Reversing the tables on China- the Shangai TRup Card - Scare them instead

roma

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As the title says, that is indeed my suggestion and i wonder whay it has not been employed so far .....CH has always in the past been worrying india ....i think it is time to do the oppposite ..... india in fact has the trup scare card .....how ? simple ...in any outrigh conflict , given sufficient quantity of MISSILES and Nuke WARHEADS, ( my reason for posting on the missle part of this forum ) China ( SHANGhai ) is more developed has FAR more to lose . So wqhile the esteemed outgoing naveal chief had stated chi is nmore , oh sorry far more developed than IN , the corollary is that it also has more , ooops soory far more to lose. of course it requires some guts form the top people and apart from HE chidambaram , sometimes thats hard to find , especially wehen some of them are actually using taxpayers money to build statues unto themselves !!
 

SATISH

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Mate...I think you are typing from a Phone or You are way drunk. (I guess the 2nd will be appropriate). The answer is no. And yes we are ashamed of that statues bullshit. And if we blackmail them with Shangai they will inturn blackmail us with Mumbai.
 

roma

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reply to satish's

hi sorry for the typo's ...cant type fpor nuts as you can see ...... no prob about the Ch's retailiating with a threat of nuking mumbai , the fact is they have foar more to lose ....that's thte whole idea .... once in a while scare them with a scorched earth policy , even though it works both ways , they have more to lose ..... i think it should make them think at least twice or a lot more
 

icecoolben

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That may just level the battle field or level both the countries to the stone age. The truth is indian nuke capability is less than credible minimum deterenceand the latest operationat agni can only hope to cover beijing or shanghai. While chinese icbm can easily cover our entire land mass. With all our nukes we can destroy only 0.5% of china. But their capability of 400 to 500 warheads some with 25 giga tons of power can wipe off 5% of our land mass. So we need a missile defence shield to deter any chinese aggression.
 

Sabir

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That may just level the battle field or level both the countries to the stone age. The truth is indian nuke capability is less than credible minimum deterenceand the latest operationat agni can only hope to cover beijing or shanghai. While chinese icbm can easily cover our entire land mass. With all our nukes we can destroy only 0.5% of china. But their capability of 400 to 500 warheads some with 25 giga tons of power can wipe off 5% of our land mass. So we need a missile defence shield to deter any chinese aggression.
China has its own 'Achillis heel'. In a situation when everybody will be mad to destroy each other China will be worried about the collosal Three Gorges Dam. Can you guess would be the result if this Dam is destroyed by conventional or nuclear attack...........google a bit.
 

Soham

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Roma,

That is not quite how threats work. A threat makes sense only if it is exclusive. As Satish has stated, they'll just retort back with a threat to Delhi, Mumbai or any other Indian city.
Plus the threat will just backfire on us, as we don't really have any diplomatic leverage against China at the moment.

Standing up to China is distant unless the politicians wake up. Till then, its nothing but a web of illusions. The day we get serious about our military acquisitions, instead of blacklisting almost every firm in the world, China's efforts of dominance in South Asia would stand thwarted.

P.S. Most browsers have a spell check.
 

india rock

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things like this,if you are rich,you should care abt your stuff ,and if you are poor guy,you have nothing to lose ,taht s the position between china and india,
 

icecoolben

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There is no certainity that our missiles will hit for sure, a small gps blank caused our brahmos to stray way-off target. There is no-assuriance that the americans won't do it in real time warfare to prevent ww3, since it is in its interest. The russians experienced gps mal-function in their war against georgia. If u are thinking of glonass, u are way off target, it lacks satellites for full operation and is funded by chinese and india too has principally agreed to fund its revival, so that too is out the back door. in such circumstances, if u fire a missile and it falters then v would have to face massive retaliation. If lucky after we get levelled the russian or american nuclear umbrella may respond and level the chinese too. The only possible way for precision strikes is to build an indian regional navigation system that covers 2000 km around indian territory and then think of obliterating chinese cities. Most importantly the chinese manufacturing base and weapons stockpiles have to be taken out before cities are done with. In any case, v need an effective missile defence shield to counter any missile that survives the first wave of attack and gets launched onto indian territory.
 

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China has its own 'Achillis heel'. In a situation when everybody will be mad to destroy each other China will be worried about the collosal Three Gorges Dam. Can you guess would be the result if this Dam is destroyed by conventional or nuclear attack...........google a bit.
3 Gorges are gravity damns. You need multi-megaton warheads with direct hits. India neither has the weapon nor the accuracy for such a feat.
 

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That may just level the battle field or level both the countries to the stone age. The truth is indian nuke capability is less than credible minimum deterenceand the latest operationat agni can only hope to cover beijing or shanghai. While chinese icbm can easily cover our entire land mass. With all our nukes we can destroy only 0.5% of china. But their capability of 400 to 500 warheads some with 25 giga tons of power can wipe off 5% of our land mass. So we need a missile defence shield to deter any chinese aggression.
Your numbers are off. Just counting the ballistic missile batteries, the Chinese have about 100 warheads. Add in another 100 for aircraft and SLBM.

