's the big deal there. Until recently you couldn't find any information on LCA on the web by the govt.

Hell, that's no more detail than what was available on the F-35 back in 1996, before the prototypes were even built. Lockheed can only dream about this level of un-accountability.
This has nothing to do with accountability. I doubt the American public have any kind of voice in DoD's projects, regardless of how well or how badly the JSF performs.

Back to business: Here's something I came across the other day on the Fixed-wing antenna array (L-band?) http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,15626.msg170589.html#msg170589 Maybe someone with more technical expertise could explain it to us.
Should be used as an IFF. Perhaps meant to take the load off the main sensor.

There is a chance the L band arrays in the main sensor will be used for volume scan while the L band array in the wings are used as IFF.

Anyway, some possibilities listed by APA.

http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-2009-06.html
 

Austin

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Russia, India Describe Next-Gen Fighter Plans

The air force commanders of both Russia and India have this month discussed the progress and future schedule of the fifth-generation Sukhoi fighter project. They are keen to have their own pilots evaluate the design so that they can take a decision on further funding for the project.

Russian air force commander Gen. Victor Bondarev said that he expects all four flyable prototypes of the so-called PAKFA (Future Aviation Complex of Frontal Aviation) to gather at the defense ministry's test base and firing range near Akhtubinsk in Southern Russia, for customer assessment and weapons release trials. By the year-end their number shall increase to eight. If tests are a success, the PAKFA will go into series production in late 2015 or early 2016.

In his turn, Indian air force chief of staff told journalists at the recent Aero India show that he expects arrival of three PAKFA development prototypes in India, the first in 2015, the second in 2017 and the third in 2018. Air Marshall N. A. K. Browne said that the design and development phase of what India calls the Fifth Generation Fighter Aircraft (FGFA) is proceeding well under "a small-value contract." When it is completed later this year, India and Russia will sign a new R&D contract "which is the mother of all phases," he added.

Should India be satisfied with flight performance of the FGFA, it will fund the next phase: creation of a customized version for the Indian air force by a joint team of Russian and Indian engineers. The Indian version would use same airframe, engines and main systems, and differ in mission hardware and software, as well as weapons nomenclature. Series airframes manufacturing would commence at Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) in 2022, Browne added.

At Aero India, United Aircraft Corporation's president Mikhail Pogosyan said that Russia and India would buy "over 400" aircraft and that the total market would exceed 600. He confirmed that all four prototypes built to date are now in flight test, and said that additional development aircraft will be completed "as necessary, after the two sides sign the full-scale development contract."

Pogosyan further insisted that both Russian and Indian versions "will be based not only on the same platform, but also have identical onboard systems and avionics." Indian air force specialists had been involved in working out specification to the aircraft "from the very beginning and through all development phases." He continued, "It may happen that in future there will be some specific [national] requirements for onboard systems or additional missions, but these would be formally agreed by both customers." Pogosyan expects the FGFA to follow the Su-30MKI/MKM example, in which "the Indian and Malaysian air forces use the very same platform, with the difference confined to a few avionics items."
 

Austin

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This should end speculations on which engine will go on PMF.
There was never any to start with , Engine for PAK-FA for Russian and Indian will be 117 Saturn engine since a lot of flight testing , reliability and proven part has taken around this engine and stuff like engine life , maintenance ,TBO etc for aircraft and engine will happen post induction in RuAF when that happens in 2016.

In 2022 when FGFA will start entering squadron service with IAF it would have all those Engine and Aircraft data in hand to establish best practises for maintnance , TBO etc from RuAF.

In the mean while 2nd stage engine Id 30 would come around by end of this decade and it will go through its own flight test program , the basis of 2nd stage engine for PAK-FA and FGFA mark 2 model will form around next decade.
 

p2prada

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There was never any to start with , Engine for PAK-FA for Russian and Indian will be 117 Saturn engine since a lot of flight testing , reliability and proven part has taken around this engine and stuff like engine life , maintenance ,TBO etc for aircraft and engine will happen post induction in RuAF when that happens in 2016.

In 2022 when FGFA will start entering squadron service with IAF it would have all those Engine and Aircraft data in hand to establish best practises for maintnance , TBO etc from RuAF.

In the mean while 2nd stage engine Id 30 would come around by end of this decade and it will go through its own flight test program , the basis of 2nd stage engine for PAK-FA and FGFA mark 2 model will form around next decade.
This is the first I've heard of a FGFA Mk2.

Anyway, since our version will take off in squadrons only after 2022, then why not start with Item 30 since the beginning.
 

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