LCA Tejas vs JF-17 Thunder

[ace009]

It does look like a Super Mig-21.

IMHO - the Mig-21 was the best jet aircraft of it's generation in the last century.

 

[Drsomnath999]

LCA vs JF17

MICA will be on most fighters in future..

No worries here..

but derby won the contract here and also a long range bvr is needed as JF 17 is armed with SD 10 BVRAAM reported to have a range of 70 + km
MICA also has maximum range of 60km at best

 

[Kunal Biswas]

but derby won the contract here and also a long range bvr is needed as JF 17 is armed with SD 10 BVRAAM reported to have a range of 70 + km
MICA also has maximum range of 60km at best

I don't think JF-17 OMG fighter needed to be taken in our account its a gift to PAF and let it be till PAF..

Now back on topic, MICA is today best SRM with TVC, MICA and METEOR missile will play major role in coming future, Not to mention Astra..

 

[Drsomnath999]

I don't think JF-17 OMG fighter needed to be taken in our account its a gift to PAF and let it be till PAF..

see bro we should nt underestimate our enemy's capabilty, it looks good to bash their technology for patriotism sake but still then we have to fight with
these weapons if situation demanded
SD 10 is armed also in chinese airforce so we must have overwheming air superiority for our own good only for that we need superior missiles to take them out

Now back on topic, MICA is today best SRM with TVC, MICA and METEOR missile will play major role in coming future, Not to mention Astra..

well yes also we have another great within visual range IR missile python 5 & other BVRAAM russian R77 latesr derivatives
I hope LCA can be armed with all these missile in future as derby range is limited .

 

[Drsomnath999]

Doc have you written any detailed analysis of LCA Tejas like you did for many others ? if yes then please give me the link i would like to read it !
Thanks

LLLLOOOLLZZZ well sorry i had not written yet well i would see to write it in future

 

[SPIEZ]

LCA vs JF17

The BVRAAM SD10 cannot be judged alone, the Radar of that aircraft has to be taken into account. So I think it would give the Rafale an edge.

 

[Drsomnath999]

The BVRAAM SD10 cannot be judged alone, the Radar of that aircraft has to be taken into account. So I think it would give the Rafale an edge.

well mate 1st of all this is LCA thread , ok as u have taken the name of rafale i would tellu what's the biggest advantage of RAFALE ???
ans : it's amazing ability of passive detection thanks to it's 5th gen SPECTRA system which has both (ELINT & SIGNIT) capabilty similar to F22 's raptor ALR 94 system which can passively detect targets when they are in active mode (i.e RADAR turn on ) at a distance of 150 km or more & can cue it's air
to air missile towards it's target with out turning on it's AESA radar for stealth reason .

this capabilty separates rafale from all 4.5 gen fighters till now .IF we can get these system on LCA mark 2 then it would really great asset for LCA

 

[ace009]

LCA vs JF17

The BVRAAM SD10 cannot be judged alone, the Radar of that aircraft has to be taken into account. So I think it would give the Rafale an edge.

I think the Somnath was matching up the LCA against the JF-17, which is fairly possible since the LCAs will be forward posted as interceptors for point defense and the JF-17s are the "strike fighters" in PAF arsenal till they get the J-10 or whatever they are begging the Chinese for.
The JF-17 -II being desinged and manufactured will carry the Klj-7V2 Chinese Radar, also known as "Type 1478, is an X-band airborne fire-control radar (FCR) developed by Nanjing Research Institute of Electronic Technology (NRIET)" (Wikipedia).

here are the specs
Range:
Look-up: >75 km (for RCS of 3 m2)[1]
Look-down: >35 km (for RCS of 3 m2)[1]
Total targets tracked: 10 in TWS (Track-While-Scan) mode
Reliability:
MTBF (Mean Time Between Failure): 220 hours
MTTR (Mean Time To Recovery): 0.5 hours
Weight: ≤120 kg
Volume: 0.065 m3

So it is a Mechanically scanned radar, and has a range of 75 km for a 3m^2 target. The LCA mk1 has an RCS of >2 m^2 and LCA mk2 will have an RCS >1 m^2, so the JF-17 II can detect the LCA mk1 from ~60 kms and the LCA mk2 from ~ 40 kms. The LCA mk-1 armed with the EL/M 2032 radar on the other hand can detect the JF-17 (RCS of ~3 m^2) at a range of ~80 kms. The next generation AESA will be better than the EL/M 2032 for sure.

