New Assault Rifles for Indian Army

[Kunal Biswas]

Ghataks aka Indian AKMs are only subtitudes for Carbine, Carbine are for CQB purpose, Ghataks are themselves are mid term solution for carbines ..

SVD are marksman rifle or DMR in modern nomenclature, Their replacement is needed with some rifle with common rounds with machine-guns ..

Ghataks are to equip the Paramilitary in Naxal areas as there are reports that CRPF is dismayed at the performance of INSAS in CT ops ,citing the high stoppages when compared with that of x-95 and AKMs.PSGs are good but bulky also like SVD it doesn't have an integral bipood though its variat MSG90 have.For snipers the future is of .338 lapua rounds coz they have more range and fire power than usual 7.62 NATO bolt action rifles,but less weight than a .50 caliber weapon.The RFI will be for a single LMG to replace all machine guns.Negevs are in use with MARCOS,GARUDS,swat teams of Punjab,chattisgarh,Octopus unit of hyderabad.Only PARA don't use them as they have abundance of captured PKMs .

 

[Kunal Biswas]

It will be selected when ready, Their are no news about latest developments though ..

Any information abt #mciws sir....why nt army select mciws

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Their is ongoing miniaturization of rail guns for tanks, In times to come we may see the same technology in hands of Infantry ..

Edited: How about a gun firing energy beams no issue of carrying ammunition and ammunition getting exausted

So there is still scope in this field aswell.

 

[ezsasa]

@Kunal Biswas w.r.t rail gun by india

Hope you are not kidding, Somehow i have a feeling Rail Gun developed by India is not going to happen in the next 20 years.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

I was not talking about Indian development but global ..

It will take no less than 50 years to put this new technology in practice at Infantry level, Again Globally ..

@Kunal Biswas w.r.t rail gun by india

Hope you are not kidding, Somehow i have a feeling Rail Gun developed by India is not going to happen in the next 20 years.

 

[pmaitra]

But the question is when will that banana fall from the tree ? and who will manufacture it ?

Still you import following ammunition :
Carts 9 mm Ball
Carts 7.62 MM Steel Core Bullets
Carts SA 7.62 MM B- 32
Carts 7.72 MM T-46
12.7 HE (Ball)
7.62 Sniper Amn

Calibre is actually one of the trend areas w.r.t. small arms development. Here is an excerpt from an article from 2009.

In the past decade, small arms development has primarily followed three main avenues. Setting the unique and specialist development as the main thrust has led to research and development of small, easily concealed micro-weapons.

The second initiative has been to create “carbine” versions of existing assault weapons and to develop new “Bull Pup” assault weapons which have been designed to shortened assault rifle without a significant lack of potency.

The final, and most recent, development has been the renewed search for a new infantry battle rifle that allows the soldier on the ground to extend the 300m kill range to 600m. The general drive for this need was the higher casualty rates in battles where combatants were in close proximity. Military commanders want to reduce casualties by using superior stand off ranges of the battle rifle to decisively deal with enemy forces with less risk to their own soldiers.

 

[SajeevJino]

Ghataks are to equip the Paramilitary in Naxal areas as there are reports that CRPF is dismayed at the performance of INSAS in CT ops ,citing the high stoppages when compared with that of x-95 and AKMs.

aww..looks good..

Don't know about the performance as it is supplied to only Navy and Coast Guard to replace Sterlings.Unless it is inducted into CAPF/army its not going to see any real action.Caliber is 5.56x30 ,inferior to 5.56 NATO but far better than 9mms.

Yeah Rifles in the Hands of Coast Guard just a Show piece ..!!

PSGs are good but bulky also like SVD it doesn't have an integral bipood though its variat MSG90 have.For snipers the future is of .338 lapua rounds coz they have more range and fire power than usual 7.62 NATO bolt action rifles,but less weight than a .50 caliber weapon.

Recommendation of Some rifles with .338 lapua Bullets

Seems quite damn size..!!

The RFI will be for a single LMG to replace all machine guns.

looks good..~~

Negevs are in use with MARCOS,GARUDS,swat teams of Punjab,chattisgarh,Octopus unit of hyderabad.

even Police force too want the Suppressing fire Support

Only PARA don't use them as they have abundance of captured PKMs .

Time to arm them too..!!

Nice explanations @ALBY ..thanks .!!

 

[SajeevJino]

Ghataks aka Indian AKMs are only subtitudes for Carbine, Carbine are for CQB purpose, Ghataks are themselves are mid term solution for carbines

so they will replace the Ghataks soon, when they find the alternate
..

SVD are marksman rifle or DMR in modern nomenclature, Their replacement is needed with some rifle with common rounds with machine-guns ..

Sir I Think, those machine guns comes with mostly 7.62x51 mm, if we use the same Bullet size for Sniper. It's also makes the Sniper as DMR.

But I feel @ALBY 's option is best using .338 lapua magnums. for dedicated sniper support.

or If I'm mistaken.. do we have two separate requirements, DMR and Sniper

 

[pmaitra]

Dragunov and PKM do have interchangeable rounds - the 7.62x54R.

In India, the 5.56mm NATO is used for both INSAS AR and INSAS LMG. We do not have a sniper rifle in 5.56mm NATO calibre, and I am not sure whether this is realistic. We also have the 7.62x51 NATO rounds, that could be used by Brens and FN-FALs, which could be considered sniper rifles, although they are not exactly sniper rifles.

