New Assault Rifles for Indian Army

[Gessler]

Their real available budget is much more than ours because they don't import stuff like us

Plus, they are not a manpower-bloated force either.

 

[vampyrbladez]

If IA gets watered-down AK103/203 and PA ends up with AK-15, that will surely be joke of the century. And let's not think the Russians won't pull it off, if they get a good deal (to include leverage over PA generals, you can bet Russian intel would love that), they will certainly sell.

If that happens IA will simply stop paying royalty and make AK 15 clones in the same fashion as the Trichy Assault Rifle. Russians will scream, rage and finally have to give in. 750,000 (Indian Army) vs some 100,000 (Pakistan Army) numbers in orders.

The AK - 203 is just a souped up AK - 103 which in turn is a souped up AKM which in turn is a souped up AK 47. We already make milled receiver Trichy Assault Rifles modelled on the M1F41 Bulgarian take on the AK 103 series.

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

Some points I would like to discuss;
The acquisition of small firearms is getting crazy like IAF process, may be a logistic nightmare at the horizon.
a) Assault Rifle : AK 203 plain vanilla model
b) Carbine: Caracal
c) DMR: Sig Sauer
d) LMG: Negev
Now why not a single set of family weapons is inducted, afaik AK200 series provides for carbine,assault rifle, SAW etc. Having a single set of weapons improves logistic commonality, reduce production cost through economies of scale etc.

Second point wrt AK-203 plain vanilla models. For COIN troops or combat troops the AK 203 with all the gadgets makes sense but the logistic fellows etc can do decent job with the plain vanilla model. Save lots of unnecesary expenditure to give the gadgets etc.

Eastern command(china) and Northern command(pak in mountains) basically will be equipped with frontline sig sauer 716 with optics.Same .51 round as the negev lmg.So no logistics nightmare.
RR gets AKs with optics.Special forces their own equipment SCAR etc.
All the rest get AK-203.Optics availibility depending on funds.Thats why IA AK203 hasnt bothered with full picatinny rails.There will hardly be an instance where all 3 picatinny rails are needed for these troops ak-203 is meant for.Its a simple,reliable,familiar gun with good metallurgy and excellent performance and accuracy at non optics ranges.

 

[Raj Malhotra]

We are buying Russian Crap at 5x the market rate while we have:-

Trichy
Isapore
MCIWS
SSS

All 100% Indian Rifles in 7.62x39 caliber

 

[Blue Water Navy]

We are buying Russian Crap at 5x the market rate while we have:-

Trichy
Isapore
MCIWS
SSS

All 100% Indian Rifles in 7.62x39 caliber

Because all these factories are unable to provide a reliable copy of AK47! Forget the concept of getting a new rifle from them. They don't even provide a good copy.

 

[WolfPack86]

Final Contract for AK-203 Assault Rifle Set to Be Finalised Shortly – Top Indian Defence Official
Russian assault rifles will replace the country’s home-made and outdated INSAS rifle. The Indian Army has previously made several attempts to replace the rifle but failed. India and Russia are set to sign the final commercial contract for the purchase of the AK-203 assault rifle soon with all price issues now finalised, according to an Indian Army official.“Most of the contentious issues are resolved. We will decide on price bid very shortly,” the official who wished to remain unidentified told Sputnik on Thursday. Indo-Russia Rifles Limited, established between the Ordnance Factory Board (OFB), the Kalashnikov Concern and Rosoboronexport — the Russian state agency for military exports — will manufacture the 7.62×39 mm Russian weapon at the Korwa Ordnance Factory in Uttar Pradesh. Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi inaugurated the facility last March. The official said the infantry division has identified a total requirement of 670,000 AK-203 rifles for the army including 100,000 imports while the rest will be manufactured at the Indian facility. “There will be certain numbers which will come as semi knocked down kits and subsequently we will looking at developing weapons here in India both for the indigenous requirement within India as also with the capability to export them subsequently,” Major General J.S. Sandhu, chief of Infantry, Indian Army, said. Sandhu said there is a transfer of technology incorporated in the deal and it is expected that a large part of the requirement will be fulfilled by manufacturing rifles in India. Each rifle is expected to cost around $1,100 which includes the cost of technology transfer and of setting up the manufacturing unit. Last March, Modi said the AK-203 rifles will help the country’s security forces fight militants in counter-terror operations. The AK-203 is the latest and most advanced version of the AK-47 rifle which will replace INSAS. Indian security personnel had often complained in the past of jamming, magazine cracking etc. at higher altitudes in the Himalayas.
https://idrw.org/final-contract-for...rtly-top-indian-defence-official/#more-221891

 

[Wisemarko]

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[nongaddarliberal]

If that happens IA will simply stop paying royalty and make AK 15 clones in the same fashion as the Trichy Assault Rifle. Russians will scream, rage and finally have to give in. 750,000 (Indian Army) vs some 100,000 (Pakistan Army) numbers in orders.

