Jihadi's own country: Going Radical in Kerala

Agnostic_Indian

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There are "isolated" cases of such type and so the smoke.
There is a possibility/ a reasonable chance but no such cases or attempts are are proven in india.you said you are an advocate so you should know better.
Statistics never lie, and are a proof that something fishing is happening, anything can be ignored but statistics.


The problem is that you do not want to accept the statistics hence all the arguments, probably you haven't seen any such case with your own eyes, I being an advocate have seen at least 2 cases, that's why I know something is wrong with some people.
Statistics is just a data it doesn't revel the reasons behind the data, to know the reasons you need to conduct study and analysis.even if i accept that there are rare cases of love jihad, then also such rare incidents cant make up the numbers of conversion which we are seeing...so logically it's other socio - religious and many other reasons like i suggested.
 

A chauhan

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There is a possibility/ a reasonable chance but no such cases or attempts are proven in india.you said you are an advocate so you should know better.
People know what is truth, there are things which are accepted beyond and without the Court, in Court's view terrorism too doesn't have any link with Islam but people know the reality, sometimes public opinion is more considered than the court.
 

Agnostic_Indian

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People know what is truth, there are things which are accepted beyond and without the Court, in Court's view terrorism too doesn't have any link with Islam but people know the reality, sometimes public opinion is more considered than the court.
You just comapred apples and oranges.
court rules based on the facts available..court punishes individuals and also bans anti social orgs which are using/basing there ideology on any particular religion.courts recognises and acknoledges existance of such things..othewise it cannont ban such org or like in thins case ask govt to make law to prevent misuse of conversion. however court or govt or society sees these groups not as a mainstreme but an abberation from the mainstreme religion and religious teachings..religiously motivated crimes also are seen as many other ideology/identity motivated crimes done by fringes groups or individual whether it's based on political ideology, racial ideology, lingustic ideolgy etc..purprtators are punished... fringe org are banned...but court doesn't ban whole " groupe/identity/ideology " they used as a motive..because the that ideology or identity with it's mainstreme members/ followers doesn't propogate or promote the those crimes.







Your attempt is to reject the police investigation reports and court verdict..you are closing your eye on such strong established fact and still want to belive that there is love jihad going on in india solely based on a statistical annomaly.


Even your logic behind beliving the existence of love jihad is faulty because you look at stastics and say " because more hindus converted to islam so love jihad must be happening.. " but love jihad if it was so rampent it would have been established easily in the police investigation. So next possibility is either it doesn't exist or its happening very rarely. Even if it happens very rarely it cannont contribute much to the large number of discripancy in conversions..it wont contribute much to the numbers.so natural conclusion is that there are some other socio religious behind the conversions..that's the only logical conclusion we can make.










investigators on the other hand do identify the link of ideology or reason behind any moticated crime including religiously motivated crimes.
 

A chauhan

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You just comapred apples and oranges.
court rules based on the facts available..court punishes individuals and also bans anti social orgs which are using/basing there ideology on any particular religion.courts recognises and acknoledges existance of such things..othewise it cannont ban such org or like in thins case ask govt to make law to prevent misuse of conversion. however court or govt or society sees these groups not as a mainstreme but an abberation from the mainstreme religion and religious teachings..religiously motivated crimes also are seen as many other ideology/identity motivated crimes done by fringes groups or individual whether it's based on political ideology, racial ideology, lingustic ideolgy etc..purprtators are punished... fringe org are banned...but court doesn't ban whole " groupe/identity/ideology " they used as a motive..because the that ideology or identity with it's mainstreme members/ followers doesn't propogate or promote the those crimes.

Your attempt is to reject the police investigation reports and court verdict..you are closing your eye on such strong established fact and still want to belive that there is love jihad going on in india solely based on a statistical annomaly.


investigators on the other hand do identify the link of ideology or reason behind any moticated crime including religiously motivated crimes.
It was an example and not comparison, Statistical anomaly ? lol !

