Saudis parade N-missiles in defiance of US-Iran accord

[amoy]

Saudis parade nuclear missiles for the first time in defiance of US-Iranian nuclear accord
DEBKAfile Special Report April 29, 2014, 10:49 PM (IDT) Tags: Saudi nuclear, Iran nuclear, Middle East war, US-Iran, negotiations,

DF-3 nuclear missiles at Saudi military parade

Saudi Arabia became the first Middle East nation to publicly exhibit its nuclear-capable missiles. The long-range, liquid propellant DF-3 ballistic missile (NATO designated CSS-2), purchased from China 27 years ago, was displayed for the first time at a Saudi military parade Tuesday, April 29, in the eastern military town of Hafar Al-Batin, at the junction of the Saudi-Kuwaiti-Iraqi borders.

The DF-3 has a range of 2,650 km and carries a payload of 2,150 kg. It is equipped with a single nuclear warhead with a 1-3 MT yield.

Watched by a wide array of Saudi defense and military dignitaries, headed by Crown Prince and Deputy Prime Minister Salman bin Abdulaziz, the parade marked the end of the large-scale "Abdullah's Sword" military war game.

Conspicuous on the saluting stand was the Pakistani Chief of Staff Gen. Raheel Sharif alongside eminent visitors, including King Hamad of Bahrain and Sheikh Muhammad bin Zayed, the crown prince of Abu Dhabi.

DEBKAfile's military and intelligence sources report the event was deliberately loaded with highly-significant messages, the foremost of which was that the Middle East is in the throes of a nuclear arms race in the wake of the Iranian program.

1. The oil kingdom was saying loud and clear that it has obtained nuclear missiles and is ready to use them in the event of an armed conflict with Iran.

2. The message for Washington was that Riyadh adheres to its adamant objections to the comprehensive accord for resolving the Iranian nuclear question which is racing toward its finale with the six world powers led by the US. The Saudis share Israel's conviction that this pact - far from dismantling Iran's nuclear capacity - will seal the Islamic Republic's elevation to the status of pre-nuclear power. The result will be a Middle East war in which the Saudis will take part.

3. The participation of the nuclear DF-3 missiles in the "Abdullah's Sword" exercise signified Riyadh's estimate that the coming conflict will see the use of nuclear weapons.

4. By showing off their ageing Chinese missiles, the Saudis intimated that they had acquired the more advanced generation of this weapon, which they are keeping under wraps. DEBKAfile's intelligence sources report that in recent visits to Beijing, high-ranking Saudi officials negotiated the purchase of Dong-Feng 21 (DF-21), whose range is shorter, 1,700 km, but more precise and effective in view of its terminal radar guidance system. The West has no information about when the new Chinese missiles were delivered to Saudi Arabia.

5. The presence of the top Pakistani soldier at the parade of military and nuclear hardware was meant as corroboration of Islamabad's active role as the source of the Saudi nuclear arsenal.

6. The Saudis no longer rely on the American nuclear umbrella. They are developing their own nuclear strike force with the help of China and Pakistan.

 

[Jagdish58]

Re: Saudis parade nuclear missiles for the first time in defiance of U

Is the Purchase of DF-3 not the violation of MTCR?? if USA can block Cryoeneginic engine export from Russia to India why was this allowed??

 

[ladder]

Re: Saudis parade nuclear missiles for the first time in defiance of U

Is the Purchase of DF-3 not the violation of MTCR?? if USA can block Cryoeneginic engine export from Russia to India why was this allowed??

Transferred before MCTR was formalized and definitely before China declared to follow guidelines of MTCR. Also, the MTCR is voluntary and places no penalty on violation.


==================================

The main weapon of the RSSMF is the Chinese DF-3 (CSS-2) Dongfeng missile sold to Saudi Arabia by China. A conventional high-explosive warhead (2150 kg) variant of the DongFeng 3A Intermediate-Range Ballistic Missile with range up to 2800 km was developed for an export order to Saudi Arabia in 1987.[3] About 30~120 missiles and 9~12 launchers were reportedly delivered in 1988, though no known test launch has ever been made in the country. Some sources suggest that the RSSMF has considered purchasing the advanced DF-21 ballistic missile from China in the future.[4]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Saudi_Strategic_Missile_Force

================================

The Missile Technology Control Regime (MTCR) was established in April 1987 by Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, Great Britain, and the United States. The MTCR was created in order to curb the spread of unmanned delivery systems for nuclear weapons, specifically delivery systems that could carry a minimum payload of 500 kg a minimum of 300 km.

