Pakistan's Terror against the World

Ray

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They can be, simple because they refuse to resist and they are the largest funders of them.
Resistance, it is easy to say, should happen.

To be fair, common people can hardly be in a position to resist. For if that was the case, then even with such a mammoth support for Anna Hazare, corruption in the country should have been over. Not only does corruption continue, the Bill has not even been tabled!! That much for resistance by the people.

Then one cannot superimpose our way of action on Pakistan. Pakistan is an Islamic country and they dare not go against any saying, even if quoted out of context, against Islam. It will be taken as blasphemous and the wrath of God and the people will visit the 'blasphemer'.

Even in our country, the Shah Bano case, which was anti woman got a Constitution Amendment because of pressure from the Islamic bodies and even though India is a secular country, the country could not resist this infamy.

Then take the case of the Maulavi who was thrown out from being the head of the Aligarh seminary, when he praised Modi. This was not for a religious interpretation, but just his personal view. Was there any resistance against the pedagogues? He praised Gujarat's development and that is there for all to see!

Therefore, as I see it, and hopefully I am not wrong, resistance by the people is easier said than done.

What maybe true is that it is time that the Pakistani people did protest against the terrorism that has been unleashed and then slowly turn it into a movement that is against the false interpretation being made by the terrorists. But even for doing so, one has to be ready to die as the Governor of Pakistan Punjab died as also their Minister for Minority Affairs. Are the common Pakistanis, not too deep into religion, ready to die?

Pakistani's believe a weak Afghanistan as a vassal state or as a protectorate is enough it to be strategically useful for Pakistan.
Indeed that is so.

It opens up an uninterrupted avenue to the oil and gas rich Central Asian Republics, as also permits influence peddling in such areas.

Who donates the most to JuD : - The Pakistani public through their various donation collection boxes and centers. The public of pakistan is responsible. It is not Saudi's or ISI/Pak Government which is the largest funders, but the general public.
Given the hysteria of Indian (read Hindu) domination inherited historically, and given the mass of India and its overwhelming population, given that India has surpassed Pakistan in all fields even though Pakistanis thought that they were equally endowed in all respects, and at the same time, finding Pakistan being dubbed by the international comity of nations as a pariah and a failed and rogue state, it only invokes envy and that envy gets translated into impotent anger. Therefore, they feel that the answer lies in giving their zakat to organisations that makes life miserable for India and brings it down to a manageable size to handle.

It is an incorrect manner to get even, but then these are but human foibles.

Having been in Pakistani forums before, let me make it very clear to you Brigadier, this is a tactical retreat from them, this is about making us stop while they regroup. Pakistan as a nation has lost its narrative to the world, it is now lying open and naked. They want their victims, that is us, to support them, while not really changing their attitudes towards us or our concerns.
You maybe right. I am not too well versed in the subtlety of the situation. However, I wonder how a forum can be taken as a vehicle to change public opinion. In fact, no matter which forum it be, one hardly finds any intellectual interaction and instead one observes the whole ballgame as a game of oneupmanship!

I will confess I do not visit Pakistani forums as a matter of routine and therefore I cannot comment on their subtle game, if indeed they are at it. I visit Asim's forum because he is old 'sparring' partner of mine from many a forums. I find some posters on his forum commenting on the situation in Pakistan and ways to solve the issue - the same refrain that you have raised about resistance. Of course, the vast majority are jingos, but then if one just does not care to even acknowledge their presence, one can get a general idea as to what a certain section of Pakistani society, within and without Pakistan, is thinking about as also what is their view on India and other nations around the world.
 
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JayATL

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OT delete ray? hows it offtopic to reply to Elmo ? are you kissing up to the boys at PDF now...heh. That is if you deleted my post reply to elmo... the entire darn thread is taken over by PDF admins claiming this forum should have standards. how was it offtopic to say in so many words- that I will PM you ( elmo)when I see xyz low standrd postings on PDF?
 
