People’s Liberation Army – Calling the Bluff

rockdog

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So to summarise,
Take a large, friendly peer country which is barely militarised

Be an arrogant, aggressive scumbag and "win" a battle against an unprepared army

End up with a hostile neighbour with a large army facing you on difficult terrain, multiple reverses in subsequent battles and has a strategic position blicking your main water routes in case of war.

Well done.
From Chinese view, we see benefit of the Sino-India war like this way:

1. Tear down the reputation of India's leader among developing nations from then. Stop its expansion to Tibet area, made India only fight with Pakistan. The war kept genral peace in Tibet for 60 yrs, we all knew after 1987, both sides didn't fire any bullet to each other, this is already big bonus to us.


2. Without Tibet, we need much more troops for defending Tibet/India military from Xinjiang, Sichuan, Qinghai, Yunnan provinces... our inland provinces become the frontlines. This is the biggest benefit for China on controlling Tibet, we made a solid backyard.


3. Gaining geographical advangate over India. Some cheap short range missile we would threat your capital city since the New Dheli is only 400km away from Aksai Chin. But all our major cities are 2000km aways from the border. Which means your need invest more strategic weapons to counter our tactical weapons. Considering China's GDP is 5 times than India, it wasted much resources you would invest on other sectors.


4. For decedes, PLA only keep less than 100,000 military personnels in Tibet, but India must delopy 2-5 times along the border. China saves more resource and India wasted more resources.


5. BTW,the hostile already started form Nehru's "forward policy", we don't need a war to gain it from your side.

You guys are India, we are Chinese, i didn't try to tell you how innocent we are or how evil you are to start the Forward Police first. I just purely analyze the strategic and econimic gain/loss for both sides. I totally no interest to debate which one was wrong.
 
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vampyrbladez

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From Chinese view, we see benefit of the Sino-India war like this way:

1. Tear down the reputation of India's leader among developing nations from then. Stop its expansion to Tibet area, made India only fight with Pakistan. The war kept genral peace in Tibet for 60 yrs, we all knew after 1987, both sides didn't fire any bullet to each other, this is already big bonus to us.


2. Without Tibet, we need much more troops for defending Tibet/India military from Xinjiang, Sichuan, Qinghai, Yunnan provinces... our inland provinces become the frontlines. This is the biggest benefit for China on controlling Tibet, we made a solid backyard.


3. Gaining geographical advangate over India. Some cheap short range missile we would threat your capital city since the New Dheli is only 400km away from Aksai Chin. But all our major cities are 2000km aways from the border. Which means your need invest more strategic weapons to counter our tactical weapons. Considering China's GDP is 5 times than India, it wasted much resources you would invest on other sectors.


4. For decedes, PLA only keep less than 100,000 military personnels in Tibet, but India must delopy 2-5 times along the border. China saves more resource and India wasted more resources.


5. BTW,the hostile already started form Nehru's "forward policy", we don't need a war to gain it from your side.

You guys are India, we are Chinese, i didn't try to tell you how innocent we are or how evil you are to start the Forward Police first. I just purely analyze the strategic and econimic gain/loss for both sides. I totally no interest to debate which one was wrong.
Is the CCP still smarting from Dokhlam? You do realize that India has built more than 75% of it's military infrastructure near the LAC and has been on a rapid military modernisation scheme since 2016. Our domestic industry can produce all military equipment sans imports.

China must understand that India under Modi WILL NOT BEND OVER under any circumstances. We played nuclear brinkmanship with the Pakis and bombed them deep inside their territory last year. This little flare up is nothing for us

In a war with India you will face an unending and unrelenting enemy! All the while you will have to face US and it's allies at SCS. This doesn't look good for China from any angle!
 

rockdog

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Is the CCP still smarting from Dokhlam? You do realize that India has built more than 75% of it's military infrastructure near the LAC and has been on a rapid military modernisation scheme since 2016. Our domestic industry can produce all military equipment sans imports.
I don't quite follow the infrastructure near the LAC on India side, but if so which means you still put lots of resources on it.

For weapons, till now 2020, i see most your major weapons are imported, like Tank, Fighters, Helicopters, Submarines, important warship subsystems... I think around 2025, your 1980s' started projects like Arjun and LCA would massively enter into serivces.




China must understand that India under Modi WILL NOT BEND OVER under any circumstances. We played nuclear brinkmanship with the Pakis and bombed them deep inside their territory last year. This little flare up is nothing for us
China didn't force India to Bend Over for decades, so far the relationship between two nations are so so. There are 35 yrs we didn't fire one bullet since 1987.

I think most Chinese are happy that we used a short war to maintain the peace of Tibet areas with minimum price.

From a Chinese view, India already half-controlled J/K region, Nepeal, Buthan and eat up Sikkim; if without 1962 war, India will finally try to take some part of Tibet, luckily we made it for our own national interest and we shouldn't let India to be the dominated power in this region, others are too weak.
 
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vampyrbladez

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I don't quite follow the infrastructure near the LAC on India side, but if so which means you still put lots of resources on it.

For weapons, till now 2020, i see most your major weapons are imported, like Tank, Fighters, Helicopters, Submarines, important warship subsystems... I think around 2025, your 1980s' started projects like Arjun and LCA would massively enter into serivces.






China didn't force India to Bend Over for decades, so far the relationship between two nations are so so. There are 35 yrs we didn't fire one bullet since 1987.

I think most Chinese are happy that we used a short war to maintain the peace of Tibet areas with minimum price.