The People's Republic of China is not a member of the MTCR but has agreed to abide by the original 1987 Guidelines and Annex, but not the subsequent revisions. China first verbally pledged that it would adhere to the MTCR in November 1991, and included these assurances in a letter from its Foreign Minister in February 1992. China reiterated its pledge in the October 1994 US-China joint statement. In their October 1997 joint statement, the United States and China stated that they agree "to build on the 1994 Joint Statement on Missile Nonproliferation."[3] In 2004 China applied to join the MTCR, but members did not offer China membership because of concerns about China's export control standards.[4][5]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missile_Technology_Control_Regime

 

[Compersion]

Re: Saudis parade nuclear missiles for the first time in defiance of U

This was during the period when Iraq was shooting missiles into Israel and must have threatened the KSA since they were having Americans on their soil. The Saudis wanted to send a message to the Iraq not to get carried away and must have approached the Americans for weapons. Since the Americans would not provide such maal to KSA the PRC government was approached. The Americans must have said why the need - and like the Israels they ought to trust the firepower of the NATO. Therefore the reasoning must have been done with American consent.

It appears to be 20 year old show pieces of the Iraq war and how KSA was victorious. And also it must be a reminder to Iran on what the dynamics at play were at that time (good ol times). Unless the Pakis and PRC are now involved in making them useful - from my impression they are over 20 years old and untested and unused missiles being shown off by KSA. The Saudis are also capable of buying new maal why dont they buy new missiles. Its is like they are displaying a Mig-21 when they can display a Euro Fighter with the money they have.

This is where the MTCR post Iraq comes into play.

The only quote that i find fascinating is:

The DF-3 has a range of 2,650 km and carries a payload of 2,150 kg. It is equipped with a single nuclear warhead with a 1-3 MT yield.

Is Saudi Arabia declaring it has (Paki) Nukes.

The above is also a good critique of PRC foreign policy that allowed it to make good inroads into the Sunni board-rooms. Its been heard that the Americans dont speak Arabic when they talk to people in Middle-east but the people from PRC do. One can say the Americans don't need to learn the local lingu to get their way.

With respect to India as usual we sat on the sides and are also now sitting on the sides. It would be good and we need to test the 10,000 + km ICBM. Our default position after such a test would mean we are not ever on the sideline.

 

[Illusive]

Re: Saudis parade nuclear missiles for the first time in defiance of U

Are Chinese that crazy that they are handing over DF-21 to Saudis.

 

[Yusuf]

Re: Saudis parade nuclear missiles for the first time in defiance of U

The Saudis have only showed the DF3s. They got DF-21s in 2007. That they finances the Sunni Bomb is well known. That Pak has/will supply nukes to KSA is also known/expected.

@ poster above,in 1987 Iran was still at war with Iraq.Iraq lobbed missiles at Israel in 1991. In 87, Saudis didn't need a nuclear capable missile. In 2007, US didn't have good relations with Iran as the Saudis site as the reason to explore "other" options.

Saudis always wanted nuke capability to back up its ideological push around the world.In Pak it has a safe custodian of nukes which it can get any time. That the missiles were paraded in front of Gen Raheel is another "message"

 

[pankaj nema]

Re: Saudis parade nuclear missiles for the first time in defiance of U

It is an old news

They are just bringing out the missiles which they have possessed since 1987

what really matters is how and when they get the Paki warheads

 

[BangersAndMash]

Re: Saudis parade nuclear missiles for the first time in defiance of U

It is an old news

They are just bringing out the missiles which they have possessed since 1987

what really matters is how and when they get the ChiPakinese warheads

1234567890

 

[amoy]

Re: Saudis parade nuclear missiles for the first time in defiance of U

it's reported the whole foreign reserve of China was totalled at US$ 2.072 bil only in 1986 while the DF-3 deal with Saudi was at $3.5 bil. it must hv been quite a revenue boost at that time.

keeping both Sunni and Shia powers capable of mutual destruction is a good way to maintain balance and peace in the Gulf.

Sent from my 5910 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Haman10]

Re: Saudis parade nuclear missiles for the first time in defiance of U

lol , no worries mates !!! that news is old and saudia doesnt get any upper hand because of it :

1- a missile that old and big is a piece of cake for any defence system to take out , its 40 years old for lords sake

2- the missiles were given to saudia with conventional warheads :

"The DF-3A is a Chinese liquid-fueled, single-stage, medium-range nuclear ballistic missile that entered service in 1971. DF-3A is the oldest missile in China's inventory and is nearing retirement after four decades of service.[3]

In 1987 China sold several dozen (reportedly between 36 and 60) outmoded DF-3 missiles to Saudi Arabia, with conventional warheads.[4][5]"

DF-3A - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

so no worries

 

[Illusive]

Re: Saudis parade nuclear missiles for the first time in defiance of U

lol , no worries mates !!! that news is old and saudia doesnt get any upper hand because of it :