Just go back to page 1 and check post #19 relating to Mohammad Sulaiman that's a one case. Many are there which go unreported and undetected. Does it mean such cases never happen since the Kerala HC has stopped the investigation ? Nope.

If something has not been proved in the court then it doesn't mean it's false, it means there is a lack of evidence, which can be brought up next time whenever they get it. A Discharge doesn't mean Acquittal.

Even your logic behind beliving the existence of love jihad is faulty because you look at stastics and say " because more hindus converted to islam so love jihad must be happening.. " but love jihad if it was so rampent it would have been established easily in the police investigation. So next possibility is either it doesn't exist or its happening very rarely. Even if it happens very rarely it cannont contribute much to the large number of discripancy in conversions..it wont contribute much to the numbers.so natural conclusion is that there are some other socio religious behind the conversions..that's the only logical conclusion we can make.
That's not my logic, In one of the cases the boy wanted to marry the younger sister of the same Hindu wife saying that it's his Islamic right, but her father's due intervention stopped it (dono behano ko pataya tha usne). He used to say that I married a non-Muslim girl since it is my duty. We filed divorce case against him and divorce was granted ex-parte. Later that boy married a Muslim girl. It was a case of love jihad but who will report it ? girl ? father? none, as everyone wants to live peacefully without disputes and controversy. What if the father had reported it to the police ? what the police would have found in it ? nothing !! (the boy was Mukhabir of police and had political approach as well) there are things which go unreported to police and media. Marital relationship is something which people doesn't want to publicize or report to media to avoid infamy and shame, so majority of such cases go unreported. I am not shouting that Love Jihad is happening everywhere and it's a dangerous crisis, but it's a reality though the numbers might be of less value in the national scenario. People need to be aware of it and not politicize it.

Neither your repeated replies nor Kerala HC's conclusion will turn those cases into false.
 

Mad Indian

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I am actually surprised that you people have so much patience to reply to someone who is denying what even the court has already stated as a fact. Secular reptiles are too obvious. Hindus must really be that retarded to take them at their face value:tsk:
 

A chauhan

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I am actually surprised that you people have so much patience to reply to someone who is denying what even the court has already stated as a fact. Secular reptiles are too obvious. Hindus must really be that retarded to take them at their face value:tsk:
I am also tired with it, he is rejecting the idea of love jihad in a whole, while there have been many cases reported/unreported. He has not gone with the Kerala HC's case details, how Kerala HC slapped police and how after deep frustration it stopped the case.
 
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OneGrimPilgrim

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I am also tired with it, he is rejecting the idea of love jihad in a whole, while there have been many cases reported/unreported. He has not gone with the Kerala HC's case details, how Kerala HC slapped police and how after deep frustration it stopped the case.
LJ isn't a nationally declared crisis (yet) for one very obvious reason, which we all know. the govt. won't do it, and it would be talked about only on the ground - professed by the perpetrators, recounted by the victims, worryingly discussed by those concerned, & denied by those willingly wearing blinkers or suffering from the ostrich-syndrome. we see this trait prevalent among a society's naysayers & cynics; for instance, in the 2 chaddi-buddy militant atheist buffoons named dawkins & randi who are prime examples of patients suffering (from) this particular eccentricity. this ilk largely never speaks/goes against the tide of the mainstream/establishment/powers-that-be/authority's narrative. a change in this behaviour would be a remote possibility, even if the train were to hit or graze by some time.
 

Mad Indian

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LJ isn't a nationally declared crisis (yet) for one very obvious reason, which we all know. the govt. won't do it, and it would be talked about only on the ground - professed by the perpetrators, recounted by the victims, worryingly discussed by those concerned, & denied by those willingly wearing blinkers or suffering from the ostrich-syndrome. we see this trait prevalent among a society's naysayers & cynics; for instance, in the 2 chaddi-buddy militant atheist buffoons named dawkins & randi who are prime examples of patients suffering (from) this particular eccentricity. this ilk largely never speaks/goes against the tide of the mainstream/establishment/powers-that-be/authority's narrative. a change in this behaviour would be a remote possibility, even if the train were to hit or graze by some time.
I think there needs to be a two pronged strategy , expose the reptiles like the one in this thread for what they are, and two wake up the Hindu retards
I thought that step two , waking up Hindus itself is enough. But clearly, its not he case. Reptiles have become evennmore brazen than before in their bull and the snake oil they sell...
 

