JF-17 Thunder / FC-1 Xiaolong

Rahul Singh

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That only means one thing: the original plan was failed. The existing and mature technologies that India has are not good enough to support this plan. That is why Indian scientists have to take risk of implementing new technologies by the end of project.



Why a smokeless propulsion is a necessary for a BVR air-air missile? Is this required by force or added-in by fantasy scientists?
In first quote you replied that changing to smokeless propulsion meant the original plan failed. And very next quote you want to question the requirement of Smokeless propulsion?

Oxymoronic and a case of cluelessness about context and the topic.


No, what people fail to understand is that any weapon procurement is not scheduled on dream. It is generally decided by your expectation of your enemy's technology development, weapon deployment, etc, etc. Too long time overdue will make the weapon of the project no longer effective when face with latest enemy weapon. Certainly, you shouldn't be surprise that user will put down a new requirement.
And the context is?
 

Steven Rogers

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That people fail to understand is that any weapon procurement is not scheduled on dream. It is generally decided by your expectation of your enemy's technology development, weapon deployment, etc, etc. Too long time overdue will make the weapon of the project no longer effective when face with latest enemy weapon. Certainly, you shouldn't be surprise that user will put down a new requirement.
Procurement policy in india is based on requirement rather than what chinese and napakis have accumulated....
 

shiphone

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oh,dear...PAF's JF-17 in Farnborough, Paris, Doha, Dubai, Poland, Turkey Airshows,of course in Airshow China .......LOL, where r u then?

Indian style Ignorance and hubris ,the unbelievable logic are always shocking and amusing...

BTW, I'm right in Langkawi watching the LCA's rehearsal. waiting for the official ones which starts tomorrow @1200-1430...

微信图片_20190325192352.jpg

-------------------
Malaysian PM visited the PAC and the JF-17 days ago.



Myanmar Air Force's 7th JF-17 -- A two-seater JF-17B... so MAF is the 2nd customer of JF-17B


 
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Bleh

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oh,dear...PAF's JF-17 in Farnborough, Paris, Doha, Dubai, Poland, Turkey Airshows,of course in Airshow China .......LOL, where r u then?
Now that FOC Tejas is to be available, Jf-17 is gonna start backing out of even more airshows from next year. :biggrin2:
Myanmar Air Force's 7th JF-17 -- A two-seater JF-17B... so MAF is the 2nd customer of JF-17B
Tejas will never out-sell this cheap crap though... Just like F-16 was outsold 3:1 by Mig-21! :)
 
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Neo

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oh,dear...PAF's JF-17 in Farnborough, Paris, Doha, Dubai, Poland, Turkey Airshows,of course in Airshow China .......LOL, where r u then?

Indian style Ignorance and hubris ,the unbelievable logic are always shocking and amusing...

BTW, I'm right in Langkawi watching the LCA's rehearsal. waiting for the official ones which starts tomorrow @1200-1430...

Myanmar Air Force's 7th JF-17 -- A two-seater JF-17B... so MAF is the 2nd customer of JF-17B



Please share some fresh close up pics of MAF JF-17. Thx.
 

Steven Rogers

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oh,dear...PAF's JF-17 in Farnborough, Paris, Doha, Dubai, Poland, Turkey Airshows,of course in Airshow China .......LOL, where r u then?

Indian style Ignorance and hubris ,the unbelievable logic are always shocking and amusing...

BTW, I'm right in Langkawi watching the LCA's rehearsal. waiting for the official ones which starts tomorrow @1200-1430...

View attachment 33521
-------------------
Malaysian PM visited the PAC and the JF-17 days ago.



Myanmar Air Force's 7th JF-17 -- A two-seater JF-17B... so MAF is the 2nd customer of JF-17B


No india never backed off in the last moment.
 

Tang

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oh,dear...PAF's JF-17 in Farnborough, Paris, Doha, Dubai, Poland, Turkey Airshows,of course in Airshow China .......LOL, where r u then?

Indian style Ignorance and hubris ,the unbelievable logic are always shocking and amusing...

BTW, I'm right in Langkawi watching the LCA's rehearsal. waiting for the official ones which starts tomorrow @1200-1430...

View attachment 33521
-------------------
Malaysian PM visited the PAC and the JF-17 days ago.



Myanmar Air Force's 7th JF-17 -- A two-seater JF-17B... so MAF is the 2nd customer of JF-17B


Why are you even claiming that JF17 is your product or a so-called Joint project.
Myanmar deal was between China and Myanmar,you are just a customer like Myanmer
nothing more.

BTW This is your Burraq drone & Chinese CH-3
BurraqvsCH31-1024x363.png

I can give countless examples in tanks missiles etc.
You just paint it in green, nothing more.

Advice from my side, first try to make a good indigenous passenger car.
 

bose

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Why are you even claiming that JF17 is your product or a so-called Joint project.
Myanmar deal was between China and Myanmar,you are just a customer like Myanmer
nothing more.