The AK - 203 is just a souped up AK - 103 which in turn is a souped up AKM which in turn is a souped up AK 47. We already make milled receiver Trichy Assault Rifles modelled on the M1F41 Bulgarian take on the AK 103 series.

Pakis will stick to some 7.62 NATO rifle as the standard rifle. They want AK's for counter insurgency like us.

 

[rkhanna]

Pakis will stick to some 7.62 NATO rifle as the standard rifle. They want AK's for counter insurgency like us.

The Pakis will most likely settle on the HK416/7 derived Turkish Small Arms System.

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

We are buying Russian Crap at 5x the market rate while we have:-

Trichy
Isapore
MCIWS
SSS

All 100% Indian Rifles in 7.62x39 caliber

Russian metallurgy tech transfer.And also ruskies robbing us.Combination of both.

 

[Aniruddha Mulay]

The Pakis will most likely settle on the HK416/7 derived Turkish Small Arms System.

Then it's bad news for us as HK416 is considered one of the world's best AR.

 

[rkhanna]

Then it's bad news for us as HK416 is considered one of the world's best AR.

No such thing as Best. Better sure. Also the Sig and the Caracal are improvements over the 416. Read up on the history. Both the 716 and 816 were designed and developed by the same 2 engineers who designed the 416/7.

 

[Aniruddha Mulay]

No such thing as Best. Better sure. Also the Sig and the Caracal are improvements over the 416. Read up on the history. Both the 716 and 816 were designed and developed by the same 2 engineers who designed the 416/7.

Any idea as to how many carbines are going to be ordered other than the 94,000 CAR 816.
Bcoz we have a huge requirement of carbines?

 

[abingdonboy]

32 M4A1s will go into Indian military with NASAMS purchase.

Wtf, just 32? What kind of an order is that? The Mizoram police have bought more than that a couple of years ago and it wasn't even in the news.

 

[Atcjurvin]

Wtf, just 32? What kind of an order is that? The Mizoram police have bought more than that a couple of years ago and it wasn't even in the news.

It must be bought for special forces.

 

[rkhanna]

Any idea as to how many carbines are going to be ordered other than the 94,000 CAR 816.
Bcoz we have a huge requirement of carbines?

No Idea. 94K will go to SF/Ghatak/Officer Cadre on front line units. IMO Locally made 556 Carbines (OFB/SSW etc) will equip the rest. I dont see why Tank Crews, Helicopter Crews cannot get the X-95 (Locally called Zitarra if made by OFB) as PDWs.

 

[Aniruddha Mulay]

No Idea. 94K will go to SF/Ghatak/Officer Cadre on front line units. IMO Locally made 556 Carbines (OFB/SSW etc) will equip the rest. I dont see why Tank Crews, Helicopter Crews cannot get the X-95 (Locally called Zitarra if made by OFB) as PDWs.

Now even SSS has their P-72 carbine. Can fire both 5.56x45 and 7.62x39 ammo.

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

Then it's bad news for us as HK416 is considered one of the world's best AR.

Pakis dont have money for that.At best they can get czech bren.

 

[Gessler]

Wtf, just 32? What kind of an order is that? The Mizoram police have bought more than that a couple of years ago and it wasn't even in the news.

It must be bought for special forces.

It's part of the NASAMS deal. Pretty sure they're for the ground security element of the launchers and GCS. Americans like to bundle together all required items like that, so it's a comprehensive package.

 

[abingdonboy]

It's part of the NASAMS deal. Pretty sure they're for the ground security element of the launchers and GCS. Americans like to bundle together all required items like that, so it's a comprehensive package.

That was my thought too but 32 is such a small number it's very odd.