Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Engine

Blackwater

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NEW DELHI: Sukhoi-30 MKI, the most powerful and modern fighter jets in Indian Air Force's stable, has been hit by mid-air engine failures. Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar said in Parliament today that as many as 35 instances of engine failures were reported in 2013-14 - that's nearly three a month.

In all, there are 69 instances of engine failure in the last four years, the minister said. Inquiries by the Air Force have revealed that in as many as 33 instances, the engines failed because of impure fuel, in another 11 cases, the problem was caused by excessive vibration and in eight others, engine failures were reported because of low pressure in the lubricant tanks, the Defence Minister said. About five SU-30 MKI have crashed since 2009.

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Like all twin-engine jets, the Russian made Su-30s are capable of landing on a single engine. But to reach its maximum potential of carrying a total eight tones of payload including bombs, missiles and spare fuel tanks, the jet needs both its AL-31FP engines to function.

Engine failures is fast becoming a major concern for Air Force and also puts a question mark on India's ability to defend its skies. Another problem area that senior Air Force officers point out is serviceability. "Serviceability of the aircraft is about 50 per cent only," an officer said. It means at any given time, roughly half out of a fleet of 200 jets are available for operational purposes. This becomes crucial in times of emergencies like war.

Mr Parrikar said that the engines were scheduled to be overhauled after every 1000 hours of flying, but the defects started showing-up after only 500 hours of flying. The minister said that Russia-based NPO Saturn, manufacturers of Su-30 Al-31FP engines, offered to make "nine technological improvements" during overhauls, and added that after the modifications the engines were flying for upto 900 hours.

To address the growing capability gap, especially that created by increasing obsolescence of MiG-21, India is talking to France to buy 126 medium multi-role Rafale fighter jets. But the negotiations have been dragging on for three years. Although the acquisition has got mired on per unit cost and number of man hours required to produce it in India, a resolution of these issue can be expected when Prime Minister Narendra Modi visits France in April.

Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Engine Trouble
 

Blackwater

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng

array engine kaise chalegi, blades to HAL ka engg chori kar gayii


kyo

@sgarg
@bangloreon
@rock127

kya isme british saaazih ha?? font theek ha:taunt::taunt::taunt:
 
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sgarg

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng

Look at the reasons: bad fuel, low pressure of lubricant etc. The report does not talk about blades missing.

Water seepage in fuel storage tanks must be investigated.
Consumption of lubricant may be higher in India due to higher dust content in local air.

The reasons of engine failure must be thoroughly investigated and their causes should be removed.

Why Sukhoi are only failing in IAF service and not in service of other countries? We need to know.

The solution is not buying another plane if Su-30 fleet has problems, but fixing the problems.

If IAF keeps on having this attitude of blaming others for its own ills then I see IAF reducing in significance. Its capital budget will be reduced. Next will be forced changes in the organization itself.
 

sgarg

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng

My fear is that same will happen to Rafale also what is happening to Su-30.

As the technology improves, the equipment becomes more sophisticated requiring changes in handling and maintenance.
 

Kunal Biswas

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng

It is best to replace its engines with more efficient western engines, Like F-110 ..

In near future SU-30 will take place of infamous MIG-21s, If its engine issues are not solved ..

Rafale has very uncertain future, Its Tejas on the clock ..
 

Kunal Biswas

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng



Budget allocation for Air-force, Source Broadsword ..
 

Blackwater

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng

My fear is that same will happen to Rafale also what is happening to Su-30.

As the technology improves, the equipment becomes more sophisticated requiring changes in handling and maintenance.
this is where dassault has disagreement on the deal with HAL. Indian govt want HAL should do all repair and maintenance and assembly work with HAL supervisor and dassault knew if that happens, rafale will be another mig 21:p:p:p
 

sgarg

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng

this is where dassault has disagreement on the deal with HAL. Indian govt want HAL should do all repair and maintenance and assembly work with HAL supervisor and dassault knew if that happens, rafale will be another mig 21:p:p:p
I would be worried about IAF's own technicians.
"chips" in the oil; running Arjun tank is first gear excessively: these instances do not inspire confidence, do they??
 

sgarg

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng

It is best to replace its engines with more efficient western engines, Like F-110 ..

In near future SU-30 will take place of infamous MIG-21s, If its engine issues are not solved ..

Rafale has very uncertain future, Its Tejas on the clock ..
Su-30 is a fine plane. The problem is IAF. No other user of Su-27/Su-30 reporting such problems.
 

akshay m

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng

Su-30 is a fine plane. The problem is IAF. No other user of Su-27/Su-30 reporting such problems.
aye aye,

absolutely correct


33 yinjin failures due to impure oil:drunk2:
 
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akshay m

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng

It is best to replace its engines with more efficient western engines, Like F-110 ..

