Pakistan occupied Kashmirs Struggle for Freedom

lupgain

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It's your opinion, so fair enough. As far as most Indians are concerned, the entire State of Jammu and Kashmir, including PoK, Gilgit, Aksai Chin and Shaksgam Valley, de jure, belong to the Indian Union. Let there be no doubt about that.

I don't mean to stifle your right to expression, however, please note that we at DFI do not particularly encourage anti-India activities, even if it is in the form of subtle propaganda.

From a more constructive PoV, and also keeping the thread topic in sight, what would you do if you were entrusted with the task of getting PoK back? How would you start? What would your plans be?

From my side the plan would be to:
- Indian Soldiers making base and providing basic facilities, like hospitals, schools, low cost housings in 1st phase
- Should allow business men from Srinagar and J&K to volunteer setting business there and Indian govt providing security and special status to them
1st phase.
- Indian agents should talk to local groups in those areas and make them understand that India is next superpower and they will have bright future if they will join India. Their kids will have an golden opportunity to be part of powerful nation. 2nd Phase
- Provide them work opportunity in Indian States 3rd Phase
- Providing them Autonomous state status 3rd Phase
- Signing a declaration with those states that they are well part of India and will follow indian constitution, but their economy would be free and autonomous 3rd Phase


What do you guys think will this work?
 
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Yusuf

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From my side the plan would be to:
- Indian Soldiers making base and providing basic facilities, like hospitals, schools, low cost housings in 1st phase
- Should allow business men from Srinagar and J&K to volunteer setting business there and Indian govt providing security and special status to them
1st phase.
- Indian agents should talk to local groups in those areas and make them understand that India is next superpower and they will have bright future if
they will join India. Their kids will have an golden opportunity to be part of powerful nation. 2nd Phase
- Provide them work opportunity in Indian States 3rd Phase

What do you guys think will this work?
The army already runs the people to people contact programs and humanitarian relief.

Kashmiris don't need low cost housing provided by others, they already have it.

The "Indian State" provides them jobs. Have a look at th number of people who throng army and police recruitment drives.
The Kashmiris already know who is a better choice between India and Pakistan, not on the basis of who is the next superpower but even basic freedom that thu enjoy here are curtailed on the other side. They know thor economic future lies in India.

What the Kashmiris need to do is revolt against the terrorists and their sponsors. I have not heard the Kashmiri separatists call for independence of PoK from Paki rule. It clearly shows the agenda of the separatists. Ordinary Kashmiris have to see this and throw the separatists out of mainstream politics there by not giving in to any bundh calls etc and completely sideline and in fact trash them. Kashmiris have to revolt against these traitors and clearly tell the world where their choice lies when it comes to India an Pakistan by such actions. In fact they have already told the world where their priorities lie by comin out and vote in large numbers.
 

Yusuf

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'India should stand firm on PoK issue': Yashwant Sinha

Thursday, 23 February 2012 00:00
PNS | New Delhi

Former External Affairs Minister and senior BJP leader Yashwant Sinha said that India should shed its defensive posturing on the issue of Pakistan Occupied Kashmir (POK) and Northern Areas and raise its pitch against the neighbour in the international forum.

Sinha was airing his opinion at the inaugural address of a day-long international seminar 'POK and Northern Areas-Present Status and Way Forward' organised by Centre for Security and Strategy.

"India has for long been one of the good boys in the international arena. Now is the time to behave like a bad boy on the issue of Jammu and Kashmir and send the message loud and clear that India means business," he said stressing on the need for the country to vehemently decry the "ceding of these regions by Pakistan" and press for its undoing.

Lamenting the fact that the world did not know about the plight of the people of POK and the "brutal suppression of dissenting voices there," the BJP leader termed these areas as "dark and secluded."

While the international community knew about Tibet "thanks to the stature of Dalai Lama, it is unaware about POK as there is no Dalai Lama there," he said adding people in India also did not talk about so-called Azad Kashmir or Gilgit and Baltistan which are parts of the Northern Areas.

