Small arms and Light Weapons

[Scalieback]

You can give me a link if you like. I really do not know much about British L1A1.

I know the difference between the FN-FAL and the Indian SLR, which is an FN-FAL clone, but the parts are not interchangeable.

The primary difference is on the selector switch which only had safe and s/auto. No full auto fire on the L1A1 SLR (apart from a very, very few models).

The firing pin is also different. It's in two parts for reliability ie breaks less.

The flash eliminator was designed for the energa grenade launcher, albeit IIRC the FAL would take it: ENERGA anti-tank rifle grenade - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Channels in the bolt carrier to allow easier removal of sand from the working parts.

Cocking handle folds in so it doesn't poke you in the ribs etc.

Some FALs had the Brit mods, but not all and obviously the FAL was fully auto.

Clearly, as the L1A1 was manufactured in England (and Australia, Canada etc) it was far better quality than that from Belgium

I'm also sure someone will say it was bought with money raped from India as well

 

[pmaitra]

No full auto fire on the L1A1 SLR (apart from a very, very few models).

Good decision to not have full-auto. The Argentinians had full-auto. We know who did better.

Clearly, as the L1A1 was manufactured in England (and Australia, Canada etc) it was far better quality than that from Belgium

Just like the Indian 7.62 mm NATO SMLE was of better quality than the British .303 SMLE.

<just pulling you leg, but it's true>

 

[Scalieback]

Good decision to not have full-auto. The Argentinians had full-auto. We know who did better.

Full auto is a 'nice to have' but on a rifle firing 7.62 x 51, it's useful in a few circumstances. It's the reason why you have support weapons (of the time such as gpmg). Argies still want the islands though

Just like the Indian 7.62 mm NATO SMLE was of better quality than the British .303 SMLE.

Having fired both I'd disagree. Workmanship on the Indian 7.62 SMLE's was frankly very poor on those that I saw and fired. You may not know but I shoot a .303 SMLE so I'm pretty up to speed on its good and bad points. I was thinking of getting one when they came over here about eight years ago or so.

<just pulling you leg, but it's true>

See above. No problem with leg pulling at all. My SMLE is S African as well, not built in the UK

I'll try and refrain from comments on Indian workmanship Just what I've seen and used

 

[Kunal Biswas]

AK47, reliable. Can't hit a barn door at 300m. That's with a solid stock, with one of the folding abominations ......

AK74, same as its older brother

Tavor, never fired it. Not heard anything good or adverse.

AK-74 can hit 300m with ease..

TAR-21 is very reliable almost as a AK, accurate at ranges of 350m, But its maintenance is not the same as AK..

 

[pack leader]

my dear British friend Scalieback
the L85 is an unreliable expensive rifle
you never managed to sell a single piece on the open market

 

[pmaitra]

Having fired both I'd disagree. Workmanship on the Indian 7.62 SMLE's was frankly very poor on those that I saw and fired. You may not know but I shoot a .303 SMLE so I'm pretty up to speed on its good and bad points. I was thinking of getting one when they came over here about eight years ago or so.

Indian 7.62 mm SMLEs have better steel and better heat treatment than British .303 SMLEs. Looks wise, yes, they won't win accolades. India never really cared about looks as all production was meant for domestic use. Speaking of that, even the earlier version of our INSAS were pretty rough in looks. The point is, as long as it gets the job done.

 

[pmaitra]

For the newcomers, if you haven't voted yet, please vote. I have reopened the poll.

Thanks!

 

[Kunal Biswas]

A Magpul CTR stock on AK

Problem with the aesthetics of the stock that came on the rifle.I prefer a shorter stock..

Photo 1 – a close-up of the finished conversion. The buffer tube was cut so that when the CTR is fully collapsed, there is very little gap between stock and folding mechanism. Not only did this keep the length to absolute minimum with the stock collapsed, but IMO created a clean look too.

Photo 2 – Top view. The top of the CTR is wider and more rounded, providing a comfortable cheek weld.

Photo 3 – Stock folded, which works out fine with no optic attached to the rail.

Photo 4 – Close-up, right side.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

The next series of photos show the difference between the original and ACE/Magpul conversion. I zip-tied the original stock to the CTR and tried to position it as close as possible to where it would actually sit installed.