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sadhartha

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I have full knowledge about your godforsaken jihadi madrasa system and your public education infrastructure encompassing 'islamiyat and pakistan studies' - with other delusional/violent matter taught to toddlers in pakistan - which has created deluded morons like you who lie and live in denial.

The sophistication on this forum ended the day - demented conspiracy theorists from failed state pakistan started blabbering their 'pakistan studies' mumbo-jumbo on this forum - again I ask - who is buying your shit load of crap? You..Hah on your face.

Why can't I give examples of Adan Sami and other hundreds and thousands of Mujahir/Muslims and Hindus who are coming in hordes to India to take refuge from monster called pakistan. I don't see Indian muslims running to the 'fort of islam' to settle down with the Ummah of the 'land of the pure'? Why? Do you have any shame left or you are as shameless as your 'DOLLAR' hungry - Surrendering Pakistan army the protector of islam and pakistan, which lost half the country?

Shame on pakistan, which was created for muslims and now muslims are running away from this islamic state and are ready to settle in a Kufar 'Dar-ul-Harb' Hindu majority India! Shame on You! Mother of all Irony!

Do I need to remind you what you islamic people of pakistan did to 3 Million Bengali muslims of West pakistan or what you have done to thousands of Baloch, Afghans, Sindhis, KPs, Shias and Ahmedi Muslims et al.....really creation of pakistan and its delusional brainwashed bigoted awam (especially punjabis) is a bane not only on this Planet but for the coming/future generations of humanity.

:frusty::frusty::frusty: useless & illogical post. Lack of knowledge. You may live in your own fictional world.
 

johnee

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Common people under the daze of radical ideologies and ruled by PA are a threat to the world because they invariable play their part willingly or unwillingly, wittingly or unwittingly. To us, the non-pakis, it does not matter.

But if the PA can be removed and if the people can be sanitised from the ideologies, then these people are fine.

Right now, they are a threat.
 

Dovah

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:frusty::frusty::frusty: useless & illogical post. Lack of knowledge. You may live in your own fictional world.

Yesterday afternoon you were in Hawaii, evening you were in Bakistan now you are in Russia...got a JF-17 on your 12th birthday?

Oh, great counter argument to the post by maomao btw.
 

Blackwater

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Yesterday afternoon you were in Hawaii, evening you were in Bakistan now you are in Russia...got a JF-17 on your 12th birthday?

Oh, great counter argument to the post by maomao btw.
No as like other pakistanis, he has terror network in all over the world.:whistle::whistle::whistle:
 

Ray

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where the holy batman did that come from and what did it have to do with the reply I was quoted upon. If you feel I have an Oracle complex, let me quickly diffuse it that much of what i say I say in banter and in tongue and cheek and yes w/ a bit of bluntness added to it. I must say though if indeed your comment is directed at me, because the quoted text from me on your reply was an odd one to illicit such a reply from you, I always welcome thoughtful posts and dare say rarely put my thoughts down in a " one liner".

Btw- I still can't fathom for all the great knowledge perceived or otherwise-you possess, why can't to get to the point a bit more crisper and sooner? if the intent was to take me on as you have in past - why a thesis and not just get to the point?
One could be crisper for those who are quick on the uptake.

I do not find you in that category since you tend to be like a butterfly spreading its wings and collecting marginal pollen.

The thesis is guided by these lines of the Hymn 'Tell me the Old, Old Story'.

Tell me the old, old story of unseen things above,...
Tell me the story simply, as to a little child,


So, to a child one has to be patient, deliberated and expansive!

OT delete ray? hows it offtopic to reply to Elmo ? are you kissing up to the boys at PDF now...heh. That is if you deleted my post reply to elmo... the entire darn thread is taken over by PDF admins claiming this forum should have standards. how was it offtopic to say in so many words- that I will PM you ( elmo)when I see xyz low standrd postings on PDF?
I have not deleted your post for it is immaterial as to what you write.

