QUAD; The Concert of Democracies for Trade, Security & Diplomacy

[Optimistic Nihilist]

US under Biden may or may not be able to defend Taiwan

Under the War Powers and Taiwan Relations acts, the US president has no legal authority, without the express authorization of Congress, to use military force to defend Taiwan.

That may have been a safeguard ideally, but you're forgetting that this is the US. They have broken their own laws hundreds of times.

Remember the Korean War and the total imperialist destruction that US caused? Truman did that WITHOUT CONGRESSIONAL APPROVAL. He called it "police action".

 

[shade]

So the DPP won the elections and has been ruling Taiwan since 2016, but they're marxists. If they rule for too long, their left-wing policies will eventually make the island indistinguishable from continental China. Conversely, if the KMT is elected back into power, they'll finish what they started previously and simply hand the country directly over to the Chinese Communist party in a silver platter.
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You are right, but it's not what you think, because PRC is actually quite right wing in the post-11 Jinpooh era, what the cat-lady's party will do is eventually cuck Taiwan since modern lefty-marxism doesn't give fighting spirit, just look at those pussy European countries, so 10-15 years of this cat lady party rule, that very same party will be willing to make deals with the PRC, and if the KMT ever gets re-elected it is an auto-win for PRC as you said.

 

[ezsasa]

unlike Afghanistan, taiwan is a test case for “defending democracy against expansionist powers”. Theoretically if something happens to Taiwan, US’s core leverage with rest of the world collapses I.e democracy, and with it their numero uno status accorded by rest of the world. it’s not the case that US has nothing to loose.

for all practical purposes, we are back in Cold War domino theory era.

As things stand today, taiwan enjoys bipartisan support in US Congress. this is another of trump’s policies continuing under Biden.

Flip side of the argument is that, Murican Marxists might just cut a deal with Chinese communists in return for some concessions. the world officially becomes G2. This is where it was heading before trump came and spoiled their plans, hence the hatred against trump.

continuing with this line of thought..

if Taiwan signs a security pact with the muricans, India will face the full brunt of chini frustration because we won’t sign a pact. Hence the quad an informal arrangement, so that india is not completely out of the loop.

 

[Optimistic Nihilist]

I am pretty sure that America realizes that in some time Taiwan will willingly go over to China. Which is why to stop it, they want a conflict to happen. Consequently, most of the provocations over the Taiwan issue has come from the US in recent times.

USA seem determined to get to shots fired, seeking only to ensure that it is China that fires first.

As we saw with Tiananmen Square, the Chinese are willing to shoot. They also feel quite righteous doing so, if they think they have been forced. They will just blame those who forced them.

Speaking simply from a general perspective, if Xi wants to win, he mustn't get provoked and ignore the provocations, he'll get Taiwan in the end anyway. What is problematic is the hardliners in China. If their pressure becomes too much, China would have to make a move in which case they would lose.

 

[Jimih]

Remember the Korean War and the total imperialist destruction that US caused? Truman did that WITHOUT CONGRESSIONAL APPROVAL. He called it "police action".

Those days US political establishment was all Anti-communists.

In present era, entire Democrats has tilted towards Marxist Left ideology.

Republicans are also not far behind, one lady Republican senator was heavily named and shamed for having a portrait of Mao at her home.

Georgia Runoff Candidate Kelly Loeffler Allegedly Owns a $56,000 Warhol Portrait of Mao, and a Fellow Republican Thinks It’s Weird

An attack ad against Kelly Loeffler suggests she's not a real conservative because she owns an Andy Warhol Mao print.

news.artnet.com

 

[ezsasa]

You are right, but it's not what you think, because PRC is actually quite right wing in the post-11 Jinpooh era, what the cat-lady's party will do is eventually cuck Taiwan since modern lefty-marxism doesn't give fighting spirit, just look at those pussy European countries, so 10-15 years of this cat lady party rule, that very same party will be willing to make deals with the PRC, and if the KMT ever gets re-elected it is an auto-win for PRC as you said.

Trump has taken care of this bit, recognition of PRC influence operations with in US and abroad are part of the US security doctrine now.

CIA will ensure Tsai doesn’t “defect”, or atleast they will try.

 

[Optimistic Nihilist]

Those days US political establishment was all Anti-communists.

In present era, entire Democrats has tilted towards Marxist Left ideology.

Republicans are also not far behind, one lady Republican senator was heavily named and shamed for having a portrait of Mao at her home.

Georgia Runoff Candidate Kelly Loeffler Allegedly Owns a $56,000 Warhol Portrait of Mao, and a Fellow Republican Thinks It’s Weird

An attack ad against Kelly Loeffler suggests she's not a real conservative because she owns an Andy Warhol Mao print.

news.artnet.com

Actually, I will dispute that. The Democrats have certainly shifted to Marxist policies domestically. But does that necessarily mean they have become friends with China?