Tracing the history of the dispute between India and Pakistan on POK and Northern Areas, he said that after India approached the UN in 1949 for resolving the Kashmir issue, the UN passed a resolution. It called for immediate ceasefire between the two countries, vacation of POK and Northern Areas by the Pakistan Army and then a plebiscite in Jammu and Kashmir. However, Pakistan is yet to toe that international line and has instead been aggressively demanding that people of Jammu and Kashmir be allowed the right of self determination, he said.

Initiating the debate, Rajya Sabha MP Dr Chandan Mitra said successive Governments in India followed a "pusillanimous" policy on the Kashmir issue. Moreover, "POK and Northern Areas are hidden away from the world and people are not aware about torture of locals there," he said.

Mitra said these two regions had become "chambers of experimentation" for the Pakistan regime and "there is little knowledge about our neighbourhood in India, leave alone the world."

Mumtaz Khan, a native of POK who had to flee to Canada due to persecution, urged India to play a more pro-active role in drawing the attention of the world to plight of locals and the forcible changing of demographic profile of the region by Islamabad.

'India should stand firm on PoK issue'
The words and sentences used here reflects on what I and many others have been saying for years on DFI. Looks like they are reading and realizing what many young Indians think about Kashmir.
 

Virendra

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Attending the conference were Mumtaz Khan, a native of PoK, who fled to Canada more than two decades ago because of alleged persecution and Senge Hasnan Sering of Gilgit, who currently lives in Washington.
Was this at the same time when Mushy bought Osama and his gang to thrash the Shia uprising in PoK?
 

Nirvana

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Let's be sensible , how can we get POK Back - Military option not possible,Grabbing such a lard chunk of land with the mean's of military against the one who possess Nuclear weapons is not an option

and i simply don't think that those in AK wants to be part of India,there are some Anti-Pak and seperatist faction's in GB which we can support covertly !!
we can Simply pray that Pakistan goes into deep crises and Disintegrates , rest all depends upon will of people living there , after all we don't want to be a "Forced Occupiers " there
 

TTCUSM

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and i simply don't think that those in AK wants to be part of India,there are some Anti-Pak and seperatist faction's in GB which we can support covertly !!
we can Simply pray that Pakistan goes into deep crises and Disintegrates , rest all depends upon will of people living there , after all we don't want to be a "Forced Occupiers " there
The BBC has an article containing several options for resolving the Kashmir conflict.
 

Ray

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Help is actually coming from Pakistan itself!

They are at the game of killing each other!
 

sukhish

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Ray,
you are absolutely right. let them get exausted first
 

JAYRAM

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Why the govt is not bringing huge infra, jobs in J&K..?.. That will be a good teaching for the stone pelting Kashmiri's, Terrorists, for the PoK people & even Pakistan..
This govt is dumb & incompetent.. Situation in J&K now is a lot better than the previous years.. It is this time we have to give them relief in big..
 

Virendra

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Let's be sensible , how can we get POK Back - Military option not possible,Grabbing such a lard chunk of land with the mean's of military against the one who possess Nuclear weapons is not an option

and i simply don't think that those in AK wants to be part of India,there are some Anti-Pak and seperatist faction's in GB which we can support covertly !!
we can Simply pray that Pakistan goes into deep crises and Disintegrates , rest all depends upon will of people living there , after all we don't want to be a "Forced Occupiers " there
Lets be sensible in one more way. I don't care about what people think. Invidiaully they are free beings. They will go where they want and do what they want.
But when we talk about nations, there is something called territorial integrity which cannot be stamped upon (if it were to be a nation).
Every soul in this nation is bound by the contract called Constitution of India and has to seek and protect this territorial integrity. If wishes of secession was all that mattered we would have melted away long back or may be not even had existed as the Union of India.
The people may want to live or leave, they are free to do so but I will never leave the slightest of chance to take back the rightful land of my country. That piece of land belongs to India, has always belonged to India from as past as the known human history takes us to.
That is how I see it sensible

Regards,
Virendra
 

Yusuf

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I have renamed the thread and made it a sticky. Al members requested to fill this thread up with all info regarding problems in POK and their struggle for freedom from the tyrrany of PakJabis. Do our bit to internationalize the issue.
 

JAYRAM

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Gilgit-Baltistan: call for rights

THE Supreme Court has recently taken up the issue of Gilgit-Baltistan. The people of Gilgit are in a desperate mood to witness the solution of this dispute that has put its developmental progress on halt.