1- a missile that old and big is a piece of cake for any defence system to take out , its 40 years old for lords sake

2- the missiles were given to saudia with conventional warheads :

"The DF-3A is a Chinese liquid-fueled, single-stage, medium-range nuclear ballistic missile that entered service in 1971. DF-3A is the oldest missile in China's inventory and is nearing retirement after four decades of service.[3]

In 1987 China sold several dozen (reportedly between 36 and 60) outmoded DF-3 missiles to Saudi Arabia, with conventional warheads.[4][5]"

DF-3A - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

so no worries

Its not about DF3a mate, its about the more sophisticated DF-21 which is more worrying,
@amoy well you justified China selling DF3 for precious foreign reserve, what would be the case this time for selling DF21, you guys think saudi's will help keep East Turkmenistan clean or turning a blind eye to what CCP do to the muslims there, well you guys are only giving them more teeth.

 

[amoy]

Saudi Arabia, China sign MoU to build nuclear reactor
http://gulfnews.com/business/sector...a-sign-mou-to-build-nuclear-reactor-1.1656541
Published: 23:29 January 19, 2016

Dubai: Saudi Arabia oil giant Saudi Aramco and China's Sinopec on Tuesday signed a framework agreement for strategic cooperation, Saudi state news agency SPA reported.

The Saudi state news agency also said Saudi Arabia and China signed a memorandum of understanding to build a high energy-nuclear reactor that would use gas for cooling.

The agency said the agreement was one of 14 agreements and memoranda of understanding signed between Saudi Arabia and China on the first day of a state visit by Chinese President Xi Jinping to Riyadh.

Xi is also scheduled to visit Iran and Egypt on his Jan. 19-23 tour.

The report gave no further details.

Saudi Aramco, the world's biggest oil producer, had been in talks to acquire a stake in a China National Petroleum Corp refinery as well as retail assets, people familiar with the matter said last October - a deal that would help it sell more of its output to China amid growing competition.

The deal is estimated to be worth around $1-$1.5 billion, although final valuations, assets and stakes were subject to change, they said.

China – Saudi Arabia relations

China and Saudi Arabia have already invested in each other’s market in regard with different fields. For example, in 2009 China’s Railway Company constructed a monorail system in Mecca in order to provide ease to the travelling pilgrims. In 2006, China and Saudi Arabia agreed to jointly build an oil storage facility in China’s Hainan Island. At the same time, it is important to note that in recent past Saudi Arabia was the first source of China’s oil imports.

~~Still waters run deep. ~~from my MiPad using tapatalk

 

[Indx TechStyle]

@amoy I think giving them DF-3 Missile Technology Control Regime violation.
How you guys are allowed to sell it?

 

[amoy]

@amoy I think giving them DF-3 Missile Technology Control Regime violation.
How you guys are allowed to sell it?

Hmmm how was India even allowed to conduct nuclear tests?

And in Mid East ~
Israel’s advanced nuclear arsenal has long been understood to exist, although it hasn’t been officially admitted by the Israeli government. Many have argued Israel’s possession of nuclear weapons is what drives the accelerated Iranian program and causes other regional instability.


~~Still waters run deep. ~~from my MiPad using tapatalk

 

[Indx TechStyle]

Hmmm how was India even allowed to conduct nuclear tests?

And in Mid East ~
Israel’s advanced nuclear arsenal has long been understood to exist, although it hasn’t been officially admitted by the Israeli government. Many have argued Israel’s possession of nuclear weapons is what drives the accelerated Iranian program and causes other regional instability.


~~Still waters run deep. ~~from my MiPad using tapatalk

Do you have any idea what I asked?

India tested nuclear weapons of it's own.
Israel developed nuclear capabilities of it's own.
Even France ratified NPT.
But Saudis are getting nuclear weapons from China?
Developing these weapons itself is a different thing and exporting them is a different thing. So, my question is:
how are you guys exporting them?
Now, answer. Any political process or West's double game against Iran, once again.

 

[amoy]

China-GCC Free Trade Agreement talks to end this year

Resumed negotiations between China and the Cooperation Council for the Arab States of the Gulf (GCC) on the China-GCC Free Trade Agreement substantively concluded in principle on trade in goods after three days on Jan 19.

China and the GCC have agreed to accelerate the pace of negotiations, review progress made and hold the next round of talks in the second half of February, the two sides said in a joint press release on Tuesday.

The two have committed to work closely to conclude a comprehensive Free Trade Agreement within this year.

http://en.people.cn/n3/2016/0120/c90883-9006832.html

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[dhananjay1]

I would like to know what game Amarika is playing with Iran and Saudis. Is this Iran deal is a big change of policy towards Saudis or just a measure to drive away Iran from Alawites?

