LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

[Bleh]

Isn't It the Problem OEM when they Presented Project report to MOD.
Isn't the Delivery Commitments Is Part Lies On OEM

Lets Say you Ordered I Phone And OEM given you Delivery deadlines of Let say In Week
But Its 2 months and your Orders Still not delivered

And you option To buy It in Near by Store

Would you Listen to OEM Explanations as Consumer ??

LM A over hundreds Of Sub contractors in different nations Of Europe
Still they Manufactured over 500 + Fifth generation fighters uptil Now
But My Lords in HAL wants Push the deadline

Its Easy For Sarkari's Lazy mafia To Shift Blame on consumer Which is IAF in this case
Who are Still flying Mig-21 A.K.A "The Flying coffins"

What Next Line IAF should request that PLAAF + PAF should Wait To Air Assaults

So My Lords in DSPSU's Should Finish Delivery dead lines And then We Will Fight War

That's even worse than an FB troll comment!.. Comparing India's budding minor private sub-contractors, with the decades old private defence industry of LM in US.

You don't seem interested in any objective discussion & I'm not interested in snarks or smileys. I'll comment further when more info is out, not some anonymous IRDW rant that noone else covered or confirmed.

 

[WARREN SS]

nother idiotic rambling, if you knew enough then you wouldn't be screeching like a dolt. The comment below should give you the idea + plus Bleh already has repeated countless times about why the delay happened.

Oh Bhai Yeh Pad Pehle

Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL), India’s topmost Aeronautical production agency has again fumbled in production of the locally developed fighter jet LCA-Tejas after the CCP virus not only halted the production line of the indigenous jet, it also exposed poor planning on part of the LCA- Division that is in charge of the production and supply chain logistics of the jet.

 

[WARREN SS]

That's even worse than an FB troll comment!.. Comparing India's budding minor private sub-contractors, with the decades old private defence industry of LM in US.

You don't seem interested in any objective discussion & I'm not interested in snarks or smileys. I'll coming further when more info is out, not sone anonymous IRDW rant, that noone else covered.

Again That Not IAF or Consumers Problem Is It ???

If You Don't Able to supply or Meet Deadlines That you have Assured to your consumers. Your operations Should be Shut And your Resources should be Disinvested to recover Taxpayers money.

Why should govt Waste Taxpayers money just for paying your hefty salaries

The simple thing Is if you don't able to satisfy your Primary customers.
Then costumers Should be Given Choice to Move Out from you and GOI should end your monopoly in Defense Aviation Sector

ADA & DRDO should Transfer all TOT some Private Consortium or Private consortium should take over
HAL.And Assure 100 % Corporatization of the DSPSU's

PS: HAL is not New Its Assembling Aircrafts Since 70's

 

[jik60]

Again That Not IAF or Consumers Problem Is It ???

If You Don't Able to supply or Meet Deadlines That you have Assured to your consumers. Your operations Should be Shut And your Resources should be Disinvested to recover Taxpayers money.

Why should govt Waste Taxpayers money just for paying your hefty salaries

The simple thing Is if you don't able to satisfy your Primary customers.
Then costumers Should be Given Choice to Move Out from you and GOI should end your monopoly in Defense Aviation Sector

ADA & DRDO should Transfer all TOT some Private Consortium or Private consortium should take over
HAL.And Assure 100 % Corporatization of the DSPSU's

PS: HAL is not New Its Assembling Aircrafts Since 70's

Sir for your information,
Building strategic military aviation is not a mere customer - manufacture - seller trade. It involves zillions of other stuff that many are aware of.
It could be a short reply but I can not help myself putting any more details as the above rationale is apparently obvious.
Idrw is not known to be famous for striking truth from its resources, one should wait for more confirmations.

 

[WARREN SS]

Sir for your information,
Building strategic military aviation is not a mere customer - manufacture - seller trade. It involves zillions of other stuff that many are aware of.
It could be a short reply but I can not help myself putting any more details as the above rationale is apparently obvious.
Idrw is not known to be famous for striking truth from its resources, one should wait for more confirmations.