The inhabitants of this region have developed a spiritual connection with the state of Pakistan ever since their annexation on November 17, 1947. But, the Constitution of Pakistan has simply turned a blind eye to our rightful provisions. Our courtesy and respect to Pakistan are reciprocated with a flat slap on our faces by the Constitution. We are condemned to be treated as the step-children of this motherland throughout the course of 64 years. In sharp contrast, the Indian constitution embodies an extra status to this region declaring it an integral part of its peninsular body. The historical background reveals the gallant efforts put up by the indigenous movement of Gilgit-Baltistan to liberate its dwellers from the jaws of Sikhs. After the removal of tyrants, those spearheads made an epoch-making decision underpinned by the consent of public to merge into the national mainstream of Pakistan, but we are still thrown out of it like the malarial plasmodium. The heartiest plea of our people is returned back with a label of 'disputed territory' branded on our backs.

This region is deprived of any representation in the Senate or in the National Assembly; a blatant reflection of neglect and bare-faced injustice. Why are we left out from the national mainstream of Pakistan with such an intensity of words? Is it that the blood our forefathers only brought about a change in despots both seeking to suck the potential out of us with impunity? Aren't we becoming a laughingstock or a piece of mockery that shed their blood for a mere notorious label of 'disputed territory'?
I appeal my brothers to send a deep impulse into their hearts and dare to answer the questions raised in the minds of every inhabitant living on the peaks of Gilgit-Baltistan in search of his identity in this world.

REHAN KHAN GILGITI
Rawalpindi

Sense of deprivation

GILGIT-BALTISTAN has been going through turmoil since 1988 due to sectarian violence which is resulting in instability in the region. As a gateway to some of the powerful countries like India, China, Russia, and Central Asian States, Gilgit-Baltistan has geopolitical importance. But despite its importance, it has been politically underestimated since its affiliation with Pakistan.

The result is in front of us: the recent Kohistan killings. The solution we all know is education which is the best remedy for most of our problems.

The government should act proactively and take remedial measures. Gilgit-Baltistan is without a medical, engineering and law college. It is impossible to think of stability in the region where young generation is being diverted towards destructive activities.

The government should take solid steps on an urgent basis to reduce illiteracy and divert the young generation towards building a prosperous Pakistan or we should be ready for a Balochistan-like situation.

AWAIS ALI BAIG HUNZAI
Lahore

Gilgit-Baltistan: call for rights | Newspaper | DAWN.COM
 

JAYRAM

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Gilgit Baltistan: Neither 'in' Pakistan Nor 'of' it?

Priyanka Singh

March 6, 2012

While strategic analysts in India are debating the extent and consequences of the Chinese presence in Gilgit Baltistan (Pakistan occupied Kashmir - PoK), a legal battle is being waged across the Line of Control (LoC), which is relevant to India's claim on PoK. A petition recently filed in the Supreme Court of Pakistan challenges the authority and jurisdiction of the Government of Pakistan on Gilgit Baltistan. The petition has been filed by Dr. Ghulam Abbas, a resident of Gilgit and chairman of the Gilgit Baltistan National Movement.

The current crisis began after the appointment of a retired Judge, who is not a native of Gilgit Baltistan, as the Chief Justice of the Gilgit Baltistan Supreme Appellate Court. This was the second such instance where the local population had objected to the appointment of a judge to this position. The petitioner demanded that Article 60(5, 6) and 60(8) of the Self Governance Order be declared null and void. These specific clauses invest absolute authority in the Chairman of the Gilgit Baltistan Council, i.e. the Prime Minister of Pakistan, and virtually the Government of Pakistan, to make such appointments.

The Supreme Court not only admitted the petition, but also in very clear terms asked the Attorney General whether it was possible for the President of Pakistan (under Article 248 of the Pakistani constitution) to issue such political orders for Gilgit Baltistan. To this the Attorney General replied that since Gilgit Baltistan does not have a direct representation in the federal government, the President issued the order on behalf of the government.