I don't have to kiss up to anyone anywhere. My posts are adequate for me to hold on my own.

Rationality is not a sin.

One does not have to be rude or vitriolic spewing fire and brimstone to establish oneself as a cyberspace paragon.

PDF admins may say what they want. This is forum of a democratic country and hopefully stands for its principles. However, that does not make the opinions expressed by PDF admins a benchmark for this forum.

That is one subtlety I understand.
 

JayATL

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One could be crisper for those who are quick on the uptake.

I do not find you in that category since you tend to be like a butterfly spreading its wings and collecting marginal pollen.

The thesis is guided by these lines of the Hymn 'Tell me the Old, Old Story'.

Tell me the old, old story of unseen things above,...
Tell me the story simply, as to a little child,


So, to a child one has to be patient, deliberated and expansive!



I have not deleted your post for it is immaterial as to what you write.

I don't have to kiss up to anyone anywhere. My posts are adequate for me to hold on my own.

Rationality is not a sin.

One does not have to be rude or vitriolic spewing fire and brimstone to establish oneself as a cyberspace paragon.

PDF admins may say what they want. This is forum of a democratic country and hopefully stands for its principles. However, that does not make the opinions expressed by PDF admins a benchmark for this forum.

That is one subtlety I understand.
First due apologies on the OT delete allegation, apparently we have some none the wiser admins here too :p j/k.

second- I'm a butterfly with wings >>>> LOL. man... you crack me up. :ROFL: I wish you wrote as such on PDF instead ( it would so much entertaining) vs. of you customary style there

Note : Making style comparison below

write some here

write something again here

and finally write something again here

STYLE :p
 

Awesome

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Ray you know me here the longest... Perhaps you'd recall my education, my first job, my hobbies n all. Please explain to some geniuses here that I'm not an ISI spy :).

Now about contributing to terror...

Yeah its happened...

So did CIA send Bulawi to Pakistan

So did RAW send Sarabjit Singh to Pakistan and lets not forget colonel prohit.

MI6 freakin trained Omar Sheikh who terrorized Americans, Pakistanis and Indians

The Russians sent funds to Taliban's Hamidullah

These are just the examples of the Pakistan, India, Afghanistan region.These big nations with big budgets are screwing people everywhere. Half of the crap they have fessed up to it.

The world is important, but I argue against the promotion of terror as a by product of larger strategies, since we need to promote tenets of freedom. The ideals that terrorists uphold will make us subservient to the Mullahs and then subservient further to the Americans.

Mullahs and Americans they are one and the same, but their net impact on us would also be the same. Lack of freedom.
 

Adux

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What the most inbreds from Pakistan wont ever understand rather admit, Yes there has instances of terrorism en mating from other countries, but all of them even combined will not even come close to the state/public sponsored world wide mayhem caused, the sheer scale and numbers, the institutionalized terrorism. The Jihad Factory of the World, The terorrism factory of the world and supported the Jihad Gulf!
Let the inbreds change their own kind and kin first, before trying to come here and teach us civility and meaning peace. Taaqiya at its best.
 

Adux

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Resistance, it is easy to say, should happen.
They have resistance to Hudood Laws, Salman Taseer ( another snake), Upliftment of minorities. They somehow seem to find fighting strength for all that, but 'Righteousness' , Ziltch, Nada etc etc

To be fair, common people can hardly be in a position to resist. For if that was the case, then even with such a mammoth support for Anna Hazare, corruption in the country should have been over. Not only does corruption continue, the Bill has not even been tabled!! That much for resistance by the people.
Not the same. And Anna Hazarae is a undemocratic tool.

Then one cannot superimpose our way of action on Pakistan. Pakistan is an Islamic country and they dare not go against any saying, even if quoted out of context, against Islam. It will be taken as blasphemous and the wrath of God and the people will visit the 'blasphemer'.
Absolutely fine by me. Then dont expect me to treat these zombies as equals to me. I will leave them no quarter.