 

[Compersion]

Sorry but did the Israel ignore all of the above ...

Another feather in the hat of the PRC and Israel disagreement relations (Google -> uber -> twitter) !

Loved reading paki radio news today seems prc is being poodle to paki for once - and supporting paki policy in middle east !

 

[amoy]

China's Xi opens refinery with Saudi King Salman
Chinese President Xi Jinping and Saudi King Salman on Wednesday inaugurated a joint-venture refinery, symbolising Beijing's deepening involvement in the Middle East and Riyadh's need for economic diversification.

Posted 21 Jan 2016 03:13

Saudi King Salman bin Abdulaziz (C) and Chinese President Xi Jinping (R) attending the inauguration of the Yanbu Aramco Sinopec Refining Company (YASREF) project in Riyadh on Jan 20, 2016. (AFP Photo)

RiIYADH: Chinese President Xi Jinping and Saudi King Salman on Wednesday (Jan 20) inaugurated a joint-venture refinery, symbolising Beijing's deepening involvement in the Middle East and Riyadh's need for economic diversification.

The event took place in the Saudi capital on the second day of Xi's first visit to the region. He later left for Cairo and will also travel to Saudi Arabia's rival Iran.

The YASREF refinery, in Yanbu Industrial City on the Red Sea, is 62.5-per cent held by Saudi oil giant Aramco, while China Petroleum & Chemical Corp (Sinopec) holds the balance. "YASREF represents both companies' focus on driving downstream growth," the refinery said in a statement.

Billboards on a highway outside the ceremony showed Xi and Salman waving against a backdrop of the refinery.

Saudi Arabia is China's biggest global supplier of crude, and state-owned Saudi Aramco says expansion into refining and chemicals fits the kingdom's goal of economic diversification. The policy has been given added urgency by a plunge in the kingdom's oil revenues.

YASREF is one of five joint-venture refineries in Saudi Arabia. Another four are overseas, including one in Fujian, China. The YASREF refinery shipped its first diesel one year ago and has a capacity to refine 400,000 barrels of Arabian crude per day.

Saudi Aramco and Sinopec also signed a framework agreement on cooperation, reflecting confidence "in the potential opportunities we can create together," said Saudi Aramco president Amin Nasser.

GROWING TRADE

Sinopec's strengths in refinery and chemical technology would support the kingdom's drive to diversify its petroleum sector, said the company's chairman Wang Yupu.

The ceremony, accompanied by a Chinese dragon and Arabian sword-dancing, took place in Riyadh at the King Abdullah Petroleum Studies and Research Center (KAPSARC). Salman separately inaugurated that facility, which focuses on energy research and policy.

Oil Minister Ali al-Naimi, who chairs KAPSARC's board of trustees, told the gathering the centre would "contribute to the diversification and expansion of the Saudi economy".

Salman in December said he had ordered economic reforms to diversify sources of income and reduce the kingdom's high dependence on oil. Global crude prices have collapsed from above US$100 a barrel in early 2014 to below US$28 on Wednesday.

To cope with a record budget deficit, the kingdom broke with its decades-old generous welfare system and raised fuel, electricity and other prices in its 2016 budget. Government spending has also been cut, there is talk of a value-added tax in the tax-free nation, and state assets including Saudi Aramco could be privatised.

Trade between the Gulf nations and China, the world's second-largest economy, has been growing. Two-way commerce between China and Saudi Arabia alone reached US$69.1 billion in 2014, according to China's official Xinhua news agency.

Although China depends on the Middle East for its oil supplies, it has long taken a low-profile approach to the region's diplomatic and other disputes, only recently beginning to expand its role, especially in the Syrian crisis.

Before Xi's visit, a Chinese analyst said Beijing would do what it could to ease heightened tensions between Saudi Arabia, the region's main Sunni power, and its Shiite rival Iran.

Later, Xi was welcomed at Cairo airport by his Egyptian counterpart Abdel Fattah al-Sisi, with whom he will hold bilateral talks that focus on the economic sector.

Bilateral trade between China and Egypt amounted to US$11 billion in 2014, the bulk of it being Chinese exports to the biggest Sunni Arab country, state-run Al-Ahram newspaper reported. On Thursday, Xi is to visit Egypt's newly convened parliament, and will address a session of the Cairo-based Arab League.

 

[no smoking]

@amoy I think giving them DF-3 Missile Technology Control Regime violation.
How you guys are allowed to sell it?

DF-3 was sold in 1988 before Chinese signed the treaty.
And in 2007, Chinese was just upgrading the equipment of missiles which were already sold.
So, technically, Chinese didn't violate any MTCR term.