Main Battle Tanks and Armour Technology

If Tanks have to evolve, which path they should follow?

  • Light Vehicles-Best for mobility

    Votes: 25 7.3%
  • Heavy Armour-Can take heavy punishment.

    Votes: 57 16.7%
  • Modular Design-Allowing dynamic adaptions.

    Votes: 198 58.1%
  • Universal Platform-Best for logistics.

    Votes: 61 17.9%

  • Total voters
    341

militarysta

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OK, so two final drivers whit two gearbox -but it doesn't change the fact that lighter (mucht lighter -circa 8t) Al-Kchalid (Chalid) whit 1200HP 6TD-2 have 10s. time for 0-32km/h, while mucht heavier Leo-2A4 whit 1500HP have 6s. You said that avaible power on drive sprockets is the same for MB873 and 6TD-2, ok You know very good ukrainian tank industry, so the reson of sucht big difrences is diffrent then in HP. Im interested what can be a reson -IMHO just in Nm vaue avaible in engine, but it can be wrong.

More or less it's interested how very big and heavy MB873 have still better perforamces then mucht younger and compact construction. Of course sucht huge engine and transmision give us heavier and mucht bigger tank, but mobility is better, and service time is still very very good.
 
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Andrei_bt

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very very good
No, MB873 has the same output as much lighter and compact engine. It is a huge drawback, something more advanced should be considered for future, but, of course I clearly accept that you may acclaim German engine advantages better, as it is in service in Poland.
 

The Last Stand

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Guys, Newbie question. I have a question on an entirely unrelated topic to what you are discussing here.
Supposedly, the Al Khalid 1 can carry 49 rounds of 125 mm, 7100 rounds of 7.62 and 1500 rounds of 12.7. Can all of that ammo be safely stored? I thought that Al-Khalid was already cramped. Will a penetrating hit not make the tank's ammo cook off?

Should I change this question to another thread?

P.S - I ask too many questions :namaste:
 
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Damian

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Guys, Newbie question. I have a question on an entirely unrelated topic to what you are discussing here.
Supposedly, the Al Khalid 1 can carry 49 rounds of 125 mm, 7100 rounds of 7.62 and 1500 rounds of 12.7. Can all of that ammo be safely stored? I thought that Al-Khalid was already cramped. Will a penetrating hit not make the tank's ammo cook off?

Should I change this question to another thread?

P.S - I ask too many questions :namaste:
Al Khalid do not have safe storage, in case of armor perforation, it will most probably end with ammunition cook off and whole crew will be cooked.
 

militarysta

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Damian wejdź na NFoW
Tak szybciutko.
Spawa ad nasze Leopard-2 robi siÄ™ ciekawa.
 

Andrei_bt

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Guys, Newbie question. I have a question on an entirely unrelated topic to what you are discussing here.
Supposedly, the Al Khalid 1 can carry 49 rounds of 125 mm, 7100 rounds of 7.62 and 1500 rounds of 12.7
It has much more internal turret space comparing to T-72
 

The Last Stand

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Thanks a lot Damian! :hail: BTW, is the Naiza round going to be effective on the T-72 Ajeya ? I followed Al-Khalid threads on pakistan defence and they claim that the DU round can penetrate any Indian T-series tank. Will hear tomorrow. Thanks in advance folks. :wave:
 

Damian

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Thanks a lot Damian! :hail: BTW, is the Naiza round going to be effective on the T-72 Ajeya ? I followed Al-Khalid threads on ----------- and they claim that the DU round can penetrate any Indian T-series tank. Will hear tomorrow. Thanks in advance folks. :wave:
Naiza should be capable to penetrate around 550mm RHA @2,000m, so it should be effective against T-72 Ajeya as it is just T-72M1, currently installed ERA is of a light ERA type not effective against such type of threats, this is why at least "Kontakt-5" used on Indian T-90S tanks, should be installed, to make protection of T-72M1 more effective.
 

farhan_9909

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They have transmission from Ukraine, no french transmission.
in both Basic Ak as well as the Ak1 the transmission is french

BASIC AK=SESM ESM500 5-speed automatic

Right now i dont remember.though it had something like 3000 at the end. the AK1 was initially upgraded for Saudi arabia but as the deal didnt went through with few more modification it entered into mass production for PA
 

farhan_9909

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Guys, Newbie question. I have a question on an entirely unrelated topic to what you are discussing here.
Supposedly, the Al Khalid 1 can carry 49 rounds of 125 mm, 7100 rounds of 7.62 and 1500 rounds of 12.7. Can all of that ammo be safely stored? I thought that Al-Khalid was already cramped. Will a penetrating hit not make the tank's ammo cook off?

Should I change this question to another thread?

P.S - I ask too many questions :namaste:
and yes al khalid does has safety ammo bins
courtesy nabil

Armor protection is modular, allowing for quick battle damage repairs and improvement as more advanced armor becomes available or heavier armor is desired. Frontal armor is composite and of Pakistani design, with side armor being spaced; it is of a more modern design than that on the Al-Zarrar and lighter in weight. The turret front, turret sides, glacis, and hull sides have lugs for ERA. Attention was paid to land mine damage in the form of thickened floor armor. The ammunition is carried in armored bins, and virtually the entire vehicle has thick Kevlar anti-spalling blankets. The engine also has a thick bulkhead separating it from the crew compartment. An automatic explosion and fire suppression system is provided, and the crew has an NBC overpressure system; the engine compartment and ammunition bins have their own systems of the same sort. The Al-Khalid has a laser detection system that can automatically trigger smoke grenades to block the laser, and a radar warning system that can give the crew a chance to take evasive action.