Going by throw weight, only 30 warheads are the 3 megaton monsters being dleivered by C33-4 (DF-5) ICBM. The rest are the ~100kt beasts.

Both India and China subscribe to nuclear deterrance, not warfighting. There is a difference. If you have to use a nuke, your deterrance has failed and what and how you chuck nukes is small potatoes after that. You're gone as a national government.
 

icecoolben

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s the weapon nor the accuracy for such a feat.[/QUOTE] well said. What do u propose are chinese weakness when a was breaks out.
 

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Forget nukes, they're not going to use them first. Their 1st strike doctrines are mass conventional missile attack in missile salvos of 3-5 per target. Imagine 3-5 five hundred bomb bombs being dropped a building. Even if they missed, you will have to get out while the engineers determine how safe is the building.

However, neither India nor China are serious about any confrontation. They may not be serious about a solution but you have a long way to go before war.

For one thing, how about a permenant manning of the border instead of sending a patrol once every 6 months or year?
 

masterofsea

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As the title says, that is indeed my suggestion and i wonder whay it has not been employed so far .....CH has always in the past been worrying india ....i think it is time to do the oppposite ..... india in fact has the trup scare card .....how ? simple ...in any outrigh conflict , given sufficient quantity of MISSILES and Nuke WARHEADS, ( my reason for posting on the missle part of this forum ) China ( SHANGhai ) is more developed has FAR more to lose . So wqhile the esteemed outgoing naveal chief had stated chi is nmore , oh sorry far more developed than IN , the corollary is that it also has more , ooops soory far more to lose. of course it requires some guts form the top people and apart from HE chidambaram , sometimes thats hard to find , especially wehen some of them are actually using taxpayers money to build statues unto themselves !!
I'm sorry,I can't understand Russian or Mongolian.
 

icecoolben

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There u go back to the start with the more to loose part, thats going to turn tables, both the countries have their own cards and play them to their chest and keep a confrontation to the minimal. China has a lot of financial nerve centres with shanghai being the most vital. If at all u want to hurt them target the missile installations and then go for the cities. But from my point its just a waste of resources that would end in a zero sum game. Atleast u got off that 3-gorges dam trolan horse.
 

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If at all u want to hurt them target the missile installations
You'll waste your entire arsenal without getting one. The US and USSR did not start targetting each other's nukes until the MINUTEMAN/SS-18 series and even then, it was 3 nukes per target.
 

icecoolben

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According to reliable sources, india has started work on constructing military installations to train mongolian troops in e-warfare. But undercover they keep a track of chinese missile developments and delivery system testing. So probably india is increasing its survilance of such facilities. RAW has been monitoring paki's installations these are only for one reason, precision strikes. Who said the US didn't employ means of tracking soviet missile installations, they went the extent of employing psychics for this, i'll post proof later. Why do nations develop second strike capability because a first strike either conventional or nuclear will be aimed at the offensive military installations.
 

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According to reliable sources, india has started work on constructing military installations to train mongolian troops in e-warfare.
Hehehehahahahaha, sorry, China, like India, doesn't have the PLAYBOY channel.

But undercover they keep a track of chinese missile developments and delivery system testing.
In which case, you're better off in the Sea of Japan.

So probably india is increasing its survilance of such facilities.
Unless Moscow passed on the data to you, there's no way for you to know the exact locations of the hardened silos. Open source would tell you where the brigades are but you wouldn't know which silos are decoys and which is the real McCoy.

RAW has been monitoring paki's installations these are only for one reason, precision strikes.
Pak nukes are aircraft delivered.

Who said the US didn't employ means of tracking soviet missile installations, they went the extent of employing psychics for this, i'll post proof later.
I served during the Cold War and CFB Lahrs, Germany was a nuclear target, mainly because the CF-104 squadron there was tasked to deliver nukes onto Warsaw Pact columns.

So, I know exactly how they found us ... and we them. However, we went beyond that. The various arms control agreements between the two superpowers finessed their detection systems, technology that they have not shared even with their allies. Let's put it this way, British and French nukes are not counterforce systems.

Why do nations develop second strike capability because a first strike either conventional or nuclear will be aimed at the offensive military installations.
No. Mainly because the 1st strike won't work.
 

ahmedsid

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Hehehehahahahaha, sorry, China, like India, doesn't have the PLAYBOY channel.

In which case, you're better off in the Sea of Japan.

Unless Moscow passed on the data to you, there's no way for you to know the exact locations of the hardened silos. Open source would tell you where the brigades are but you wouldn't know which silos are decoys and which is the real McCoy.

Pak nukes are aircraft delivered.

I served during the Cold War and CFB Lahrs, Germany was a nuclear target, mainly because the CF-104 squadron there was tasked to deliver nukes onto Warsaw Pact columns.

So, I know exactly how they found us ... and we them. However, we went beyond that. The various arms control agreements between the two superpowers finessed their detection systems, technology that they have not shared even with their allies. Let's put it this way, British and French nukes are not counterforce systems.

No. Mainly because the 1st strike won't work.
One quick doubt, Pak nukes are aircraft delivered? Did i miss something on the other page? The Pakistanis have a missile programme.
 

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