Even in our country, the Shah Bano case, which was anti woman got a Constitution Amendment because of pressure from the Islamic bodies and even though India is a secular country, the country could not resist this infamy.

Then take the case of the Maulavi who was thrown out from being the head of the Aligarh seminary, when he praised Modi. This was not for a religious interpretation, but just his personal view. Was there any resistance against the pedagogues? He praised Gujarat's development and that is there for all to see!
All very true Brigadier, but not at the same level ( Let me also add, as a member of the Congress Family, I am absolutely disgusted with them)

Therefore, as I see it, and hopefully I am not wrong, resistance by the people is easier said than done.
You think Indian Hindu's will allow their muslim and christian brethren to be slaughtered? Not going to happen. If we are like that, Why cant they. If they cant, then they are not equal to us. As a General Population.

What maybe true is that it is time that the Pakistani people did protest against the terrorism that has been unleashed and then slowly turn it into a movement that is against the false interpretation being made by the terrorists. But even for doing so, one has to be ready to die as the Governor of Pakistan Punjab died as also their Minister for Minority Affairs. Are the common Pakistanis, not too deep into religion, ready to die?
Common Pakistani's are beyond redemption, and I am not going to take one or two sane one's as the general rule, because it makes me feel good, not look at the reality that is, there is population of hate and my country has to deal with it. We cannot move the damn country out of our neighborhood.



It opens up an uninterrupted avenue to the oil and gas rich Central Asian Republics, as also permits influence peddling in such areas.
We are not going to allow that.

Given the hysteria of Indian (read Hindu) domination inherited historically, and given the mass of India and its overwhelming population, given that India has surpassed Pakistan in all fields even though Pakistanis thought that they were equally endowed in all respects, and at the same time, finding Pakistan being dubbed by the international comity of nations as a pariah and a failed and rogue state, it only invokes envy and that envy gets translated into impotent anger. Therefore, they feel that the answer lies in giving their zakat to organisations that makes life miserable for India and brings it down to a manageable size to handle.
i am not responsbile if their general population are a bunch of zombies who dream up of some stupid hindu bogeyman's. We have done far more than we should to assuage their fears. We are the regional kings, even if we dont want to be. Like it or not.
It is an incorrect manner to get even, but then these are but human foibles.



You maybe right. I am not too well versed in the subtlety of the situation. However, I wonder how a forum can be taken as a vehicle to change public opinion. In fact, no matter which forum it be, one hardly finds any intellectual interaction and instead one observes the whole ballgame as a game of oneupmanship!
I am aware of their tactics and what goes behind the scenes. Unlike most Indian members, most of these pak's are from military families, and they might or will have some connection to a ISI Information campaign. If Chicoms can do it, they can too.

I will confess I do not visit Pakistani forums as a matter of routine and therefore I cannot comment on their subtle game, if indeed they are at it. I visit Asim's forum because he is old 'sparring' partner of mine from many a forums. I find some posters on his forum commenting on the situation in Pakistan and ways to solve the issue - the same refrain that you have raised about resistance. Of course, the vast majority are jingos, but then if one just does not care to even acknowledge their presence, one can get a general idea as to what a certain section of Pakistani society, within and without Pakistan, is thinking about as also what is their view on India and other nations around the world
What you have with him personally is none of my concern, but there will not be any quarter given to him. I say it with all due respects, Brigadier.
 

Daredevil

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Haha, some typical obfuscations are being peddled here to divert the focus away from Pakistan's sponsor of terrorism.

None of the people being blamed have neither participated in mass-murder nor any kind of mayhem in other countries they were being just spies. But on the other hand, the list of terrorist activities of Pakistanis in the foreign countries is perhaps the longest and never ending.