BTW This is your Burraq drone & Chinese CH-3
View attachment 33532
I can give countless examples in tanks missiles etc.
You just paint it in green, nothing more.

Advice from my side, first try to make a good indigenous passenger car.
Even the green paint is also imported and not made in their country...

Passenger car will be too far ... first they should make a scooter or a bike engine of 80 CC...
 

no smoking

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Procurement policy in india is based on requirement rather than what chinese and napakis have accumulated....
Well, the problem is that Indian members here tried very hard to argue that the procurement policy in India should be based on the manufacturer's "requirement" instead of users or customers requirement.
There is no customer in other part of worlds will face such kind of accusation after the vendor long time delay.
 

no smoking

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For better fuel burning, high kinetic energy imparted to the missile, high endurance of the missile.
Was this required by IAF from the beginning of the project or an additional requirement added in after the long time project delay in order to keep up with the world latest tech level?
 

Bleh

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I think the shiphone guy is a chink, not pork...
Why are you even claiming that JF17 is your product or a so-called Joint project.
Myanmar deal was between China and Myanmar,you are just a customer like Myanmer
nothing more.

BTW This is your Burraq drone & Chinese CH-3
View attachment 33532
I can give countless examples in tanks missiles etc.
You just paint it in green, nothing more.

Advice from my side, first try to make a good indigenous passenger car.
 

Steven Rogers

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Was this required by IAF from the beginning of the project or an additional requirement added in after the long time project delay in order to keep up with the world latest tech level?
You need to learn a thing, todays requirement is obsolete 15 years down the lane. All current projects are running for meeting current and 'future' requirement. It wasnt a requirement but a necessity.
 

Steven Rogers

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Well, the problem is that Indian members here tried very hard to argue that the procurement policy in India should be based on the manufacturer's "requirement" instead of users or customers requirement.
There is no customer in other part of worlds will face such kind of accusation after the vendor long time delay.
Members here matter nothing in the government decision.
 

BON PLAN

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...
In 1983, IAF realised the need for an Indian combat aircraft for two primary purposes. The principal and most obvious goal was to replace India's ageing MiG-21 fighters, which had been the mainstay of the IAF since the 1970s.
...
In 1984, the Indian government chose to establish the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) to manage the LCA programme. While the Tejas is often described as a product of Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL), responsibility for its development belongs to ADA, a national consortium of over 100 defence laboratories, industrial organisations, and academic institutions with HAL being the principal contractor.[19] The government's "self-reliance" goals for the LCA included the three most sophisticated and challenging systems: the fly-by-wire (FBW) flight control system (FCS), multi-mode pulse-doppler radar, and afterburning turbofan engine.[20]

The IAF's Air Staff Requirement for the LCA were not finalised until October 1985. This delay rendered moot the original schedule which called for first flight in April 1990 and service entry in 1995; however, it also gave the ADA time to better marshal national R&D and industrial resources, recruit personnel, create infrastructure, and to gain a clearer perspective of which advanced technologies could be developed locally and which would need to be imported.[15][21]

Project definition commenced in October 1987 with France's Dassault-Breguet Aviation as consultants. Dassault-Breguet were to assist in the design and systems integration of the aircraft, with 30 top-flight engineers reported to have flown to India to act as technical advisers to IADA, in exchange for $100m / ₹560 crore(equivalent to ₹52 billion or US$730 million in 2018), this phase was completed in September 1988.[21][22]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAL_Tejas
 

Steven Rogers

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...
In 1983, IAF realised the need for an Indian combat aircraft for two primary purposes. The principal and most obvious goal was to replace India's ageing MiG-21 fighters, which had been the mainstay of the IAF since the 1970s.
...
In 1984, the Indian government chose to establish the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) to manage the LCA programme. While the Tejas is often described as a product of Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL), responsibility for its development belongs to ADA, a national consortium of over 100 defence laboratories, industrial organisations, and academic institutions with HAL being the principal contractor.[19] The government's "self-reliance" goals for the LCA included the three most sophisticated and challenging systems: the fly-by-wire (FBW) flight control system (FCS), multi-mode pulse-doppler radar, and afterburning turbofan engine.[20]

The IAF's Air Staff Requirement for the LCA were not finalised until October 1985. This delay rendered moot the original schedule which called for first flight in April 1990 and service entry in 1995; however, it also gave the ADA time to better marshal national R&D and industrial resources, recruit personnel, create infrastructure, and to gain a clearer perspective of which advanced technologies could be developed locally and which would need to be imported.[15][21]

Project definition commenced in October 1987 with France's Dassault-Breguet Aviation as consultants. Dassault-Breguet were to assist in the design and systems integration of the aircraft, with 30 top-flight engineers reported to have flown to India to act as technical advisers to IADA, in exchange for $100m / ₹560 crore(equivalent to ₹52 billion or US$730 million in 2018), this phase was completed in September 1988.[21][22]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAL_Tejas
And when project was sanctioned and budget was released.
 

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