Learning from Pakistan's Mistakes

[Flint]

SATA I feel that the Pakistani leadership failed to understand the value of sub-nationalism, and instead tried to use puritan Islam to keep the state united.

The focus on one religion, one language backfired as most Pakistanis are steeped in their local culture and didn't appreciate the foisting of wahhabi-inspired religious ideas.

But there are other factors involved as well such as the two western states of Balochistan and NWFP which failed to integrate with the Pakistani political framework, as the famously independent-minded tribes didn't accept what they saw as a foreign imposition.

Perhaps the biggest blow was the separation of Bangladesh, which I think triggered the rise of Zia-inspired fundamentalism in Pakistan as a desperate measure to hold the state together. Before the war of 1971, Pakistan was a lot more moderate.

 

[S.A.T.A]

Quite true....but any concession or even acceptance of sub national identity would have perfectly negated the raison d'etre for Pakistan,which was Islam and Islam alone was the reason for the nation state.IMO a more truly democratic Pakistan would have splintered even faster.

The lesson to be learnt is that there are homogeneous societies or cultures(and by extension nations)any attempt to artificially bring them about,under whatever pretense of ideology, and any attempt to discourage people from assuming such identities, will prove disastrous.

Pakistan's experiment with Islamic nationalism is a comedy of tragic proportions(or vice-versa)

 

[Flint]

Vish one cannot underestimate the groundwork of the Nehru era which set the tone for a reasoned rather than ideological approach to such matters.

Flint:
Also, now do not lynch me here, one reason why we, as a country, have stuck together in spite of the many odds is our tendency to not act impulsively and over-decisively. In dealing with many of our state-threatening problems (religious and cultural differences and regionalism), this approach has allows rationality to emerge. A case in point, Kashmiri separatists. I used to often wonder why these separatists are treated in AIIMS. But looking at the recent events, I guess we did put up with these idiots so as to allow people (the masses) to form a more rational opinion. I guess it works.

 

[S.A.T.A]

The founding fathers of India lived in a different time,when empires, republics and nations states were vying for the global political landscape.through their wisdom,acquired through education and observing the evolution of societies around them,they astutely understood the task of nation building

They might at times have looked like romantic idealists,but they truly were giants compared to today's Lilliputs.

 

[vish]

Vish one cannot underestimate the groundwork of the Nehru era which set the tone for a reasoned rather than ideological approach to such matters.

Very true... as much as I hate him for his defense goof-ups, I cannot deny that this institutional and reasoned approach is largely a product of his efforts.

 

[Daredevil]

Very true... as much as I hate him for his defense goof-ups, I cannot deny that this institutional and reasoned approach is largely a product of his efforts.

I think giving all the credit to Nehru for this is little bit off. After we got independence, we had very good, smart and intelligent leaders in the government who have shaped this country. Can you imagine India as a country as it is now without a Sardar Vallabhai Patel.

 

[Flint]

I think giving all the credit to Nehru for this is little bit off. After we got independence, we had very good, smart and intelligent leaders in the government who have shaped this country. Can you imagine India as a country as it is now without a Sardar Vallabhai Patel.

Yeah exactly what I was about to say - not just Nehru, but the Nehruvian generation of leaders like Patel, Mahatma, Maulana Azad etc. each of which brought something to the table.

Sure they were all human and all had faults or made mistakes, but nevertheless what they accomplished far outweighs that.

 

[vish]

daredevil & Flint:
Again true, and I guess I stand corrected.

 

[afriend]

pakistan is insulating us from pakistan? wat if the guy on our upstairs is throwing all kinds of garbage into our frontyard?
any sane guy would make efforts to replace that guy with someone who would be more friendly. similarly, pakistan must be replaced with nations that will be more friendly. for example: balochistan, paktonistan, sindhudesh.......etc.

Hey johnee.. pakistan is suffering from the monster it created, they supported taliban in afghanistan.. they are supporting terrorists against india. How do we ensure that even if we aid spliting up of pakistan.. it doesnt become a monster or a bigger threat than pakistan..!!! Currently you can see taliban gaining influence all over... pakistan.. there is very chance that these independent states could fall prey to the radical taliban....!!! And i believe only a united pak can fight this menace..!!!