 

[SajeevJino]

Dragunov and PKM do have interchangeable rounds - the 7.62x54R. In India, the 5.56mm NATO is used for both INSAS AR and INSAS LMG. We do not have a sniper rifle in 5.56mm NATO calibre, and I am not sure whether this is realistic.

Yeah it seems we used the DMR for Sniper roles ..!

 

[Bhadra]

Most of the troops in India are using AK-47. Problem is whether we are producing any ammunition for it (7.62X39) in the numbers required ?

 

[pmaitra]

Most of the troops in India are using AK-47. Problem is whether we are producing any ammunition for it (7.62X39) in the numbers required ?

Most of the troops are not equipped with AKMs, but considering AKMs are used in COIN, it is possible that the 7.62x39mm rounds are expended in larger numbers.

 

[Bhadra]

Most of the troops are not equipped with AKMs, but considering AKMs are used in COIN, it is possible that the 7.62x39mm rounds are expended in larger numbers.

All troops in J&K, NE, AR, CPOs in COIN, RPF, SFs etc have weapons that fire 7.62X39 bullets.

Their number is larger than many Armies in the world. I am aware that OFB has started manufacturing 7.62X39 but how was asking whether that is sufficient or we are still importing that ammunition.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

All troops in CT areas use OFB grade ammunition for both 7.62M43 and 5.56mm, The production started after 2005 if i am not wrong ..

AK usage is strictly in CT environment and its issue, Rest of the Army and Paramilitary and Police use 1B1, AK does not even count 1/4th amount of total compare to 1B1s ..

Most of the troops in India are using AK-47.

Their number is larger than many Armies in the world.

 

[Hari Sud]

There is a need of an update on Assault rifle front:

I have read somewhere that the imported version of Colt, Galil, Bareta etc. failed under one or the other circumstances in Indian conditions.

Is that right or wrong?

If the imports are not upto the standards then the Ishapore version of Ghatak I.e. modified AK-47 has been approved. It met all the standards.

Is this right or wrong?

How many Ghatak rifles are needed? How many have been ordered to be produced. What section of the army is getting this new improved Ghatak rifle.

I am assuming that Ghatak rifle is not replacing either the battle rifle INSAS or Carbines which are also due for replacement.

Is this right or wrong?

If somebody of the caliber of Kunal Biswas or Ray or Lethalforce, summarize all these forty pages of this thread, it will end all the confusion. This summary will end further conversation on this thread. People still continue to foul mouth INSAS rifle. Instead they should be foul mouthing Colt, Baretta or Galil for being tall on claims and short on performance. By the way, where are the arms merchants whose rifles have failed to perform.

 

[SajeevJino]

.

So far my understanding

Assault Rifle - INSAS - MCIWS
CQB- AK Series - TAR 21, M4, AMOGH , Ghatak

 

[Kunal Biswas]

1. It is true they all failed in Thar and high altitude Indian conditions ...

2. Ghatak was design for Paramilitary forces and its design as per their need, Ghatak will stop further expensive imports of AKs..

3. 50,000 orders are given for first batch, +3000 are on the way for delivery, INSAS Excalibur is being seriously taken for 1B1 replacement and Assam rifle is presently fielding this Rifle ..

There is a need of an update on Assault rifle front:

1. I have read somewhere that the imported version of Colt, Galil, Bareta etc. failed under one or the other circumstances in Indian conditions.

Is that right or wrong?

2. If the imports are not upto the standards then the Ishapore version of Ghatak I.e. modified AK-47 has been approved. It met all the standards.

Is this right or wrong?

3. How many Ghatak rifles are needed? How many have been ordered to be produced. What section of the army is getting this new improved Ghatak rifle.

I am assuming that Ghatak rifle is not replacing either the battle rifle INSAS or Carbines which are also due for replacement.

Is this right or wrong?

If somebody of the caliber of Kunal Biswas or Ray or Lethalforce, summarize all these forty pages of this thread, it will end all the confusion. This summary will end further conversation on this thread. People still continue to foul mouth INSAS rifle. Instead they should be foul mouthing Colt, Baretta or Galil for being tall on claims and short on performance. By the way, where are the arms merchants whose rifles have failed to perform.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

At the moment, Excalibur is designated for replacing 1B1 from Infantry and Ghatak to fill the role of AKs in paramilitary forces ..

MICWS has a long way to finish lengthy trails, Till then Excalibur will be used ..

 

[ALBY]

AK with ecotech sight,p rails,foregrip and flash light spotted.

 

[ezsasa]

AK with ecotech sight,p rails,foregrip and flash light spotted.

Is the AK one of our's or captured ones?

 

[Kunal Biswas]

RAKSHA MANTRI VISITS ARMY UNITS IN NORTHERN COMMAND

The Defence Minister Mr Manohar Parrikar visited Army formations of Northern Command accompanied by the Gen Dalbir Singh, COAS. He visited Srinagar, where he was briefed by the GOC of Chinar Corps on measures being taken by the Army to prevent infiltration and the operation being undertaken in the Area. Op Sadbhavna and various welfare activities by the Army in the State were also highlighted during the briefing.

Source : https://www.facebook.com/Indianarmy.adgpi

Is the AK one of our's or captured ones?