Mr My Assertions is Not Mere on Welfare Of One Specific DSPU's But Whole Ecosystem

HAL Is not only Single firm that Defines Indian strategic military aviation

"customer - manufacture - seller trade" Is Core Philosophy of Business Management on Which Every Organization Lays Its Foundation On

My assertions is on Monopoly Of Just Few Sarkari DSPSU's Firms Who wants Monopolize Whole Defense Aviation Sector to Just Suck out Lakhs of crore of Taxpayers Money every year from Goi Without giving Anything Tangible Returns to there costumers or to the Government

 

[WARREN SS]

That's even worse than an FB troll comment!..

Since you called Me a Troll Read HAL own General Terms And conditions for Supplier
Which is Obvious Will never be Applied As It is India "Were Regulations are considered Liabilities"

https://hal-india.co.in/SUPPLIERS/M__57

 

[Defcon 1]

That's even worse than an FB troll comment!.. Comparing India's budding minor private sub-contractors, with the decades old private defence industry of LM in US.

You don't seem interested in any objective discussion & I'm not interested in snarks or smileys. I'll comment further when more info is out, not some anonymous IRDW rant that noone else covered or confirmed.

Bleh, what are you saying?

Are you denying that production slippages have occurred in LCA?

Are you attributing the slippages purely to Covid?

 

[vishnugupt]

And you have option To buy It in Near by Store

Sir where is that nearby store I need to buy a few jets to bomb my neighbor ?? Please Sir send a cheque also Because don't have any money

People remember costumer-manufacturer "Rishta" only when PSUs are at fault when Armed forces failed to pay 20K Crores to HAL alone then it becomes "Roti-Beti" ka Rishta.

Paid news is raining nowadays. perhaps lobbies are perturbed by the way India is going on the road of meaningful indigenization. Few recent news is......

HAL fumbles LCA-Tejas FOC Deliveries, Stalls contract for 83 jets – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

Here, Somehow MK1a deal connected to the delivery of FOC jets which is false. HAL going to deliver somehow 6-7 jets in this financial year rather than the target of 8 so where is the issue?? But nobody asking IAF why they keep asking for changes in Tejas?? If asking then why IAF is crying for delay ??
HAL is already started outsourcing Tejas parts. unfortunately Covid19 also going on. so I think HAL is on the right path and IAF must stop their girlish tantrums.

TEDBF Vs Super Hornet : What Navy will consider before clinching any deal with Boeing – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

Boeing touts success of launch tests for fighter pitched to Indian Navy – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

Here IN replicating IAF by criticizing Mig-29 in every possible way ( Like IAF has done with SU-30MKI ). We all know what the navy wants?.

Su-57, Su-35 and MiG-35 combat jets to be showcased at Aero India 2021: Russian ambassador – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

Russian are trying their best

After firing 2000 rounds, Army still wants to play trial games with ATAGS in 2021 also – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

Here Army is trying their best to take another project to graveyard

Ex-Adviser to Indian Defence Ministry: US May Impose Sanctions Once Delhi Receives Russia’s S-400s – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

A Russian way to counter American Propaganda.

Unfortunately, our Armed forces are liking to be a tool of this propaganda and give the same excuse as given by roadside beggars....... Ab Bhai kuch nahi chahiye Life Me.... Bas Malik Pet Bharta Rahe, Zindagi toh Cut Hi Gayi Hai.

 

[WARREN SS]

Armed forces are liking to be a tool of this propaganda and give the same excuse as given by roadside beggars....... A

Sure Your Welcum To Take Place Of armed forces in Galwan valley And Siachen Along With your Sarkari Laggies

Next thing IAF Should Make you Sit along With HAL Engineers In Mig-21 Bison And Launch it Forward in LOC And LAC against JF-17 Blk 2 armed With BVR

Here, Somehow MK1a deal connected to the delivery of FOC jets which is false. HAL going to deliver somehow 6-7 jets in this financial year rather than the target of 8 so where is the issue?? But nobody asking IAF why they keep asking for changes in Tejas?? If asking then why IAF is crying for delay ??