Mad Indian

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I am also tired with it, he is rejecting the idea of love jihad in a whole, while there have been many cases reported/unreported.
Which just proves what kind of reptile he is. From Kerala , talking about secularism should have given you hints before and now it has been confirmed. That's why I am saying Hindus should stop this whole " true " secularism bull shit. We should redefine the rules to rig it in our favor. Nothing short of that will put the reptiles where they belong- in the gutter. Tolerance should not come at our own survival
 

Agnostic_Indian

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It was an example and not comparison, Statistical anomaly ? lol !

Just go back to page 1 and check post #19 relating to Mohammad Sulaiman that's a one case. Many are there which go unreported and undetected. Does it mean such cases never happen since the Kerala HC has stopped the investigation ? Nope.

If something has not been proved in the court then it doesn't mean it's false, it means there is a lack of evidence, which can be brought up next time whenever they get it. A Discharge doesn't mean Acquittal.
case is discharged since there is no evidance and if and when there is evidance then it can be proceed. But A court will only proceed with the case if there is enough evidance to proceed, then only there is scope for an acquital. There was not enough evidance to even proceed with the case. Acquittal can happen only if case is accepted taking the evidance at face value.so it's innocent until proven guilty.


We have seen so many such cases and its results but as of now police reports and court verdicts indicate there is no love jihad in india.

But having said that i don't deny a possibility of such incidents...after all india is a country with millions of people..but two thing are very clear, it's very rare 2) imbalanced conversion numbers are not because of some love jihad since it any such rare cases even if it's there will not contribute much to the numbers.



That's not my logic, In one of the cases the boy wanted to marry the younger sister of the same Hindu wife saying that it's his Islamic right, but her father's due intervention stopped it (dono behano ko pataya tha usne). He used to say that I married a non-Muslim girl since it is my duty. We filed divorce case against him and divorce was granted ex-parte. Later that boy married a Muslim girl. It was a case of love jihad but who will report it ? girl ? father? none, as everyone wants to live peacefully without disputes and controversy. What if the father had reported it to the police ? what the police would have found in it ? nothing !! (the boy was Mukhabir of police and had political approach as well) there are things which go unreported to police and media. Marital relationship is something which people doesn't want to publicize or report to media to avoid infamy and shame, so majority of such cases go unreported. I am not shouting that Love Jihad is happening everywhere and it's a dangerous crisis, but it's a reality though the numbers might be of less value in the national scenario. People need to be aware of it and not politicize it.

Neither your repeated replies nor Kerala HC's conclusion will turn those cases into false.
I prefer not to discuss anecdotes.
Difference between your position and mine is that you call it a reality despite police investigations from central and state govt suggest othewise and courts acceptance of that. I on the other hand think that love jihad is not there in india but i am open to accept the chances of its existence... but i will only accept it when its proven. I thinks that's a far more rational approach than saying love jihad exists because there is so much rumours about it.

even i/or sombody else can accuse hindu groups and say they are making forced conversions/ re conversions...i just don't have the proof of it..but it doses not mean it's not happening in india. Then i can make a hate propaganda and use it for political or what ever gains. Those who use such incidents doesn't tell the truth that its a rare occerance, instead they project it as a wide spread big anti hindu ajenda and hindu numbers are declining because of this. This is where i oppose this and say love jihad doesn't exist..the love jihad doesn't exist statement should be read as " love jihad doesn't exist in any meaningfull scale ". Same is the case when you/ or any hindu say " hindus doesn't force convert " or " we don't have a concept of conversion ". It essentially means that " by and large there is no forced conversion by hindus.but there is always a possibility of such incidents happening india.

Truth is...in a vast county with millions of people there is always a chance of such rare incidents.
 