In near future SU-30 will take place of infamous MIG-21s, If its engine issues are not solved ..

Rafale has very uncertain future, Its Tejas on the clock ..

i beleive western engines are also not immune to impure oil.



33 failures due to impure oil is no small number.
 
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sgarg

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng

@akshay m, I hope they fix it, whatever it is. It will be a tragedy if low quality oil is being purchased by IAF for such an expensive plane. I just hope and pray that is not the case.
 
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Aravind Sanjeev

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng

33 engine failures due to impure oil?
I like how IAF risk lives. By the way, I don't think western engines are good at running with impure oil and Rafael is never going to be an answer for this. Rafael is a fourth generation fighter yet. Also getting depended on western goods is a bad idea (although US is India's largest defense importer). I think we should stick with our privileged relation with Russia.


i beleive western engines are also not immune to impure oil.

i wonder how long it will take for the iaf to break the 0 crash record of tejas, with impure oil

33 failures due to impure oil is no small number.
Sukhoi Su-30MKI is a heavy, all-weather, long-range fighter but Tejas is light combat aircraft. They serve different purpose and both seems equally important. Although even if Tejas pass the test, we will still need to find a Sukhoi alternative or a re-materialized Sukhoi engine working good with impure oil.

By the way, I post once an year. :mad:
 

Blackwater

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng

I would be worried about IAF's own technicians.
"chips" in the oil; running Arjun tank is first gear excessively: these instances do not inspire confidence, do they??
Su-30 is a fine plane. The problem is IAF. No other user of Su-27/Su-30 reporting such problems.

HAL and DRDO should be privatize immediately
 

Compersion

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng

make use of more automation.

HAL can use outsourcing to private industry -> make in india.
 

rock127

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng

[SUB][/SUB]
array engine kaise chalegi, blades to HAL ka engg chori kar gayii
kyo

@sgarg @Bangalorean
@rock127

kya isme british saaazih ha?? font theek ha:taunt::taunt:
Yes... British stole our Blueprint of Udan Khatola which we made 10000 of years ago and now we have to start from the scratch. :sad:

Once a thief ... always a thief.What are you doing there in the land of thieves? :dude:

Galee galee mein shor hai... Angrez 1 number ka chor hai. :taunt:




@Bangalorean
 
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Kunal Biswas

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng

How many air-force are out their who grease their aircraft to spare parts ..

In simple words, collect the data of sortie rate made of IAF compare to any other ..

------------
@Twinblade

Su-30 is a fine plane. The problem is IAF. No other user of Su-27/Su-30 reporting such problems.
 
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sgarg

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng

How many air-force are out their who grease their aircraft to spare parts ..

In simple words, collect the data of sortie rate made of IAF compare to any other ..
Sortie rate cannot be the reason. The spares requirements can be planned in advance. Same with overhaul.

Su-30 is flying in IAF since 1999. Fifteen years is a long time to understand the dynamics of the fleet. If the availability is at 50% after 15 years of operations, then it indicates systemic problems. These systemic problems may be originating in IAF, HAL or GOI, but these problems are there for sure.

I would like to see an IAF that fights to right the system. It cannot be the attitude - give be plane B because plane A is bad. Why cann't you fix the situation with plane A? And if you cannot fix plane A, what confidence is there with plane B?

Su-30 is a plane that IAF wanted. It was not forced on it. We are not dealing with USSR anymore.

It is nice to have Western planes but the rationale has to be broader, and whatever is bought must be supportable.

What is coming out from DM is that Su-30 has diverse suppliers. Some of the equipment is unique to MKI and planning and procurement of such items is clearly IAF's job.

DM has said how engine issues have been sorted out. Proactive planning is needed to sort out all issues in a similar manner.
 

Kunal Biswas

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Re: Sukhoi-30 MKI, Air Force's Most Modern Fighter Jet, Plagued by Eng

If you don`t know what is A and B then its better not to talk about it ..

Men in gear does not works according to our believes, Check out your basics before getting into deep ..


Sortie rate cannot be the reason.

These systemic problems may be originating in IAF, HAL or GOI, but these problems are there for sure.

I would like to see an IAF that fights to right the system. It cannot be the attitude - give be plane B because plane A is bad. Why cann't you fix the situation with plane A? And if you cannot fix plane A, what confidence is there with plane B?

Su-30 is a plane that IAF wanted. It was not forced on it. We are not dealing with USSR anymore.

It is nice to have Western planes but the rationale has to be broader, and whatever is bought must be supportable.

What is coming out from DM is that Su-30 has diverse suppliers. Some of the equipment is unique to MKI and planning and procurement of such items is clearly IAF's job.
 

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