They Can HAL created For IAF not Vice versa
HAL sarkari Babus get Hefty salaries So that they can Provide Solutions To there Problems and solve it.

While Majority Of World Airforce's Flying with Next Generation Fighters

What HAL offering IAF is to Stuck With Light Weight category fighter Which standards are Equal To 30 years old 4 the gen Fighters(LCA MK1)

LCA MK1A Is Still on Paper My friend operational Squadron is Still 6-7 years away

 

[Bleh]

Since you called Me a Troll Read HAL own General Terms And conditions for Supplier
Which is Obvious Will never be Applied As It is India "Were Regulations are considered Liabilities"

https://hal-india.co.in/SUPPLIERS/M__57

View attachment 71266

Doesn't help the situation anyway...

Bleh, what are you saying?

Are you denying that production slippages have occurred in LCA?

Are you attributing the slippages purely to Covid?

I'm not pretending to know & make random expert comments... 2 aircrafts are sitting on tarmac for months without 1st flight. That's not "production slippage", but something else.
We'll know details soon enough. Random info tidbits are there drowned in old posts.

 

[WARREN SS]

People remember costumer-manufacturer "Rishta" only when PSUs are at fault when Armed forces failed to pay 20K Crores to HAL alone then it becomes "Roti-Beti" ka Rishta?

HAL is Govt company There Revenue is govt Property So are there Business assets

What they Will get from IAF is also govt money Which can be adjusted in future
IAF already Paid them for other Orders


HAL posts over Rs 21,100 crore turnover in 2019-20

Its not that they don't have funds

Read more at:
https://economictimes.indiatimes.co...ofinterest&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=cppst

There goes the Money arguments

Aur Koi excuse Bacha hai bhai vo bhi dede

 

[Defcon 1]

I'm not pretending to know & make random expert comments... 2 aircrafts are sitting on tarmac for months without 1st flight. That's not "production slippage", but something else.
We'll know soon enough. Random info tidbits are there drowned in old posts.

There is no need to pretend.

8 LCA Mk1 FOC were scheduled to be delivered between April 2019 and March 2020. Are those fighters also sitting on tarmac?

 

[WARREN SS]

Doesn't help the situation anyway...

So Basically You are saying
Its India Lets Carry on the "Chalta hai" Legacy

Good then

 

[Bleh]

There is no need to pretend.

8 LCA Mk1 FOC were scheduled to be delivered between April 2019 and March 2020. Are those fighters also sitting on tarmac?

22 flown but not delivered. 23 & 24 are waiting, see old posts for more. 25 & 26 in advanced assembly, so likely 2 more in jigs.

Despite announcement that they're are ready 23 didn't fly, I know it had engine run.

So Basically You are saying
Its India Lets Carry on the "Chalta hai" Legacy

I'm saying you don't know what's the delay. You're assuming its that & trolling accordingly... You haven't written a single sentence of meaningful info in whole convo above.
I'm saying please stop. You've had your fun.

 

[Defcon 1]

22 down but not delivered. 23 & 24 are waiting, see old posts for more. 25 & 26 in advanced assembly, so likely 2 more in jigs.

Despite announcement that they're are ready 23 didn't fly, I know it had engine run.

Dude I know all those things.

The point here is that SP21 to SP28 should have been delivered by March 2020, not under assembly, before COVID hit. You know that it hasn't happened. Still you don't want to accept that there is a production slippage. Hence asking, what else would you call it?

 

[Maharaj samudragupt]

Sir where is that nearby store I need to buy a few jets to bomb my neighbor ?? Please Sir send a cheque also Because don't have any money

People remember costumer-manufacturer "Rishta" only when PSUs are at fault when Armed forces failed to pay 20K Crores to HAL alone then it becomes "Roti-Beti" ka Rishta.

Paid news is raining nowadays. perhaps lobbies are perturbed by the way India is going on the road of meaningful indigenization. Few recent news is......

