Know Your 'Rafale'

BON PLAN

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What gift? We will be paying for that. French are not doing any social service. We are paying them for their product and services. As for ToT it is one of the basic requirement for MMRCA.
OK.
the R&D costs for Rafale was nearly 30 € billions.
25% was affected to Spectra, so nearly 8 billions. Are you realty to ink a deal of 8 billions for the secrets of Spectra? (and nothing more because it's R&D).

Or do you prefer a "gift" after the delivery of 114 Rafale ?
 

asianobserve

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OK.
the R&D costs for Rafale was nearly 30 € billions.
25% was affected to Spectra, so nearly 8 billions. Are you realty to ink a deal of 8 billions for the secrets of Spectra? (and nothing more because it's R&D).

Or do you prefer a "gift" after the delivery of 114 Rafale ?
I've been telling fellow members that TOT in cutting edge military tech is not going to happen.
 

IndianHawk

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OK.
the R&D costs for Rafale was nearly 30 € billions.
25% was affected to Spectra, so nearly 8 billions. Are you realty to ink a deal of 8 billions for the secrets of Spectra? (and nothing more because it's R&D).

Or do you prefer a "gift" after the delivery of 114 Rafale ?
By the time 114 Rafale are delivered indian defence budget will be 3-4 times larger than france. We might have much advanced systems in place then spectra and we'll be spending far more on r&d then france could ever manage unless entire europian r&d combines together.
 

Dark Sorrow

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OK.
the R&D costs for Rafale was nearly 30 € billions.
25% was affected to Spectra, so nearly 8 billions. Are you realty to ink a deal of 8 billions for the secrets of Spectra? (and nothing more because it's R&D).
That would be true if Thales would be selling IP to IAF or explicitly developing it for IAF but that is not the case.
What IAF is asking for ToT not IP. French will still own the IP for Spectra EW and are free to sell Spectra EW suite anyone on their own accord.
Asking 8 billions i.e. complete development cost for ToT (without IP or exclusivity) is quite fatuous.

Having ToT doesn't mean that India can start selling Spectra EW to third countries or even integrate it in other aircraft as India won't own IP.

Their is a big difference between selling IP and ToT.

Or do you prefer a "gift" after the delivery of 114 Rafale ?
French are businessmen and are not doing any social service.
Selling Rafale to India is a business transaction for either party.

No one is gifting anyone anything.
 
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BON PLAN

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By the time 114 Rafale are delivered indian defence budget will be 3-4 times larger than france. We might have much advanced systems in place then spectra and we'll be spending far more on r&d then france could ever manage unless entire europian r&d combines together.
wait and see Bro.
First thing to do is to study and produce 100% by yourselves a fighter engine. A good begining in advanced systems. :wink:
 

Super Flanker

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The seeker is from an R-77.
Yes you are Right. Maybe the Seeker is From The R-77 afterall. For now some of the Astra will be using Missile Seekers Directly Imported from Russia Itself but in the Future will be Replaced by Indigenous Indian Seeker(if I am not wrong here)
Astrabvraam.png
 

Super Flanker

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We should buy f 16, iam sure they will shift the production line to hyderabad .
There was this Video uploaded by this channel Called "Indian Defence Updates" in which it said that If F-16/-F-21 is choosen for MMRCA than The Aircraft Production will happen at Hyderabad and Every year, 50 Aircrafts would be Rolled out from The Hyderabad Facility.
(don't know how true this claim is though, sounds far fetched because we are not able to Produce even 20 Tejas per year ,than I guess the news of 50 F-21 Aircraft per year is Far Fetched)
Here is video link (see for yourself)
f-16.jpeg
 

Maharaj skandgupta

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Actually Yes ,If we do buy the F-16/F-21 under The MMRCA tender,than yes , the Production will be Done in India itself at The (TLMAL) Tata Lockheed Martin Aero-structures Limited which ia Situated in Hyderabad.
View attachment 124468
That's what iam saying , what if porkies operate the same , so do yavans and turushaks operate f 16 and both are nato members .
 

Super Flanker

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That's what iam saying , what if porkies operate the same , so do yavans and turushaks operate f 16 and both are nato members .
Yeah I didn't about it. Anyways if we buy the F-21/F-16 than I heard that the Production will be Shifted to India and we can Control the Supply of Spare Parts to other countries( I maybe wrong here though)
 

asianobserve

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That's what iam saying , what if porkies operate the same , so do yavans and turushaks operate f 16 and both are nato members .
Then India can exert some form of pressure on their F-16 supply lines. That's an advantage that India will wield even without the need to fire a single shot in anger.

As to Rafale, Pakistanis will already also operate (as mercenaries) it through UAE. They will have an intimate experience on the strengths and weaknesses of Rafale, no different than F-16, albeit without India having significant leverage on Rafale supply line...
 

Maharaj skandgupta

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Yeah I didn't about it. Anyways if we buy the F-21/F-16 than I heard that the Production will be Shifted to India and we can Control the Supply of Spare Parts to other countries( I maybe wrong here though)
Yes it will be good enough to fight chinki j 10s also ,plus we can build them in numbers too.
 

asianobserve

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But what I notice from Indiam defence establishment is an ingrained bias against American weapons, and American military in general. This is perhaps understandable since the current crop of Indian defence officials were indoctrinated under the old Soviet relationship.
 

Super Flanker

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Yes it will be good enough to fight chinki j 10s also ,plus we can build them in numbers too.
Yes are right,it will be a good Counter to J-10(if Pakistan gets them) but I believe if we are going to any Aircraft under MMRCA than it will most Probably be Rafale. That's my personal point of view and Preference.
 

Maharaj skandgupta

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Then India can exert some form of pressure on their F-16 supply lines. That's an advantage that India will wield even without the need to fire a single shot in anger.

As to Rafale, Pakistanis will already also operate (as mercenaries) it through UAE. They will have an intimate experience on the strengths and weaknesses of Rafale, no different than F-16, albeit without India having significant leverage on Rafale supply line...
I agree , absolutely agree .
Indian mwf or tejas Mk 2 is still 1 year away from rollout , plus f 16 is a proven platform ,very proven one indeed.
 

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