Anti-China sentiment is pretty bipartisan in Washington DC. The US Senate in April this year passed a bumper anti-China bill titled the “Strategic Competition Act”. Backed by Chuck Schumer (Dem - New York) as one of his biggest priorities since becoming the Majority leader, the 270+ page document contains scores of recommendations and provisions on formalizing America’s “geopolitical competition” against Beijing, including in the fields of military, diplomacy, technology, trade and more. There’s little question it will be passed into law, having already cleared the Senate and with the anti-Chinese sentiment in Washington being routinely bipartisan.

The bill also notably pledged hundreds of millions of dollars in various capacities for media focused initiatives against China. This includes up to $300 million in an openly described effort to spread information on the “negative impact” of China’s $1 trillion-plus Belt and Road Initiative (BRI) in participating countries, “anti-Chinese influence” programs, a scheme to “train journalists” with the goal of countering Beijing, and millions more in funding for Radio Free Asia to expand its coverage in the specified languages of Mandarin, Cantonese, Tibetan and Uighur. In short, it’s a mammoth propaganda push.

Kelly Loeffler was anyway a bimbo RINO who wasn't even the choice of the people, but was helped to get in by the equally corrupt Governor of Georgia. She has now been ostracized like a cockroach and is irrelevant.

 

[Okabe Rintarou]

But what about TSMC? If PRC wins Taiwan, USA and the rest of the world loses that strategic asset. And more importantly, China gains it, further closing tech gap with USA.

 

[Love Charger]

It's ideal that taiwan willingly goes over to china , what's the point of resisting when they don't have a religious buff .
It's a joke communism vs democracy or capitalism , Taiwanese can integrate tehmselevs very well with the prc.
A peace full end and resolution of conflict .
I don't understand why Taiwanese hate being part of china.
Taiwan conflict cannot be compared to kashmir.

 

[asianobserve]

Actually, I will dispute that. The Democrats have certainly shifted to Marxist policies domestically. But does that necessarily mean they have become friends with China?

Anti-China sentiment is pretty bipartisan in Washington DC. The US Senate in April this year passed a bumper anti-China bill titled the “Strategic Competition Act”. Backed by Chuck Schumer (Dem - New York) as one of his biggest priorities since becoming the Majority leader, the 270+ page document contains scores of recommendations and provisions on formalizing America’s “geopolitical competition” against Beijing, including in the fields of military, diplomacy, technology, trade and more. There’s little question it will be passed into law, having already cleared the Senate and with the anti-Chinese sentiment in Washington being routinely bipartisan.

The bill also notably pledged hundreds of millions of dollars in various capacities for media focused initiatives against China. This includes up to $300 million in an openly described effort to spread information on the “negative impact” of China’s $1 trillion-plus Belt and Road Initiative (BRI) in participating countries, “anti-Chinese influence” programs, a scheme to “train journalists” with the goal of countering Beijing, and millions more in funding for Radio Free Asia to expand its coverage in the specified languages of Mandarin, Cantonese, Tibetan and Uighur. In short, it’s a mammoth propaganda push.

Kelly Loeffler was anyway a bimbo RINO who wasn't even the choice of the people, but was helped to get in by the equally corrupt Governor of Georgia. She has now been ostracized like a cockroach and is irrelevant.

I'm really perplexed about people branding Democrats as Marxists. Democrats are anything but Marxists. If Nordic countries are not Marxists then more so are Democrats.

Marx must be turning in his grave to be associated with US Democrats.

 

[Love Charger]

Although if china does meddling in kashmir or arunachal than india has all the right to interfare in the Taiwan question

 

[asianobserve]

It's ideal that taiwan willingly goes over to china , what's the point of resisting when they don't have a religious buff .
It's a joke communism vs democracy or capitalism , Taiwanese can integrate tehmselevs very well with the prc.
A peace full end and resolution of conflict .
I don't understand why Taiwanese hate being part of china.
Taiwan conflict cannot be compared to kashmir.

The majority of Taiwanese people no longer consider themselves Chinese, they're Taiwanese. And the Chinese holdouts, KMT, is a graying and thinning section of Taiwan. The vast majority of Taiwanese youth are pro independence.

 

[shade]

It's ideal that taiwan willingly goes over to china , what's the point of resisting when they don't have a religious buff .
It's a joke communism vs democracy or capitalism , Taiwanese can integrate tehmselevs very well with the prc.
A peace full end and resolution of conflict .
I don't understand why Taiwanese hate being part of china.
Taiwan conflict cannot be compared to kashmir.

Taiwan is a country of JNU-style Left-Librandu chings.
PRC is a country of right wing Chings( because CCP forces them to ).