Gilgit Baltistan (till 2009 it was referred to as the Northern Areas by the Government of Pakistan) does not find mention in the Constitution of Pakistan and it is neither independent nor has a provincial status. This huge territory, part of the erstwhile princely state of Jammu and Kashmir, has been under Pakistan's control since 1947. It is currently governed by the Gilgit-Baltistan Empowerment and Self-Governance Order introduced by the Pakistan government in August 2009. The package was introduced mainly to assuage the prevailing feeling of neglect among the people of the region, and made nominal changes in the political system such as restoring the original nomenclature of Gilgit Baltistan, which was one of the long standing demands of the local population. Currently, the region has an elected assembly and a council headed by the Prime Minister of Pakistan. This council wields all the powers and controls the resources and revenue accrued from the region. Added to this, the government of the region is under the overall control of the federal ministry of the Kashmir Affairs and Gilgit Baltistan (KAGB).

It was in this context that the petition was filed and the Supreme Court bench asked the federal government and the Ministry of KAGB to provide a report on the political status of Gilgit Baltistan within a period of 15 days.

The petition has unleashed an animated debate in the political circles in Gilgit Baltistan. The issue dominated the proceedings of the region's Legislative Assembly in the following days. Legislators articulated their views by putting forward two viable options: either the Gilgit-Baltistan Empowerment and Self-Governance Order be given some kind of a legal cover, or the region be given the status of the so-called AJK (Azad Jammu & Kashmir) which is ruled under a separate constitution. Some expressed their apprehension that the Empowerment and Self-Governance package order was provisional, and until it is legalised it may be repealed anytime to suit the whims and fancies of successive governments in Islamabad. Some went to the extent of calling Gilgit Baltistan a fake province with no constitutional endorsement. A basic point which emerged from the discussion was that till the time Gilgit Baltistan remains 'disputed', it cannot be assimilated as an additional province of Pakistan.

The Law Minster of Gilgit Baltistan, Wazir Shakil, tried to downplay the whole issue by stating that since the order was a presidential order, it could not be abolished. The Chief Minister, Syed Mehdi Shah, however tried to build consensus by urging political allies to insist upon the federal leadership to take up the matter in Islamabad's parliament pursuing permanent status for Gilgit Baltistan.

This political deadlock is not a case in isolation. The people of Gilgit Baltistan are disillusioned with the way Pakistan is administering the region and the local leadership has rejected the political set-up provided under the empowerment package. This order, they feel, has failed to meet their political demands and address the socio economic problems. Earlier, the State Subject Rule was abolished by former Prime Minister Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto to facilitate outsiders acquiring land and assets in the region. Later, the ethnic composition of the region was tampered with by the Zia-ul-Haq-sponsored anti-Shia forces; the number of Shias in this otherwise predominantly Shia region was reduced drastically. The attack on Shia pilgrims in Kohistan on February 28, 2012, while they were on their way back to Gilgit Baltistan, is a pointer to the continuing threats the Shias face even today. In this particular case, at least 16 people were forced to disembark from the bus and were brutally shot to death.

Political problems in Gilgit Baltistan have existed for long, and today the situation is further complicated by growing external interference from China and innumerable instances of resource-drain organised by Islamabad. People in Gilgit Baltistan have expressed their resentment over the increasing Chinese involvement in the region and view it as an unwelcome intrusion. The Gilgit Baltistan diaspora has, in recent years, played an active role in creating awareness on these issues via the electronic media, dedicated websites and blogs, etc.

What appears to be of interest here is the claim by the people of Gilgit Baltistan that the region does not belong to Pakistan. If Pakistan concedes that Gilgit Baltistan is a disputed territory, it will have to give it a separate status like AJK. This is the moot point emerging from the ensuing political debate in the entire PoK. This is in congruence with an earlier statement issued by Pakistan's Ministry of Foreign Affairs (MOFA) terming the territory as "disputed" in response to the Indian Ministry of External Affairs of India statement objecting to the building of the Diamer Bhasha dam in PoK in 2006. India has for long being insisting that Chinese involvement in Gilgit Baltistan is unwarranted since the territory is disputed, to which the Chinese (encouraged by Pakistan) pay little heed. Hence, the current debate in PoK, in a way, validates India's position and claim on PoK.