OneGrimPilgrim

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existence of LJ would be acceptable only when its proven --> supposedly a 'rational' approach than relying on 'rumours'.

Hindus do forced 'conversions'/re-conversions....although no proof of it, but that doesn't mean the phenomenon doesn't exist.

aanhh achchha! to aisa hai! [emoji122]

'rationality' much? or much contradiction?! [emoji11]

useless mental cartwheeling again at its finer phase. [emoji38]

@A chauhan, @Mad Indian - a few drops more of the fine reptilian oil you love so much! rub on your forehead and you'll realise (again) - "tel mein jaaduu haiiiiii!"






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Sakal Gharelu Ustad

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existence of LJ would be acceptable only when its proven --> supposedly a 'rational' approach than relying on 'rumours'.

Hindus do forced 'conversions'/re-conversions....although no proof of it, but that doesn't mean the phenomenon doesn't exist.

aanhh achchha! to aisa hai! [emoji122]

'rationality' much? or much contradiction?! [emoji11]

useless mental cartwheeling again at its finer phase. [emoji38]

@A chauhan, @Mad Indian - a few drops more of the fine reptilian oil you love so much! rub on your forehead and you'll realise (again) - "tel mein jaaduu haiiiiii!"






Sent from my BN NookHD+ using Tapatalk
I missed that gem of a post!!! Thanks!
 

A chauhan

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existence of LJ would be acceptable only when its proven --> supposedly a 'rational' approach than relying on 'rumours'.

Hindus do forced 'conversions'/re-conversions....although no proof of it, but that doesn't mean the phenomenon doesn't exist.
You summed him up in two sentences. He just compared the legal conversion with illegal LJ.

case is discharged since there is no evidance and if and when there is evidance then it can be proceed. But A court will only proceed with the case if there is enough evidance to proceed, then only there is scope for an acquital. There was not enough evidance to even proceed with the case. Acquittal can happen only if case is accepted taking the evidance at face value.so it's innocent until proven guilty.
:confused1:
We have seen so many such cases and its results but as of now police reports and court verdicts indicate there is no love jihad in india.
Repeated arguments. Kerala police didn't work well and after a great disappointment with them the HC stopped investigations.

But having said that i don't deny a possibility of such incidents...after all india is a country with millions of people..but two thing are very clear, it's very rare 2) imbalanced conversion numbers are not because of some love jihad since it any such rare cases even if it's there will not contribute much to the numbers.
Repeated arguments.

I prefer not to discuss anecdotes.
Difference between your position and mine is that you call it a reality despite police investigations from central and state govt suggest othewise and courts acceptance of that. I on the other hand think that love jihad is not there in india but i am open to accept the chances of its existence... but i will only accept it when its proven. I thinks that's a far more rational approach than saying love jihad exists because there is so much rumours about it.
Repeated arguments.

Except Tara Shahdeo no LJ case has been investigated by the CBI or central agencies which is still due since there are too many terror outfits working inside India.

even i/or sombody else can accuse hindu groups and say they are making forced conversions/ re conversions...i just don't have the proof of it..but it doses not mean it's not happening in india.
Hindus doesn't have the concept of Jihad.

Then i can make a hate propaganda and use it for political or what ever gains. Those who use such incidents doesn't tell the truth that its a rare occerance, instead they project it as a wide spread big anti hindu ajenda and hindu numbers are declining because of this. This is where i oppose this and say love jihad doesn't exist..the love jihad doesn't exist statement should be read as " love jihad doesn't exist in any meaningfull scale ". Same is the case when you/ or any hindu say " hindus doesn't force convert " or " we don't have a concept of conversion ". It essentially means that " by and large there is no forced conversion by hindus.but there is always a possibility of such incidents happening india.

Truth is...in a vast county with millions of people there is always a chance of such rare incidents.
You are comparing Conversion to Love-Jihad, now it is called comparing apples and oranges. Conversion is a legal concept, Love-Jihad is illegal.