Taiwanese see PRC as "fascist" and have a superiority complex vs mainland chings.

Above all it's a great power conflict, especially with the whole TSMC/Semiconductor Fab angle in play.
Cat Lady and her party are a US shill group, just like the KMT there are CCP sold outs.

 

[Love Charger]

Taiwan is a country of JNU-style Left-Librandu chings.
PRC is a country of right wing Chings( because CCP forces them to ).

Taiwanese see PRC as "fascist" and have a superiority complex vs mainland chings.

Above all it's a great power conflict, especially with the whole TSMC/Semiconductor Fab angle in play.
Cat Lady and her party are a US shill group, just like the KMT there are CCP sold outs.

What can we do these harami chinese are enemies else you can't help but admire them.

 

[Optimistic Nihilist]

I'm really perplexed about people branding Democrats as Marxists. Democrats are anything but Marxists. If Nordic countries are not Marxists then more so are Democrats.

Marx must be turning in his grave to be associated with US Democrats.

Haha....yeah no.

Of course American leftists are entirely different from Russian Bolsheviks and Europeans in general. American leftists, if you look at them totally, are a loose political alliance of welfare hogs, immigrants, traditional Marxists, Neomarxists, neoliberal capitalists, corporatists, and traditional democrats.

Most of the Mexicans voting democrats care about illegal immigration (their families) and de facto have the same floundering socialist ideas they bring from back home. Most blacks aren't politically active (as in, don't give a shit about domestic/foreign policy, political theory), they just fall for a lot of propaganda when it applies to specifically to them (Trump hates blacks, George Floyd was murdered).

The actual Democrat party is run by Deep State Marxists and it is evident in the policies they enact.

 

[shade]

What can we do these harami chinese are enemies else you can't help but admire them.

It's not haram to admire certain good traits of your enemy that you can apply to your own country to strengthen it.

 

[Optimistic Nihilist]

But what about TSMC? If PRC wins Taiwan, USA and the rest of the world loses that strategic asset. And more importantly, China gains it, further closing tech gap with USA.

The TSMC stuff is why I believe the US won't let Taiwan go to China, even willingly. China invading Taiwan to get control over TSMC will result in a conflict in which China will lose.

Taiwan is the reason the USA is on top. It contains factories that produce semiconductor chips for purposes that give the USA a military hegemony. There is absolutely no way China benefits from an attempted invasion of Taiwan because it would end with a totally destroyed Taiwan, a dismantled TSMC deliberately done by the Taiwanese as a scorched earth tactic, and ruined relations with just about every country. Which is why USA is provoking China to start the war.

If Taiwan willingly decides to go to China, I'm pretty sure the US will do something to ensure China doesn't get its hands on TSMC.

 

[asianobserve]

Haha....yeah no.

Of course American leftists are entirely different from Russian Bolsheviks and Europeans in general. American leftists, if you look at them totally, are a loose political alliance of welfare hogs, immigrants, traditional Marxists, Neomarxists, neoliberal capitalists, corporatists, and traditional democrats.

Most of the Mexicans voting democrats care about illegal immigration (their families) and de facto have the same floundering socialist ideas they bring from back home. Most blacks aren't politically active (as in, don't give a shit about domestic/foreign policy, political theory), they just fall for a lot of propaganda when it applies to specifically to them (Trump hates blacks, George Floyd was murdered).

The actual Democrat party is run by Deep State Marxists and it is evident in the policies they enact.

So there's simply no basis to call Democrats as Marxists or Communists (Communism is based on Marx's political-social-economic theory, Marx's ideal classless state).

 

[asianobserve]

The TSMC stuff is why I believe the US won't let Taiwan go to China, even willingly. China invading Taiwan to get control over TSMC will result in a conflict in which China will lose.

Taiwan is the reason the USA is on top. It contains factories that produce semiconductor chips for purposes that give the USA a military hegemony. There is absolutely no way China benefits from an attempted invasion of Taiwan because it would end with a totally destroyed Taiwan, a dismantled TSMC deliberately done by the Taiwanese as a scorched earth tactic, and ruined relations with just about every country. Which is why USA is provoking China to start the war.

If Taiwan willingly decides to go to China, I'm pretty sure the US will do something to ensure China doesn't get its hands on TSMC.

US always has contingencies. In the case of TSMC, the US has already asked and TSMC already put up a foundry in the US. I think this us a hedge just in case Taiwan is lost.

 

[Optimistic Nihilist]

So there's simply no basis to call Democrats as Marxists or Communists (Communism is based on Marx's political-social-economic theory, Marx's ideal classless state).

No, there is in fact a lot of basis to conclude they are Communists, but you will probably reject all of that, so there's no point in derailing this thread when the discussion itself won't be worthwhile.