LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

[Flying Dagger]

Far from it bruh, far from it ....
I am an indigenous weapon supporter that's all.
But getting back OT, till now I don't thin Astra has been test fired from Tejas whereas Derby has ? Why ?

Derby was available to us as we had them for Jaguars. Israeli are helping us with many projects and the missile was pretty effective and cheaper compared to russian ones if we consider their maintenance and shelf life.

Astra was just getting ready.. and is just out of the closet it will be integrated . You must understand it's not just put the missile and fire.. lot of work is needed to be done with radar and electronics etc which requires time. And after the testing will be successful all aircrafts will be standardized to carry Astra .

 

[Aniruddha Mulay]

Interesting, what about the F-18 is better for us specifically?

Super Hornet benefits from huge production nos, so spares are easy to come by. 600+ F-18 SH have been built compared to only 44 Rafale M built.
Super Hornet acquisition costs and operating costs are lower than Rafale M and is nearly as capable.

 

[Steven Rogers]

unlike Russians Equipment Who open to Western criticisms Chinese always guarded Its Radar

Chinese Who are still Struggling With Engine tech And depend on Russians For Air defense

It’s not just about range. There are a lot of other variables. Electrical power (how much can a small underpowered single engine fighter jet generate?), resistance to jamming, resistance to spoofing etc, computing power (ie agility, number of targets it can track and process reliably), cooling cycle, different modes and how reliable is it from a systems perspective? How good is the interface? How easy is it to use/fight?

These are things the Chinese and PAF do not want in the public domain. There will be baseline figures that will give some sort of benchmark but nobody knows how realistic they are. Given the radar is Chinese made and they are desperate to sell more of them, probably not very realistic. The marketing numbers are not much more than guided speculation.

That picture they have been roaming since years while whatever PR they release is widely different of what they print.....

 

[Steven Rogers]

unlike Russians Equipment Who open to Western criticisms Chinese always guarded Its Radar

Chinese Who are still Struggling With Engine tech And depend on Russians For Air defense

It’s not just about range. There are a lot of other variables. Electrical power (how much can a small underpowered single engine fighter jet generate?), resistance to jamming, resistance to spoofing etc, computing power (ie agility, number of targets it can track and process reliably), cooling cycle, different modes and how reliable is it from a systems perspective? How good is the interface? How easy is it to use/fight?

These are things the Chinese and PAF do not want in the public domain. There will be baseline figures that will give some sort of benchmark but nobody knows how realistic they are. Given the radar is Chinese made and they are desperate to sell more of them, probably not very realistic. The marketing numbers are not much more than guided speculation.

170Km for fighter size with 4KVa power consumption with no cooling,These people have definitely made the joke of propaganda to its extent....

 

[Hydra3]

Super Hornet benefits from huge production nos, so spares are easy to come by. 600+ F-18 SH have been built compared to only 44 Rafale M built.
Super Hornet acquisition costs and operating costs are lower than Rafale M and is nearly as capable.

+ there is chances for we getting EA18 growler along with FA18, the only EW attack aircraft in the world today.

 

[Immanuel]

Interesting, what about the F-18 is better for us specifically?

Folding with wings, better updated AESA, comes with a wider set of weapons already integrated, lower operating costs, updated engine, updated cockpit with large panel display, CFT for more range, the list goes on!

 

[Aniruddha Mulay]

+ there is chances for we getting EA18 growler along with FA18, the only EW attack aircraft in the world today.

Yup. Completely forgot about that.

 

[Anathema]

Super Hornet benefits from huge production nos, so spares are easy to come by. 600+ F-18 SH have been built compared to only 44 Rafale M built.
Super Hornet acquisition costs and operating costs are lower than Rafale M and is nearly as capable.

RAFALE purchase was not about capabilities alone. It was maintaining our AUTONOMY . With US purchase there is no AUTONOMY. You can take a look at our western neighbours.

So all the TIP of the SPEAR weapons should not be US system

 

[IndianHawk]

Thanks for the information.
So any idea what is the progress so far in integrating Astra on Tejas ?

Astra will come with mk1a. Since all mk1 will be upgraded to mk1a they didn't bother integrating Astra with mk1.

 

[IndianHawk]

Folding with wings, better updated AESA, comes with a wider set of weapons already integrated, lower operating costs, updated engine, updated cockpit with large panel display, CFT for more range, the list goes on!

Super Hornet benefits from huge production nos, so spares are easy to come by. 600+ F-18 SH have been built compared to only 44 Rafale M built.
Super Hornet acquisition costs and operating costs are lower than Rafale M and is nearly as capable.

Since third carrier is delayed neither f18 nor rafale m will be ordered. There is more than enough time for tedbf to be ready. Tedbf will be flying by 2026-27 and ready to enter service by 2032 . Third carried even if sanctioned by 2022 will only be in service by 2035.

 

[abhay rajput]

He is Not bigger Source than Regional Centre for Military Airworthiness (RCMA)

Based on the successful integration and demonstration, Regional Centre for Military Airworthiness (RCMA), a unit of DRDO has cleared the series production aircraft of Squadron 45, to be equipped with Derby operational capability. LCATejas has successfully completed a series of captive flight trials to clear Derby for the full operational capability in the entire FOC envelope. In the past, Tejas has qualified for the armaments and missile release related trials.

https://pib.gov.in/newsite/PrintRelease.aspx?relid=178996

You should trust IAF more .. both harsh vardhan and Angad Singh were IAF pilots and both knows more about Tejas then we do... Nonetheless I am done convincing you...