This photo illustrates a few reasons for my decision to do the conversion; (1) I attained a shorter pull, even with the Magpul recoil pad installed; (2) the height of the CTR stock is better suited for the optics I use; (3) I found the way the original stock protrudes on the bottom of the butt end was very uncomfortable. In comparison, the CTR tapers forward at the bottom, which I find far more comfortable.

Seen from the other side. The way the butt on the CTR stock angles forward on the bottom, in combination with its much larger contact area with the shoulder and recoil pad made a HUGE difference to me. The rifle is now truly a pleasure to shoot!

The difference in butt size between the two stocks.

Originally from:
http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=97676

 

[pmaitra]

I have one thing to add. I recently shot an AKM with fibre waffle magazine. The steel magazine is way better.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

I have one thing to add. I recently shot an AKM with fibre waffle magazine. The steel magazine is way better.

Fiber is used to reduce weight of overall Rifle weight..

 

[pmaitra]

I see. Makes sense.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

 

[Scalieback]

AK-74 can hit 300m with ease..

TAR-21 is very reliable almost as a AK, accurate at ranges of 350m, But its maintenance is not the same as AK..

It can. However, the design doesn't lend itself to accuracy. Having fired many firearms including 47's, 74's, M4's, M16's etc I know which are more accurate

 

[Scalieback]

my dear British friend Scalieback
the L85 is an unreliable expensive rifle
you never managed to sell a single piece on the open market

Reliability. The trials on the A2 revealed it was the most reliable 5.56 rifle tested. Ex Narine from memory. Just type' L85A2 trials' into google. As I said, it has inherited reliablity views from the problems with the A1. The A2 is reliable and believe me, if it wasn't with the way things have been on mil eqpt recently, there would have been MP's questions, newspaper articles etc.

They haven't sold much at all I agree. It is overpriced for what it is.

It's not 'me' btw. I'm not British Aerospace same as you're not IMI.

 

[Scalieback]

Indian 7.62 mm SMLEs have better steel and better heat treatment than British .303 SMLEs. Looks wise, yes, they won't win accolades. India never really cared about looks as all production was meant for domestic use. Speaking of that, even the earlier version of our INSAS were pretty rough in looks. The point is, as long as it gets the job done.

I agree, but looks are what sells something in the first place. Did you get your girlfriend by looks or some other means?

 

[Kunal Biswas]

It can. However, the design doesn't lend itself to accuracy. Having fired many firearms including 47's, 74's, M4's, M16's etc I know which are more accurate

That is true when compare to the deign of other rifles, But Russian were here in India and they were using AK-74 also Insas, there accuracy and grouping was no less impressive..

 

[Scalieback]

That is true when compare to the deign of other rifles, But Russian were here in India and they were using AK-74 also Insas, there accuracy and grouping was no less impressive..

Bench testing is the only way to reliably get consistent results. If a 'bog standard' AK74 beat a 'bog standard' M16A3 at 300m, I'd be very surprised.

 

[Damian]

12.05.2012 - Telewizja Polska SA

A Polish TV documentary Nasza Armia (Our Army) showing new weapons like MSBS assault rifle (soon final pre production configuration will be shown on MSPO 2012), SBAO-40 granade launcher, there is mentioned work for new military pistol and is shown P99 Rad a modified Polish version of Walther P99. Also 40mm programmable ammunition for granade launchers is shown, and many more. Sorry for lack of translation, but images are worth to watch.

Note : All equipment and weapons are 100% Polish made, only P99 Rad as I said, is a modified Walther P99 pistol, however uniforms use Multicam camouflage scheme.

 

[SPIEZ]

Okay, in comparison to other rifles; not just bullpups:



AK47, reliable. Can't hit a barn door at 300m. That's with a solid stock, with one of the folding abominations ......

AK74, same as its older brother

L1A1, nice for it's time. Much more modern kit out there

H&K 416, gimme

SIG 556/2, just feels like a toy. No operational use. Doesn't have the rails for bells and whistles. Accurate, light and reliable though.

All the guns above guns have a same and similar action to that of the infamous AK.
SiG uses the same AK mechanism.
Add HK416, uses the short stroke piston, instead of the long stroke piston a la AK.
IMO, it's the callibre that gives the rifle accuracy and recoil.

All the other guns use 5.56 except for the AK's, and that might be the cause of the problem