I gave you a case history but you called it an anecdote. @saty told you about Mohammad Sulaiman but it's of no use to you. If I start to give details of what Pakistanis do with Hindu girls then you will say it is about Pakistan. If even after giving you such accounts you still need Court's orders, then it's a lost case.
 

OneGrimPilgrim

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what if..what if..what if some muslims/mullas themselves were to admit the existence of LJ or confess to professing it/are found professing it secretively or openly? would that be good enough? crank bukhari sr. called upon muslims last year to practice LJ en masse (though good that many if not most muslims despise him & his nautankibaazi and ignored him sending heaps of laanat upon him, much-deservingly). now bukhari jr. is to be married to a Hindu girl (obviously a stupid lass unfortunate enough to be his GF) who would be reqd. to first convert to islam. why?! does love require cultish conversion? this is 'legitimate LJ', cases where the Special Marriage Act is conveniently forgotten (or does anyone even remember/know of its existence in the first place?!)

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Agnostic_Indian

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:confused1:

Repeated arguments. Kerala police didn't work well and after a great disappointment with them the HC stopped investigations.
It's not only kerala police but central govt reports also ruled out love jihad. When investigation is not right court pull up the cops and they have have to satisfy the court then only court will accept their finding and close the case.so your arguement thag court fed up and closed the case is nonsense.
Except Tara Shahdeo no LJ case has been investigated by the CBI or central agencies which is still due since there are too many terror outfits working inside India.
Other cases have been investigated and results are on my side. In this case also nothing is proven yet so you can't prejudge and say love jihad is here.


Hindus doesn't have the concept of Jihad.



You are comparing Conversion to Love-Jihad, now it is called comparing apples and oranges. Conversion is a legal concept, Love-Jihad is illegal.
Did i say jihad ? Why did you missed the word " forced conversion and forced re conversion ? Is that legal too ?
It's not at all comparing apples and oranges. I am giving another example using your logic. by your logic i can accuse hindu groups of doing forced conversions and reconversions,(or any crime for that matter, even if court discharged them ) just like you don't have a proof for love jihad i too doesn't have a proof...but my excuse is same as your's " it's too hard to prove "..if I don't have proof today I will get it tomorrow...but i start accusing them today itself.

Your position would have been understandable if there was no police investigation and court's acceptance of it. Then you like all of us could form a opinion based on our best undestanding of the various media reports etc..we form such opinions on many matters..but since this matter has been investigated and ruled out its absolutely irrational to continue to with the love jihad exists arguement.


I gave you a case history but you called it an anecdote. @saty told you about Mohammad Sulaiman but it's of no use to you. If I start to give details of what Pakistanis do with Hindu girls then you will say it is about Pakistan. If even after giving you such accounts you still need Court's orders, then it's a lost case.
It's a discription of the case you handled..i have no way to varify his statements or facts of the matter.
 
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Agnostic_Indian

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existence of LJ would be acceptable only when its proven --> supposedly a 'rational' approach than relying on 'rumours'.

Hindus do forced 'conversions'/re-conversions....although no proof of it, but that doesn't mean the phenomenon doesn't exist.

aanhh achchha! to aisa hai! [emoji122]

'rationality' much? or much contradiction?! [emoji11]

useless mental cartwheeling again at its finer phase. [emoji38]

@A chauhan, @Mad Indian - a few drops more of the fine reptilian oil you love so much! rub on your forehead and you'll realise (again) - "tel mein jaaduu haiiiiii!"






Sent from my BN NookHD+ using Tapatalk
You should read bit more carefully.read post #38 now.
 

Screambowl

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This RSS needs some cool dudes who can seriously think about creating such an image of RSS and Hindus , which not just look decent but cool. This is the only way we can get rid of conversion, I am telling again and again.