From a Chinese view, India already half-controlled J/K region, Nepeal, Buthan and eat up Sikkim; if without 1962 war, India will finally try to take some part of Tibet, luckily we made it for our own national interest and we shouldn't let India to be the dominated power in this region, others are too weak.
It is India's manifest destiny to dominate South Asia. Nehru was too much of a dreamy idealist to not understand reality. Sardar Vallabhai Patel saw China as a threat/rival around 1950s. Unfortunately he died and was not our first PM.

India today is very different from that of 1980s, 2000s. If you go through recent announcements GoI is gearing up for massive and multi fronted war.
 

Neil

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China didn't force India to Bend Over for decades, so far the relationship between two nations are so so. There are 35 yrs we didn't fire one bullet since 1987.

I think most Chinese are happy that we used a short war to maintain the peace of Tibet areas with minimum price.

From a Chinese view, India already half-controlled J/K region, Nepeal, Buthan and eat up Sikkim; if without 1962 war, India will finally try to take some part of Tibet, luckily we made it for our own national interest and we shouldn't let India to be the dominated power in this region, others are too weak.
You didn't take Tibet because you somehow felt threatened by India. You took tibet because of some mystic glorious map and a desire to reclaim the past. Lets not misappropriate history to some mysterious Indian aggression (because there was none) and try and gloss over the fact that you are an occupying force by your own choice and not chance.

1962 was on similar lines. Use force and reclaim the past. Nehru had weakened India and this was the best chance to defeat one of the biggest countries in Asia and establish dominance. And sure, we might have more losses but we gave a bloody nose as well and 1967 clashes cemented that we are no pushover.

88 killed
163 wounded[5][6]
340 killed
450 wounded[5][6]

Everytime the Chinese has met a determined force who, even after the losses has stayed put, the Chinese have withdrawn. Korea, Vietnam, USSR, India and now even rag tag militia. You can bomb our capital all you want, but goodluck trying to fight an army determined to safeguard Indian territory. Never underestimate the enemy's capability and never over estimate your own.
 

AsuraKiller203

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China recently seems to want to pick a fight with all of its neighbors. Sinking Vietnamese n Philippine fishing boats, Stationing more assets against Taiwan, Flaring up skirmishes along Indian border, pushing Nepal to start issues with India, renegading on HongKongs autonomy etc

Viewing Chinese aggression thru various angles:
It could be that The CCP is scared of the coming external combined retribution from rest of the world that might weaken CCP domestically. Its trying to signal its enemies (US,India etc) not to push CCP too hard or a PLA military coup might take place and China under hardcore PLA extremists will be even more belligerent than china is today. And thus its not in interest of Chinas enemies. This is similar to paki army claiming not to sanction and weaken them too hard otherwise terrorists will take over paki nukes and outcome will be worse. Its basically the "alternative is worse" play. I dont think it will work bc world sees thru it.

It could be that CCP is feeling pressure internally from the PLA that its seen to be too soft and is allowing the military to do a few stunts to satisfy them. Like the pakis, CCP is big on H & D and has low tolerance for losing face (this is a weakness we could use.)

It could be that domestic unemployment and govts mishandling of coronavirus is increasing general populations anger towards CCP. And CCP is just trying to whip up nationalistic fervor to divert attention from its failures.

It could be that CCP genuinely believes its in a good position now to reap benefits from weakened neighbors. Thus testing waters by increasing military presence at the borders.

It could be that CCP senses a war is coming eventually anyway and is tying up all the lose domestic ends (hong kong) and preparing for a pre-emptive, action to benefit from a first strike now rather then wait for others to make the first move.

It could be a Xi Jinping vs CCP move. Recently there were reports that secretly CCP sent feelers out to the west asking "what if they replace xi jinping, will the west go back to normalcy visavis china?" Like Kim Jong Un, it could be Xi is testing loyalties of his comrades or trying to gauge possible foreign calculations. Xi Jinping could be trying to further secure his position among growing revolt within CCP.

Could be CCP returning to its own old tricks. Projecting itself much stronger than it actually is against its neighbors. Hoping that all the huffing and puffing makes them back down and not start a real war which would actually expose chinas military to be much weaker than projected. This has been chinas strategy against its neighbors till now. It somewhat worked against Philipines, Vietnam, pre-2014 India. Didnt work against India at Doklam in 2017.

Chinas CCPS biggest fear is an actual war. It knows its military cant fight (for various reasons) and fears it coming to light. They keep on salami-slicing to keep conflict below threshold of a hot war. It plans on winning concessions from its neighbors without firing a single shot by building huge quantity of shiny toys using its over-sized industrial capacity. They are playing from their strength, which is their huge economy & industrial capacity. They are avoiding their weakness, which is actual test of its forces in a long, dirty, drudgy, brutal combat with another professional force.

India should call Chinas bluff. On our Himalayan borders, we have them exactly where we want them to be. We have all the advantage in man, material, short logistical supply lines etc. We should now start salami-slicing against china and move eastward to regain our lost land and let them beg for de-escalation. Forces of Inertia and imprint of 62 defeat is clouding a lot of peoples minds in babudom and goverment. On the eastern front it makes all the sense for us to be the aggressors and let the chinks be on the backfoot. Capturing Lhasa is a lot easier than capturing Gilgil-Baltistan and there are a lot of levers we can use against china, which we havent used before. Tibet and its Indian border is Chinas soft belly. If exposed, its a free reign to conquer han mainland. We control more rungs of escalation ladder now, more than ever before. We have a lot to gain by being hard on China now.
 

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