M4 Rifles for Army SF Units

[Kunal Biswas]

I asked coz it was evident from some of your earlier posts the 5.56 ammunition used by NATO forces and that one manufactured by OFB is having changes in operational capabilities just like the 7.62 x39 ones produced in Russia and erstwhile Yugoslavia.
Btw as part of deal some 1.7 lack rounds of snipergrade ammunition for galatz was imported along rifle .the ofb made 7.62 will be compatible with galatz but Israeli ones are sniper grade.

I dont think i mentioned something like that, Never seen Foreign rounds only OFB made ammo..

But yes Indian rounds are based on SS109 Nato 5.56mm and other used different..



Very possible, Sniper Grade ammo is expensive though..

 

[Bhadra]

Weight and quality of grains in ammunition varieties differe. Snipper garde rounds have better and more grains as also better exactitudes and weight of bullet.

 

[Pablo Munoz]

So has the Indian SF made a mistake between the difference of the M4 and the HK416? Have they already gone out and bought the M4?

 

[Kunal Biswas]

So has the Indian SF made a mistake between the difference of the M4 and the HK416? Have they already gone out and bought the M4?

Are you using your translator or Its you mistaking that SF and MOD makes Mistakes ?

 

[Bhadra]

So has the Indian SF made a mistake between the difference of the M4 and the HK416? Have they already gone out and bought the M4?

Kunal still would say they are buying HK416.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Kunal still would say they Should buy HK416.

Fixed for you..

 

[vishwaprasad]

yeah now at least after getting humiliated by US for Jalashwa checking now its high time for us to say NO to this rifle which is not at all comparable with TAR-21.

 

[ALBY]

yeah now at least after getting humiliated by US for Jalashwa checking now its high time for us to say NO to this rifle which is not at all comparable with TAR-21.

So does the prices too..

 

[AshutoshNSingh]

Why don't our SFs use FN F2000s instead of or along with TAR 21? Already in use with SPG?The ultra-compact ARs are highly reliable. Their TR variants can also be fitted with miscellaneous accessories.

And buy M4s for PARAs is really stupid indeed. If they wanted conventional design carbines, amny better options were available.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Why don't our SFs use FN F2000s instead of or along with TAR 21?

TAR-21 complete all necessary needs for PARAs, FN2000 wont make any difference..

 

[ALBY]

TAR-21 complete all necessary needs for PARAs, FN2000 wont make any difference..

Absolutely right kunal.as far as tavors are good there is no need to go for another bullpup as the difference made by most of the modern rifles are minimal let alone their prices.Plus FN2000 is more expensive than TAR which itself costs approx 2.5 lakhs.There is no need for a new one asfar as we are not going to use them in any shooting competitions or weapon expos rather than killing foes.

 

[Immanuel]

A proper M-4 made by Daniel Defence is still far more reliable than the TAR-21, they also seem cheaper, they also come with different barrel lengths and other options. There are as i said many variants of it, Ordering AR based rifles is not really a big issue.

https://danieldefense.com/rifles.html

Alexander arms Grendel and Beowulf are also beautiful rifles, ideal for a lot of SF roles.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

A proper M-4 made by Daniel Defence is still far more reliable than the TAR-21, they also seem cheaper, they also come with different barrel lengths and other options. There are as i said many variants of it, Ordering AR based rifles is not really a big issue.

https://danieldefense.com/rifles.html

Alexander arms Grendel and Beowulf are also beautiful rifles, ideal for a lot of SF roles.

en years ago, they wanted a better gun than the M4, which has a reputation for jamming. (There are those who defend the rifle, but U.S. special forces wanted something different.) The M16 and M4 both use gas tubes to launch their projectiles, and keep these gases (along with burned carbon particles) inside the gun, fouling the receiver. The HK416 uses a gas piston instead of a gas tube to launch projectiles. This method allows the weapon to vent hot gas and burned carbon from the rifle with each shot"¦

Read more: This Is The "Celebrity Weapon" Likely Used To Kill Osama Bin Laden - Business Insider


How come they are more reliable ? is there any technical reason behind it ?

TAR-21 is very rugged and we know how M4 behaves..

 

[Bhadra]

Read more: This Is The "Celebrity Weapon" Likely Used To Kill Osama Bin Laden - Business Insider


How come they are more reliable ? is there any technical reason behind it ?

TAR-21 is very rugged and we know how M4 behaves..

well the selectors are not part of the debate, hence one can not get valid answers?
Others on the forum at best are counter bidders and only showing their side of the story.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

well the selectors are not part of the debate, hence one can not get valid answers?

Others on the forum at best are counter bidders and only showing their side of the story.

Can you be more clear..

thanks..

 

[Bhadra]

Can you be more clear..

thanks..

Someone who selected M-4 is not there to defend and we are getting individual inputs for other weapon system ...

Hence the issue can not be judged...

Regarding direct or indirect gas operations, the former is much faster and produces greater rates of fire. It is also more rugged having lesser parts (piston and spring, liable to frost in sub zero temperature) but has greater recoil increasing inaccuracy.

SFs require to fire in their operations for shorter period of time but with high volume of fire. Reliability should be the key factors in their operations and least chances of failure. SMC or personal weapons as it is within the battalion are numbered and used as only personal point defence weapons. Those who carry these weapons are engaged in firing someother weapons or in direction of operation.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Someone who selected M-4 is not there to defend and we are getting individual inputs for other weapon system ...

Hence the issue can not be judged...

Regarding direct or indirect gas operations, the former is much faster and produces greater rates of fire. It is also more rugged having lesser parts (piston and spring, liable to frost in sub zero temperature) but has greater recoil increasing inaccuracy.

Selection of M4 on first place was utter Wrong, hence no need to judge the rest regardless who selected it..

Read the report posted twice, M4 is not AKM two works in very different way even there gas systems..

&

HK-416 reputation among SF world wide have no issue of inaccuracy, If there is a issue of such problem please provide some insight..

 

[Bhadra]

Selection of M4 on first place was utter Wrong, hence no need to judge the rest regardless who selected it..

Read the report posted twice, M4 is not AKM two works in very different way even there gas systems..

&

HK-416 reputation among SF world wide have no issue of inaccuracy, If there is a issue of such problem please provide some insight..

Well, if you say you should have been on the selection committee or the DRDO, refuting that is not my case.

I reckon those who are tasked to perform a job have all right to select their weapon system. It should not be like INSAS who was introduced and Jawans rejected it out rightly.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

SMC or personal weapons as it is within the battalion are numbered and used as only personal point defence weapons.

Well, if you say you should have been on the selection committee or the DRDO, refuting that is not my case.I reckon those who are tasked to perform a job have all right to select their weapon system. It should not be like INSAS who was introduced and Jawans rejected it out rightly.

M4 is rifle and not a SMGC, Not relivent to M4 rifle..

That is what Internet forum is for, you dont like to debate dont debate just ignore, And if you have nothing to contribute except DODO stuff, Please dont waste bandwidth..

 

[Kunal Biswas]

This place is not for personal arguments hence post are moved to chit chat thread, Continue discussing there..