HAL fumbles LCA-Tejas FOC Deliveries, Stalls contract for 83 jets – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

Here, Somehow MK1a deal connected to the delivery of FOC jets which is false. HAL going to deliver somehow 6-7 jets in this financial year rather than the target of 8 so where is the issue?? But nobody asking IAF why they keep asking for changes in Tejas?? If asking then why IAF is crying for delay ??
HAL is already started outsourcing Tejas parts. unfortunately Covid19 also going on. so I think HAL is on the right path and IAF must stop their girlish tantrums.

TEDBF Vs Super Hornet : What Navy will consider before clinching any deal with Boeing – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

Boeing touts success of launch tests for fighter pitched to Indian Navy – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

Here IN replicating IAF by criticizing Mig-29 in every possible way ( Like IAF has done with SU-30MKI ). We all know what the navy wants?.

Su-57, Su-35 and MiG-35 combat jets to be showcased at Aero India 2021: Russian ambassador – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

Russian are trying their best

After firing 2000 rounds, Army still wants to play trial games with ATAGS in 2021 also – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

Here Army is trying their best to take another project to graveyard

Ex-Adviser to Indian Defence Ministry: US May Impose Sanctions Once Delhi Receives Russia’s S-400s – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

A Russian way to counter American Propaganda.

Unfortunately, our Armed forces are liking to be a tool of this propaganda and give the same excuse as given by roadside beggars....... Ab Bhai kuch nahi chahiye Life Me.... Bas Malik Pet Bharta Rahe, Zindagi toh Cut Hi Gayi Hai.

Then be ready for another himalayn blunder.
But I don't think , general narvane is like pn thapar of 62 fame

 

[Bleh]

Dude I know all those things.

The point here is that SP21 to SP28 should have been delivered by March 2020, not under assembly, before COVID hit. You know that it hasn't happened. Still you don't want to accept that there is a production slippage. Hence asking, what else would you call it?

Oh ofcourse, that's without question. However I don't know if March 2020 was ever an official deadline. Because practically that would have the 18 trainers delivered by mid-2021... So whole assembly would have to pluck hair until end of 2022.

Back in 2019, we thought Mark1 order could be extended by another squadron, for the same reason.

 

[FalconZero]

Isn't It the Problem OEM when they Presented Project report to MOD.
Isn't the Delivery Commitments Is Part Lies On OEM

Lets Say you Ordered I Phone And OEM given you Delivery deadlines of Let say In Week
But Its 2 months and your Orders Still not delivered

And you have option To buy It in Near by Store

Would you Listen to OEM Explanations as Consumer ??

Lockheed Martin has over hundreds Of Sub contractors in different nations Of Europe and US states
Still they Manufactured over 500 + Fifth generation fighters uptil Now
But My Lords in HAL wants Push the deadline

Its Easy For Sarkari's Lazy mafia To Shift Blame on consumer Which is IAF in this case
Who are Still flying Mig-21 A.K.A "The Flying coffins"

What Next Line IAF should request that PLAAF + PAF should Wait To Air Assaults

So My Lords in DSPSU's Should Finish Delivery dead lines And then We Will Fight War


As Usual "CHALTA HAI ATTITUDE" WE iNDIANS ARE HAPPY WITH IT

*Yawns*
Amount of BS that you have condensed together in this comment will put the SMBH to shame, not going to waste my time pointing out at your mistakes assuming you are not a toddler.

Oh Bhai Yeh Pad Pehle

Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL), India’s topmost Aeronautical production agency has again fumbled in production of the locally developed fighter jet LCA-Tejas after the CCP virus not only halted the production line of the indigenous jet, it also exposed poor planning on part of the LCA- Division that is in charge of the production and supply chain logistics of the jet.

Do you really suffer from Dementia or you are just a dolt who lacks basic comprehension to understand what has been said and repeated million times by others? Did you even read what I said, it all started when chimps started chimping out about Tejas, not HAL rather aircraft itself and they were soon joined by people like you.

“Now, the focus is on the completion of structural build of aircraft, which are planned to be produced during this financial year. The first three aircraft are in advanced stage of delivery and another three (SP-24, SP-25, SP-26) are in various stages of equipping,” the official added.