Look at those songs, man kunto maula, khawaja mere khwaja.. why cannot we use sanskrit version and produce some good songs which may sound cool instead of Chamiya sheela and munni??:doh:

Similarly, the image of Muslims is like they dont fear, they don't accept other's term and be adamant and blunt.. where as these lazy asses have made us Hindus look like some bunch of rabbits.. I mean why?:mad2:

The only cool song I heard recently on a Hindu name was... in agent vinod.
''Govind Bolo Gopal Bolo jo chahey bolo .. hari hari''

It gave an image about rough and tough RAW agent whose name is Gopal or Govind.. related to Sri Krishna.:cool1:

Tamasha bana rakha hai .. it is extremely High time to change how do we show ourselves. Sikhs have done it.. but we Hindus need it now!!!!:smash:
 

OneGrimPilgrim

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This RSS needs some cool dudes who can seriously think about creating such an image of RSS and Hindus , which not just look decent but cool. This is the only way we can get rid of conversion, I am telling again and again.

Look at those songs, man kunto maula, khawaja mere khwaja.. why cannot we use sanskrit version and produce some good songs which may sound cool instead of Chamiya sheela and munni??:doh:

Similarly, the image of Muslims is like they dont fear, they don't accept other's term and be adamant and blunt.. where as these lazy asses have made us Hindus look like some bunch of rabbits.. I mean why?:mad2:

The only cool song I heard recently on a Hindu name was... in agent vinod.
''Govind Bolo Gopal Bolo jo chahey bolo .. hari hari''

It gave an image about rough and tough RAW agent whose name is Gopal or Govind.. related to Sri Krishna.:cool1:

Tamasha bana rakha hai .. it is extremely High time to change how do we show ourselves. Sikhs have done it.. but we Hindus need it now!!!!:smash:
the bane(s) of a pluralistic Dharm/civilisation! slavery has neutered the urban Hindu to such an extent that he (more so, 'she') seems ready to demean & discard his identity at the first instance available! what to talk of finding pride then! but am glad this deep gangrene seems to be largely healing up gradually.

mainstream bhaiwoodian cinema is hopeless! urdu-hindustani suckers. go regional. even bhaiwood movies with regional context to them are better. for instance, you would find ample such works in Marathi cinema for one. non-,mainstream music, you remember about the band 'Agni'? i think it was before paki music seeped in here. had Sanskrit named titles with some serious music (no casual stuff). Indian Ocean too is/was quite desi ('Maa Rewa', delectably desi!). i believe some new bands too have Sanskritised names/track-titles, esp. i think black metal ones (can't digest their constipated voice singing), even if in semblance. sorry for the OT.

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Screambowl

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@Screambowl RSS won't change.What kind of image you think common Muslims have in India?. Ask any common man they says "mullas are either Cycle mechanic,road side sellers and/or they live in dirty ghettos".
(apart from rioters/terrorists).

Hindus need not create a new image, (our NRI's and culture is enough) just manage our filthiest media outlets English News & Bolly s**.They are the biggest brainwashing industries in India.Thanks to SM Eng news lost its relevance and credibility.

Bolly is always a 3rd grade industry for me as a southie I likes to watch Holly 1st, 2nd regional and 3rd Bolly.Bolly mullas are desperate for 20cr (Paki pop) new market.Before that porkis watched all movies in DVD's.

Anyway with BJP in center Shiv sena in local these bolly paki lovers will face daily band baja barat.
I am going to write to RSS now that change the way you show yourself. Because they look like some petu paan eaters buddhe in nicker. This is being honest. More over, RSS now has to influence Bollywood.

To counter the presstitute intellects making fun of the Hindus daily, this is the time to bring change in the outfit and thoughts. In South India at least in film Industry they are trying and moulding public opinion but still it is not that effective.

The Jehad, and Wahabism on the ideology of Ibn Tehmiya is so effective that it makes one so bloody damn fearless in the name of religion. But some how Mongols countered it through their culture and won Baghdad and Mecca.

Similar kind of ideology but not a suicide ideology is needed to counter this proxy and infowar. Not a bihari punjabdi desi attitude, which is also not in our culture.

Nepal's pride is their Gurkhas world famous, plus they are Hindus, and this is the way they counter. How about Hindus in India, who are easy target of these presstitutes and intellect.

NRI's from Punjab are mostly Jahils and NRI's from other regions are also easy target because they are more into acceptance .
 

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