A fresh debate in India needs to be initiated from this point. India's position that Gilgit Baltistan is disputed stands corroborated by developments in PoK. Gilgit Baltistan and the so called AJK are parts of the Indian state of Jammu & Kashmir. After a span of more than six decades since the princely state of J&K acceded to India, this Indian state has evolved with its political processes progressing well. This is so because India has allowed political freedom in J&K. In comparison, Pakistan has failed to address the aspirations of the people under subjugation in PoK leading to frequent political outbursts as being witnessed now. These outbursts are only likely to grow given Pakistan's indifference towards PoK as a whole in combination with its internal security dynamics and external preoccupations.

Add your comment - Reply to comment | Institute for Defence Studies and Analyses

Gilgit Baltistan: Neither 'in' Pakistan Nor 'of' it? | Institute for Defence Studies and Analyses
 

tramp

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India needs to take a no-nonsense stand against anybody with terrorists links supporting Kashmir insurgency ... including leaders like Imran Khan who keeps visiting India but goes back and adds fuel to fire in Kashmir with his statements!!

Shouldn't R&AW have a nice little chat with him and other similar leaders about what they know about Hafeez Sayeed etc....?
 

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European Parliament’s Kashmir Week highlights Indian atrocities - Pakistan State Times

European Parliament in Brussels, Belgium organized a Kashmir EU Week to highlight Indian atrocities and human rights' violations by Indian forces in occupied Kashmir.
Eminent scholars and writers from around the world participated in the event where amongst many other activities, a seminar was also arranged on Kashmir.
There was a general consensus amongst the participants that such tactics of suppression upon Muslims in Indian Held Kashmir do not get unnoticed by Muslims around the globe.
If such brutalities continue, Muslims from other countries may all stand up for Kashmir cause, said a message received hereyesterday.
The speakers were also unanimous in concluding that peace in Afghanistan is directly linked with an amicable solution of Kashmir dispute.
Scholar Ms Laura Schuurmans, a Dutch Research Analyst termed the geo-political implications of Kashmir dispute a grave global concern as this dispute can no longer be considered a bilateral dispute between India and Pakistan.
She wondered as how it is possible that on one hand the international community raised East Timor issue so fervently but continues to keep its eyes closed on Kashmir settlement that presents a real and present threat to regional peace and security.–APP
 

JBH22

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If such brutalities continue, Muslims from other countries may all stand up for Kashmir cause, said a message received hereyesterday.
Should we pee in our pants?

Those who could not live in India got their share its called Pakistan and Bangladesh.
 

Defenceindia2010

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European Parliament's Kashmir Week highlights Indian atrocities - Pakistan State Times

European Parliament in Brussels, Belgium organized a Kashmir EU Week to highlight Indian atrocities and human rights' violations by Indian forces in occupied Kashmir.
Eminent scholars and writers from around the world participated in the event where amongst many other activities, a seminar was also arranged on Kashmir.
There was a general consensus amongst the participants that such tactics of suppression upon Muslims in Indian Held Kashmir do not get unnoticed by Muslims around the globe.
If such brutalities continue, Muslims from other countries may all stand up for Kashmir cause, said a message received hereyesterday.
The speakers were also unanimous in concluding that peace in Afghanistan is directly linked with an amicable solution of Kashmir dispute.
Scholar Ms Laura Schuurmans, a Dutch Research Analyst termed the geo-political implications of Kashmir dispute a grave global concern as this dispute can no longer be considered a bilateral dispute between India and Pakistan.
She wondered as how it is possible that on one hand the international community raised East Timor issue so fervently but continues to keep its eyes closed on Kashmir settlement that presents a real and present threat to regional peace and security.–APP
My immediate reaction :pound:
 

tangkheso tamai

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I am sure you don't :D

Sir Kashmir has to be solved using novel ideas and by that I certainly don't mean the Mushy MMS kind of. That was a sell out. We need it resolved in out favor from a position of strength.

I hope people like Galaxy who are in touch with BJP cadre can take this idea up and may be BJP makes it its manifesto. BJP has my vote if it can get Kashmir back, or at least puts forward and idea to get it back. I can't expect this from the congress.
Sir, you can't blame on any party. But the citizen of Kashmir must take it serious and aware. Present government can take up but there is many pro's and con's with the people of Kashmir. They must know' janani janm bhumi swarga seh Mahan hai'.
 

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