On the measures being put in place to improve the supply chain management, the official said efforts are on to bring back normalcy. “The foreign supply chain is the worst hit. Since LCA-Tejas Division follows the integrator model, any supply chain disruption will bring in risk for timelines. We are working closely with our partners to tide over the current situation. We are supporting them financially and technically to come out of the current situation. We have given relief to our business partners for the delay caused due to COVID-19-related lockdown,” the official added.

The problems caused by COVID and demands from IAF are something which can't be solved since at least covid part is something unique which has caused sufficient delays otherwise their aim for 6-8 aircraft this year could have been easily met.
Chances are by 2021 end most of them will be delivered, all this hue and cry by some people and idiots like you are just catching onto straws to badmouth Tejas, also, tell dalals at IAF to pay up HAL, they still owe more than 20000 crores of rupees(roughly).

IAF holds back Rs 20,000 crore from HAL, as foreign vendors get paid

With zero cash balance, firm takes Rs 781-crore loan to pay salaries

www.business-standard.com

Issue is not just that whether it's delivery right now is 8 or 4 or anything rather the bigger picture of import itself, the dependence on foreign equipment and acting like slave that muh America has this 6+++ gen this and that, how did America reached there? You don't support your indigenous systems, don't pay your companies and even if the products/platform like Tejas which have great potential to headstart India into this industry some dummies start showing their IQ.

Point is against Imports and not denying issues, if you understand this basic line then we still won't be having this discussion.

 

[vishnugupt]

Sure Your Welcum To Take Place Of armed forces in Galwan valley And Siachen Along With your Sarkari Laggies

Ya Galwan and Siachen was discovered only in April 2020 before that our Amed forces were unaware that there are Pakistan and china on either side of India. Poor fellows were busy in killing of local capability.
The armed forces's Lack of vision is the reason that the whole of India is suffering. Armed forces literally thrown all responsibility of self-sufficiency on the Government while they have been busy in Kickback deals.

Next thing IAF Should Make you Sit along With HAL Engineers In Mig-21 Bison And Launch it Forward in LOC And LAC against JF-17 Blk 2 armed With BVR

IAF itself wants to operate Mig-21 so they can cry for more import. Everybody knows IAF doesn't want a relatively superior platform Tejas.

They Can HAL created For IAF not Vice versa
You get Hefty salaries So that you can Provide Solutions To there Problems

While Majority Of Airforce's Flying with Next Generation Fighters

HAL offering IAF to Stuck With Light Weight category fighter Which standards are Equal To 30 years old 4 the gen Fighters

If the Armed forces keep on changing goal post then nobody could help them. Despite of 4-5th largest defence budget Indian armed forces still in a petty state. So better ask them what has been they doing for last 70 years?

LCA MK1A Is Still on Paper My friend

a better line would be..... LCA MK1a deliberately kept in the paper because IAF is not showing the same urgency as were shown to Rafale or any imported weapons.

Truth is neither PSUs nor private companies want to deal with our Armed forces due to their dishonesty and goal post changing attitude. Moreover, the Chinese have made things worse and humiliating situation to them. Government is also not giving them money for shopping so Generals are seeing their future generations destroyed due to lack of kickback money.

 

[Defcon 1]

Ofcourse that's without question. Although I don't know if March 2020 was official deadline. Because practically that would have the 18 trainers delivered by mid-2021.

So whole assembly would have to pluck hair until end of 2022. Back in 2019, we thought Mark1 order could be extended by another squadron, for the same reason.

HAL chief gave an interview where he said that 8 aircraft per annum will be delivered till 2022. Makes sense. Total 24 MK1 FOC have to be manufactured, so from April 2019 to March 2022, they had expected 3 years.
I can find and post the interview again if needed.

There wouldn't have been any gap in Mk1 and MK1a production even if there were no delays. Now that significant delays have been encountered, there would certainly be no gaps. Also this would mean that MK1A production will start only in 2023-2024 instead of previously planned April 2022. And because of this production will last till 2029, assuming that there are no further delays.