No country supports terrorism actively as Pakistan does. The sheer number of terrorist organizations operating freely despite repeated proscriptions is an indication of the seriousness with which Pakistan deals with terrorism. No wonder then Pakistan has become a victim of its own frankenstein. But Pakistan will always try to blame others for the creation of the frankenstein and live in denial that it was not responsible.
 

Awesome

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What the most inbreds from Pakistan wont ever understand rather admit, Yes there has instances of terrorism en mating from other countries, but all of them even combined will not even come close to the state/public sponsored world wide mayhem caused, the sheer scale and numbers, the institutionalized terrorism. The Jihad Factory of the World, The terorrism factory of the world and supported the Jihad Gulf!
Let the inbreds change their own kind and kin first, before trying to come here and teach us civility and meaning peace. Taaqiya at its best.
lol @ inbreds. As compared to what? Labrador breeds in others? Chihuahua?

So how much terrorism contribution are Chihuahuas okay with? Tell me how much terrorism are you willing to support that makes you turn a blind eye to everything else?
 

Tomcat

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asim meea lets just face it shall we that the terror which is pakistans leading export to the world is an incarnation of your onw paranoid twisted pysche and as a person who has seen who has seen your country implicated in almost all terror attacks in india i dont trust pakistan any more then i trust my debtors on the return of the money they owe me i hope you have heard the saying once bitten shy thats the same with us Indians on pakistan if you ask me i would be rather happy if your country drowns in its own blood because i hate your country with a passion that is only matched by the love for mine as my friend dare devil said
No country supports terrorism actively as Pakistan does. The sheer number of terrorist organizations operating freely despite repeated proscriptions is an indication of the seriousness with which Pakistan deals with terrorism. No wonder then Pakistan has become a victim of its own frankenstein. But Pakistan will always try to blame others for the creation of the frankenstein and live in denial that it was not responsible.
 

Awesome

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asim meea lets just face it shall we that the terror which is pakistans leading export to the world is an incarnation of your onw paranoid twisted pysche and as a person who has seen who has seen your country implicated in almost all terror attacks in india i dont trust pakistan any more then i trust my debtors on the return of the money they owe me i hope you have heard the saying once bitten shy thats the same with us Indians on pakistan if you ask me i would be rather happy if your country drowns in its own blood because i hate your country with a passion that is only matched by the love for mine as my friend dare devil said
lol @ Mian... I can't believe the racial and derogatory slurs that keep spewing out... It's unheard of that such practices are not even opposed.

My argument is that why is anyone being holier than thou. Terrorism is a global problem and globally supported. Its the same thing as you guys claim the UNSC is so non-representative of the world but you want to be a part of it too, not abolish it. You hate Pakistan's terrorism, but want others to continue the same against it.

Lets really face it.

The fundamental problem underneath it all is someone or the other is an enemy of freedom and wants you or me to live a life in a certain way of not their or my own choosing.

In 5 minutes I gave you examples of all the major powers contributing to terrorism in our region, including India. It's irrelevant who did what, its relevant how can you redefine your baseline upon humanistic values where the use of such methods is no longer felt as the need.

No one as a national policy envisions blowing someone up. But it happens. CIA wanted to flirt with terrorists, to gain influence over the anti-Pakistan TTP, something went wrong and they ended up with 6 dead CIA senior agents. Imagine what all they did in conjunction with the TTP where things didn't go wrong.

In Pakistan Musharraf thrust us into a war without national consent and today we're reeling from this fundamental lack of freedom, this lack of choice. You're seeing the same in Assam, Nagaland and of course Kashmir.

Yes terrorists are at fault for targeting innocents, but at some point they were survivors of innocent victims too. Today in FATA religion derives a lot less recruits to Taliban than does "Oh they killed so and so in my family and now I must seek revenge".

Until you're ready to back off your own contributions to terror you will see no change for the good.
 

Adux

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lol @ Mian... I can't believe the racial and derogatory slurs that keep spewing out... It's unheard of that such practices are not even opposed.
Such flow of honey and milk, I failed to see this in your forums. Keep your sermons to yourself.