Pakistani Tanks



older Naiza is a past tense

From desto archieves

Pakistan's new generation MBT, the Al-Khalid II is a generational leap in capability over every tank Pakistan has employed with the possible exceptions of the Al-Khalid and T-80UD.

The tank is externally very similar to the Al-Khalid, due to the success of it's basic external design (though the turret's volume is slightly larger). Internally, however, the tank is not nearly as similar. While only 55% of the Al-Khalid's components were essentially new (the rest were derived from existing designs), the new Al-Khalid II utilizes no components from any MBT other then the Al-Khalid. 35% of it's components were not in the Al-Khalid. This makes the Al-Khalid II a substantially superior tank. Near every component has been changed in some way, some minor, some major. The fire-control system has been refined and improved in it's speed at acquiring targets and making firing available in all conditions, particularly at high-speed over rough terrain. The commander is now available to acquire two targets independently, as opposed to one in the Al-Khalid. The laser-range finder has been made more robust, while the night-vision systems and all sights have been made more sensitive.
In general, near all components have been made more robust, as part of the Army's drive to make the tank an ultra-reliable marvel of engineering. This is partially necessitated by a heavier design and more powerful (by 150hp) engine.

Perhaps the greatest advance in the tank's design is it's armour. While maintaining the modular and thus easily modifiable armour of the Al-Khalid, it has added another "layer." The Al-Khalid II's armour is made up of as much as 6 layers of armour, a base layer of steel, a layer of ultra-hard composites (to defeat long rod penetrators), another more minimal layer of steel (all of these layers being spaced to prevent penetration by a HEAT warhead), a layer of Kevlar to defeat minor threats to the tank (like small arms and smaller armour-piercing threats), and then a layer of nERA (non-explosive reactive armour, in this case, rubber), and then finally a layer of (selectively applied) bricks of either composites (often employed in peacetime to save costs and maintenance) or ERA (explosive reactive armour) to defeat HEAT-type threats. The tank is also equipped with more effective damage control (like explosive suppression) systems.

The tank's armament is the same, but it has been made more lethal through the addition of more effective supporting systems. The autoloader maintains it's speed of loading at 8-rounds a minute, but the carousel now holds 28 rounds, allowing more rounds to be stowed at ready. The new indigenous Niaza-II 125mm DU round (penetration: 650mm at 2,000m) is a significant improvement to the older Niaza rounds on the Al-Khalid. This is partially achieved through a longer penetration rod.

Upgrading the Al-Khalid to Comparable Standard:
The Al-Khalid tank was specifically designed with modularity in mind. As a result, the Niaza-II will be employed on the tank, once significant numbers are manufactured. In addition, the armor has been upgraded to Al-Khalid II standards (roughly). An upgrade package for the Al-Khalid has been designated Al-Khalid IB, this will probably be employed on all Al-Khalid MBTs eventually.

Deploying the Al-Khalid II:
Pakistan requires 1200 Al-Khalid II, to replace the Type 59, Type 69, and Type 85-IIAP. Only 300 of these 1200 tanks (the Type 85-IIAP) are the only tanks considered capable enough to soldier on to 2020. Thus, 900 replacement tanks are required fairly rapidly, with 300 more needed thereafter. The procurement schedule will be as follows:
2012: 100, 2013: 200, 2014: 200, 2015: 200, 2016: 200, 2017: 150, 2018: 150


The 2017 & 2017 national procurement will decrease to allow for exports, and due to decreased demand to replace the Type 85s. By 2014, this will allow the Type 59s, and by 2016 the Type 59s. Some of the 100 Al-Khalid II's listed to enter service in 2012 (initial entry) will actually be built in late 2010, so that the tanks can trial (about 15) in 2011, in 2012 the tanks are projected to be cleared for service entry, as 100 of them reach the army.

After 2016, the Al-Khalids will be upgraded en masse to Al-Khalid IB standard, as factory burden decreases. After 2014, some Al-Khalids may be upgraded for trials type purposes.

Defence Science & Technology Organization (DESTO) (21c)

More about Babur II and Shaheen III in the link as well
 

Damian

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and yes al khalid does has safety ammo bins
Nope, there is no space for armored storage bins, your source confused bins with racks placed inside fuel tanks. Besides this, armored storage bins are not effective protection, any direct hit, and you loose a tank with whole crew. The only perspective and efficent safe ammunition storage is complete isolation of ammunition in compartment or compartments with blow off panels.
 

Andrei_bt

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in both Basic Ak as well as the Ak1 the transmission is french

BASIC AK=SESM ESM500 5-speed automatic

Right now i dont remember.though it had something like 3000 at the end. the AK1 was initially upgraded for Saudi arabia but as the deal didnt went through with few more modification it entered into mass production for PA


AL KHALID does not have any SESM ESM500 automatic.
It has an entire Ukrainian power pack. Nothing else.
 

farhan_9909

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AL KHALID does not have any SESM ESM500 automatic.
It has an entire Ukrainian power pack. Nothing else.
why dont you prove me wrong with a proper source before i post the official Heavy industry taxila as a source.

while prove that the AK1 and the latest leclerc transmission also is similar

Tech Al khalid bought from Leclerc

*FCS
*Thermal imagers
*transmission
*engine was about to be imported but we went under international sanctions
 

militarysta

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Polish military press give answer as Andriej said: no ESM just final drives integrated with two gearbox for Al Chalid.
 
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Andrei_bt

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I repeat - it is Ukrainian Power pack with 6TD-2. It is a fact.
The power pack has been designed by the Kharkiv Morozov Machine Building Design Bureau and supplied in cooperation with the State Enterprise Malyshev Plant.
 

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