So, in short the LCA will have first look ability.

 

[SPIEZ]

well mate 1st of all this is LCA thread , ok as u have taken the name of rafale i would tellu what's the biggest advantage of RAFALE ???
ans : it's amazing ability of passive detection thanks to it's 5th gen SPECTRA system which has both (ELINT & SIGNIT) capabilty similar to F22 's raptor ALR 94 system which can passively detect targets when they are in active mode (i.e RADAR turn on ) at a distance of 150 km or more & can cue it's air
to air missile towards it's target with out turning on it's AESA radar for stealth reason .

this capabilty separates rafale from all 4.5 gen fighters till now .IF we can get these system on LCA mark 2 then it would really great asset for LCA

This my friend was a reply to your query on SD10 BVRAAM on the JF-17. I m also hoping these systems will be integrated into the LCA.

 

[SPIEZ]

I think the Somnath was matching up the LCA against the JF-17, which is fairly possible since the LCAs will be forward posted as interceptors for point defense and the JF-17s are the "strike fighters" in PAF arsenal till they get the J-10 or whatever they are begging the Chinese for.
The JF-17 -II being desinged and manufactured will carry the Klj-7V2 Chinese Radar, also known as "Type 1478, is an X-band airborne fire-control radar (FCR) developed by Nanjing Research Institute of Electronic Technology (NRIET)" (Wikipedia).

here are the specs
Range:
Look-up: >75 km (for RCS of 3 m2)[1]
Look-down: >35 km (for RCS of 3 m2)[1]
Total targets tracked: 10 in TWS (Track-While-Scan) mode
Reliability:
MTBF (Mean Time Between Failure): 220 hours
MTTR (Mean Time To Recovery): 0.5 hours
Weight: ≤120 kg
Volume: 0.065 m3

So it is a Mechanically scanned radar, and has a range of 75 km for a 3m^2 target. The LCA mk1 has an RCS of >2 m^2 and LCA mk2 will have an RCS >1 m^2, so the JF-17 II can detect the LCA mk1 from ~60 kms and the LCA mk2 from ~ 40 kms. The LCA mk-1 armed with the EL/M 2032 radar on the other hand can detect the JF-17 (RCS of ~3 m^2) at a range of ~80 kms. The next generation AESA will be better than the EL/M 2032 for sure.

So, in short the LCA will have first look ability.

First the LCA will be based on the Southern Air command, chances of meeting the Blunder before the Su30 MKI, mirage 200, MiG 29 or even the rafale.
Second, the LCA mk2 is a paper plane.
Third, all these stats are fancy, only war will really tell.
Fourth, we ll have to see what radars is going into the LCA, that will determine who will have the first look capability.

 

[p2prada]

Derby is obviously ahead. No comparison there.

Nobody knows if there is a 100Kg version of SD-10 and a 200Kg version. If both exist then the smaller one may go on the JF-17. The Chinese say the PL-12(perhaps 200Kg) will be in the same class as the RVV-SD and Aim-120D. So, that cannot be overlooked. The SD-10 is the export name for PL-12.

Both LCA and JF-17 may carry a radar of similar capability. There are too many other parameters we need to look at too, like design philosophy and requirement. We know for sure the LCA is an air superiority fighter. The same cannot be said for JF-17, but that's not a bad thing.

 

[Godless-Kafir]

According to the poorly educated Porki youth on the net, the JF-17 is better than the LCA. If you ask them why they bring in silly arguments like Thrust to weight ration. Even when you show them that the LCA weighs less and has 5kN of more thrust than JF-17 they dont seem to understand.

They bring in the argument of loaded weight even when loaded weight is only the ablity of an fighter to carry load which only proved LCA can carry more. LMAO.

They dont understand that even, may be their brains are still unevolved. The only reason LCA is not getting inducted is because the IAF quality requirement is much much higher than the desperate PAF. LCA has more thrust, better avionics and handling.