 

[WARREN SS]

Yes the Sukhoi radar's range matter for sure.. as you can track enemy aircrafts awacs from far off and plan your position accordingly.

It is effective in other mission profile too where smaller stealthy aircraft with radar off can be passed on info by Sukhoi with radar on. And that plane can engage the enemy.

What matter In the end Upto BVRAAM And NEZ and EW DRFM's

LCA Lower RCS And Composite always helps it To Get Lower Ratio for NEZ And Firing solution

Basically Ideal Range To engage Enemy is 50-60 Km before this Any Fighter can easily evade BVR's using EW

Now LCA has RCS of 2m2 (loaded)
And J-10c 5m2 (comparable to Loaded F-16 (assumed) )

KLJA has range of 175 km for 5m2 And Ideally it Will engage 2m2 at 90-100 km
While Elta 2052 has 130 km 1m2 has Tracking range close to 150 km for fighters at 4 KW With 800-1000 TR modules

The ELM-2052 is an advanced Fire Control Radar (FCR) designed for air-to-air superiority and strike missions, based on fully solid-state Active Ellectronically Scanning Array (AESA) technology, enabling the radar to achieve

1. long detection ranges,
2. high mission reliability and
3. multi-target tracking capabilities.

The ELM-2052 radar provides simultaneous modes of operation supporting multi-mission capabilities for air-to-air, air-to-ground and air-to-sea operation modes, and weapon deployment.

The Radar has a peak power of ~ 10KW+ and has around 1500 TR Modules so its very much implied as Alec speculated that the Radar has gallium nitrite based TR modules and if that is the case then the range would be around 180–250 KM for the 1 Sq M RCS

 

[Lancer]

Folding with wings, better updated AESA, comes with a wider set of weapons already integrated, lower operating costs, updated engine, updated cockpit with large panel display, CFT for more range, the list goes on!

Hmm, I was initially in favor of a combined mega-deal for IAF and the Navy; but after reading that list of features - the F-18 definitely sounds like a much better purchase.

Going w/ F-18's might also open up future avenues for Growlers and (possibly) - a limited amount of F-35's for aircraft carriers/LHD's.

 

[Aniruddha Mulay]

Since third carrier is delayed neither f18 nor rafale m will be ordered. There is more than enough time for tedbf to be ready. Tedbf will be flying by 2026-27 and ready to enter service by 2032 . Third carried even if sanctioned by 2022 will only be in service by 2035.

What about additional Mig 29K. We now have only 42 out of the 45 Mig 29K ordered in service. And the serviceability of these jets is not that great.
INS Viky and Vikrant are capable of handling 26 Mig 29K each along with 10 helicopters.

 

[Bleh]

........................

 

[Steven Rogers]

KLJA has range of 175 km for 5m2 And Ideally it Will engage 2m2 at 90-100 km
While Elta 2052 has 130 km 1m2 has Tracking range close to 150 km for fighters at 4 KW With 800-1000 TR modules

The ELM-2052 is an advanced Fire Control Radar (FCR) designed for air-to-air superiority and strike missions, based on fully solid-state Active Ellectronically Scanning Array (AESA) technology, enabling the radar to achieve

1. long detection ranges,
2. high mission reliability and
3. multi-target tracking capabilities.

The ELM-2052 radar provides simultaneous modes of operation supporting multi-mission capabilities for air-to-air, air-to-ground and air-to-sea operation modes, and weapon deployment.

The Radar has a peak power of ~ 10KW+ and has around 1500 TR Modules so its very much implied as Alec speculated that the Radar has gallium nitrite based TR modules and if that is the case then the range would be around 180–250 KM for the 1 Sq M RCS

These things look good only on paper,range is directly proportional to the 4 time root of power output ,if other variables are kept constant..and in now way a 4kW radar will be able to detect anything a 180kms for a fighter class target,it can but with noises all over that the operator won't be able to recognize ...

 

[AbRaj]

RAFALE purchase was not about capabilities alone. It was maintaining our AUTONOMY . With US purchase there is no AUTONOMY. You can take a look at our western neighbours.

So all the TIP of the SPEAR weapons should not be US system

Superhornet is hugely inferior to Rafale.
Its even inferior to F16 v and above in a lot of roles with the exception that it has more reserve power due to two engines

 

[Hydra3]

RAFALE purchase was not about capabilities alone. It was maintaining our AUTONOMY . With US purchase there is no AUTONOMY. You can take a look at our western neighbours.

So all the TIP of the SPEAR weapons should not be US system

Our LCA jet engine is of US orgin, gas turbine for most of the naval ships including indigenous aircraft carrier is of US orgin. If autonomy is problem, then these products are alos under threat.
Western neighbor has still used f16 for offensive role against last year, anything happened?
US weaponary has its own advantages, look at p8i and what capability they have given to us. Look at apache & chinook, how quickly they become operationalized. No russian equipment will operationalized within in that much short time. Look at french & how we fucked up with scorpeene deals.
US always keep up with its promises on contract.

 

[Hydra3]

Superhornet is hugely inferior to Rafale.
Its even inferior to F16 v and above in a lot of roles with the exception that it has more reserve power due to two engines

Do IN has the budget for exorbitantly pricy rafales? No, if we can managr EA18 Growlers along with FA18 for IN thennthat combo is no less than a stand alone rafale.

 

[AbRaj]

Do IN has the budget for exorbitantly pricy rafales? No, if we can managr EA18 Growlers along with FA18 for IN thennthat combo is no less than a stand alone rafale.

Neither have they baught old relic F18 which even USN doesn’t want anymore.
For EW we can always buy dedicated jets. And even a standard Rafale can do , without any mod