My argument is that why is anyone being holier than thou.
Because nobody is as bad as you.


Terrorism is a global problem and globally supported. Its the same thing as you guys claim the UNSC is so non-representative of the world but you want to be a part of it too, not abolish it. You hate Pakistan's terrorism, but want others to continue the same against it.
Terrorism against Pakistan; You mean the monster eating the hands that feeds it, We really dont care. You can go nuke yourself.

Lets really face it.
You are a terrorist sympathizer.

The fundamental problem underneath it all is someone or the other is an enemy of freedom and wants you or me to live a life in a certain way of not their or my own choosing.
Sorry the Islamic way of life is unacceptable to the world, Just because a group likes cannibalism , that doesnt mean it will be given the same weightage as democratic process.

In 5 minutes
Are you street magician waiting for PKR 10?

gave you examples of all the major powers contributing to terrorism in our region, including India. It's irrelevant who did what, its relevant how can you redefine your baseline upon humanistic values where the use of such methods is no longer felt as the need.
Nobody really cares about your skewed logic.

No one as a national policy envisions blowing someone up. But it happens. CIA wanted to flirt with terrorists, to gain influence over the anti-Pakistan TTP, something went wrong and they ended up with 6 dead CIA senior agents. Imagine what all they did in conjunction with the TTP where things didn't go wrong
.

What can be more wrong in this world than Pakistan.

In Pakistan Musharraf thrust us into a war without national consent and today we're reeling from this fundamental lack of freedom, this lack of choice.
I wish he didnt, because I would love pick up some beer and popcorn and watch the fireworks.


You're seeing the same in Assam, Nagaland and of course Kashmir.
No, it is not the same.

Yes terrorists are at fault for targeting innocents, but at some point they were survivors of innocent victims too. Today in FATA religion derives a lot less recruits to Taliban than does "Oh they killed so and so in my family and now I must seek revenge".
Ah, here comes the justification of terrorism. Since USA killed my sons who were in Al-Qaeda, I shall seek my revenge on the US. Fuck'em.

Until you're ready to back off your own contributions to terror you will see no change for the good
.

No you are not equal to us paki. You wish. And to think you came here to say words of 'peace' to remove a poster which actually showed your true face. Still parroting, it was the CIA who created Al-Qaeda and Taliban, who many times will these inbreds need to be caught with their pants down for them to know, their game is up.
 
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Yusuf

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Asim,

Do you accept that LeT and its fomr JuD is a terror organization?
Do you accept that Masood Azhar who was released by India under threat of hijack is a terrorist?
Do you accept that Syed Saluddin is a terrorist?
 

Singh

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Asim,

Do you accept that LeT and its fomr JuD is a terror organization?
Do you accept that Masood Azhar who was released by India under threat of hijack is a terrorist?
Do you accept that Syed Saluddin is a terrorist?
How can he ? He said so himself that Indian state is a legitimate target for all kinds of covert or overt attacks. These men are not terrorists, they are soldiers of democracy/islam/jihad/pakistan/freedom struggle...
 

Yusuf

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How can he ? He said so himself that Indian state is a legitimate target for all kinds of covert or overt attacks. These men are not terrorists, they are soldiers of democracy/islam/jihad/pakistan/freedom struggle...
Id like to hear it from the horses mouth. i know what he said. Just answers to this specific questions is what i seek now.
 

Adux

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How can he ? He said so himself that Indian state is a legitimate target for all kinds of covert or overt attacks. These men are not terrorists, they are soldiers of democracy/islam/jihad/pakistan/freedom struggle...
That is all fine and dandy, because we will forment so much trouble for them, they will ask the Chinese to take over the country and run it for them. We will slice up their country into 4-5 pieces, Only Paki inbred tactical brilliance can come up with 1000 pieces (chuckles)! Russian mail order brides phenomenon will look like local courier service, when they hit rock bottom.
 

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