 

[Mad Indian]

And Its a tailess delta with relaxed static stability with FBW controls.... so one on one- it can rape JF 17!!!!

But the fanboys are fanboys.....!!!!!!

 

[ace009]

First the LCA will be based on the Southern Air command, chances of meeting the Blunder before the Su30 MKI, mirage 200, MiG 29 or even the rafale.
Second, the LCA mk2 is a paper plane.
Third, all these stats are fancy, only war will really tell.
Fourth, we ll have to see what radars is going into the LCA, that will determine who will have the first look capability.

Only the first 1-2 squadrons of LCA will be placed in the southrn command. Hopefully ater they will be placed in Punjab or Rajasthan where they can do the interceptor job.
If the Jf-17 is sent on a strike mission there will be 12-16 of them coming in because of their low payload amounts. They maybe given air support by more JF-10s or F-16s armed with bvraams. The best way would be get the Rafales/ mkis to deal with the supporting fighters and let the LCA deal with the JF-17s.

 

[Armand2REP]

see bro we should nt underestimate our enemy's capabilty, it looks good to bash their technology for patriotism sake but still then we have to fight with
these weapons if situation demanded
SD 10 is armed also in chinese airforce so we must have overwheming air superiority for our own good only for that we need superior missiles to take them out

PAF wanted the RDY-400 MICA combo as their upgrade when they came begging us to install it. Falling back on China was the last thing they wanted to do. It isn't bashing their technology, it is looking at the FACTS. It was their fallback position, not their first choice. Now India has the top line and Thunder Blunder has a crappy combat package.

 

[Drsomnath999]

PAF wanted the RDY-400 MICA combo as their upgrade when they came begging us to install it. Falling back on China was the last thing they wanted to do. It isn't bashing their technology, it is looking at the FACTS. It was their fallback position, not their first choice. Now India has the top line and Thunder Blunder has a crappy combat package.

yes it is correct they were begging to have french avionics & mica missile for their JF 17 but india had armtwisted it & also india in return bought RAFALE
which has superior 5th gen AVIONICS & ECM package like SPECTRA system .Thank god we didnt allow pakis to have these kind of systems

 

[LurkerBaba]

Threads merged

 

[Drsomnath999]

According to the poorly educated Porki youth on the net, the JF-17 is better than the LCA. If you ask them why they bring in silly arguments like Thrust to weight ration. Even when you show them that the LCA weighs less and has 5kN of more thrust than JF-17 they dont seem to understand.

They bring in the argument of loaded weight even when loaded weight is only the ablity of an fighter to carry load which only proved LCA can carry more. LMAO.

They dont understand that even, may be their brains are still unevolved. The only reason LCA is not getting inducted is because the IAF quality requirement is much much higher than the desperate PAF. LCA has more thrust, better avionics and handling.

not only that they boast of one thing Very much & (i.e) DSI they say it is superior technology & can enhance stealth of that plane .Those fools dont understand that DSI is for performance only not for stealth
Instead it can add to frontal radar cross section as it gives a relatively small flat surface for radar reflection when viewed frontally

 

[tony4562]

And Its a tailess delta with relaxed static stability with FBW controls.... so one on one- it can rape JF 17!!!!

But the fanboys are fanboys.....!!!!!!

The current state of LCA aka Last Chance Aircraft: 1350km/h max, 6g max, 22 AoA max, several hundreds of kilos overweight, no real confirmation of working radar, only weapon tested sofar is R-73, not a single round fired from its canon

Wonder where all your optimism comes from? In its current state LCA won't even survive an encounter with J7, let along JF-17.

 

[amitkriit]

The current state of LCA aka Last Chance Aircraft: 1350km/h max, 6g max, 22 AoA max, several hundreds of kilos overweight, no real confirmation of working radar, only weapon tested sofar is R-73, not a single round fired from its canon

Wonder where all your optimism comes from? In its current state LCA won't even survive an encounter with J7, let along JF-17.

Our systems don't usually hit the sky and pass all the checks in first test flight because we are quality conscious, a term unknown to you. LCA will evolve, there will be no half-measures.