J20 Stealth Fighter

[ARVION]

If you quote someone's words, please quote their original not your own modification.
Pupu says:

"Indigenous engine, thrust improved version of Taihang (WS-10). Not only Sir zhang, but also Sir Xu checked it. They were both satisfied with it except it is not WS-15."

He mentioned nothing about the future of WS-15.

Could have, and will and about the WS 15 that was my personal opinion the time for it to get into the j 20 are quoted from 3 to 5 years, which I think could take atleast 5 years given no new information is available, and the time frame for Ws 15 has been slipped so many time it could be no surprise the that the the new variant of the J 20's to start flying will atleast take that time's.

 

[ARVION]

J-20 is not more than a tactical weapon, compared to hypersonic weapons is useless, a MiG-31 carrying hypersonic weapons is harder to beat simply because it can fire their missiles from distances no fighter can reach it, add air to air missiles have ranges of 100Km head on if lucky, J-20 will not be ble to attack hypersonic weapons speacially those from submarines, in few words J-20 is only for skirmishes or border dispute at the most, once ICBMs or weapons of mas destruction are used stealth is no use.

Russia for such reasons only develops SAMs and ICBMs as priority and stealth fighters for export and the same is the USA with F-35.


Japan buying 100+ F-35 will be able to counter act China easily and with hypersonic missiles on Tu-160 or MiG-31 easily J-20 beocmes obsolete, J-20 is no STOL needs long strips and is maintainace difficult to keep, hypersonic weapons can destroy its bases.

Well with the IHI completing the XF 9's capable's of producing the 200 KN's thrust's the chinese will be really face a difficult situatione's.

 

[MiG-29SMT]

Well with the IHI completing the XF 9's capable's of producing the 200 KN's thrust's the chinese will be really face a difficult situatione's.

Our Chinese friends think they will control the world but even Japan is not in better situation, J-20 is a pride weapon, somethink to make the chinese nationalists proud, the reality on a nuclear armed conflict weapons of mass destruction are higher priority because those really weaken the enemy, J-20 has DSI intakes that at the most will boost it to Mach 1.8, it will never reach hypersonic weapons speeds, and it is more expensive that hypersonic weapons, the Tu-160 is far more capable, Russia does not build a stealth bombers because if you add range of Tu-160 plus hypersonic cruise missiles, then you make a Tu-160 as capable as a B-2 or even more, stealth is propaganda, India if really wants to focus on deterrance just needs better ICBMs, or SLBMs and good SAMs and a token force of good fighters, China is like the communist party pure propaganda

 

[IndianHawk]

Ok I have strong objections . But dont Have much time but I would like to tell , we cannot get any clue of its DSI without actual tests . Softwares can simulate somewhat but still not much authentic . Chinese have experience in DSI JF17 , J10 are examples , in case if they have any faults they can fix it in next iteration . Super Cruise is mainly depends on the aerodynamic shaping As an example Both Tejas and Gripen NG uses same engines but Gripen can Super Cruise but Tejas can't .

Tejas uses f404 , gripen NG uses f414 , mwf will use f414 and will supercruise in name only just like gripen NG.

 

[ARVION]

Our Chinese friends think they will control the world but even Japan is not in better situation, J-20 is a pride weapon, somethink to make the chinese nationalists proud, the reality on a nuclear armed conflict weapons of mass destruction are higher priority because those really weaken the enemy, J-20 has DSI intakes that at the most will boost it to Mach 1.8, it will never reach hypersonic weapons speeds, and it is more expensive that hypersonic weapons, the Tu-160 is far more capable, Russia does not build a stealth bombers because if you add range of Tu-160 plus hypersonic cruise missiles, then you make a Tu-160 as capable as a B-2 or even more, stealth is propaganda, India if really wants to focus on deterrance just needs better ICBMs, or SLBMs and good SAMs and a token force of good fighters, China is like the communist party pure propaganda

Until meta surface's are perfected the stealth is at losing ground's as of currently's now.

 

[Emperor Kalki]

Tejas uses f404 , gripen NG uses f414 , mwf will use f414 and will supercruise in name only just like gripen NG.

I am pretty sure gripen can supercruise in the air too and not just on the paper....
And for the mwf supercruise was never envisaged....so not so sure about that...
But I also hope for some serendipity...

 

[IndianHawk]

I am pretty sure gripen can supercruise in the air too and not just on the paper....
And for the mwf supercruise was never envisaged....so not so sure about that...
But I also hope for some serendipity...

It can't . All it can do is go supersonic then close afterburner and cruise for a while still being over Mach numbers.(1.1M) But it can't carry any useful weaponry for that.

Saab marketing is bogus.

Rafale can Supercruise at 1.4 M with a drop tank and 4 air to air missiles. That's a practical Supercruise useable.

 

[Emperor Kalki]

It can't . All it can do is go supersonic then close afterburner and cruise for a while still being over Mach numbers.(1.1M) But it can't carry any useful weaponry for that.

Saab marketing is bogus.

Rafale can Supercruise at 1.4 M with a drop tank and 4 air to air missiles. That's a practical Supercruise useable.

Well, then, this guy's lying

Former Swedish Air Force Flight Engineer explains how the Saab Gripen can Dogfight and Win Against (Almost) Any Dissimilar Aircraft - The Aviation Geek Club

Former Swedish Air Force Flight Engineer explains how the Saab Gripen can Dogfight and Win Against (Almost) Any Dissimilar Aircraft

www.google.com

 

[ARVION]

Well, then, this guy's lying

Former Swedish Air Force Flight Engineer explains how the Saab Gripen can Dogfight and Win Against (Almost) Any Dissimilar Aircraft - The Aviation Geek Club

Former Swedish Air Force Flight Engineer explains how the Saab Gripen can Dogfight and Win Against (Almost) Any Dissimilar Aircraft

www.google.com

Well they are lying, even the J 20's can cruise with WS 10 B's if we go for some stupid arguement made by the Chinese's.

 

[Emperor Kalki]

Well they are lying, even the J 20's can cruise with WS 10 B's if we go for some stupid arguement made by the Chinese's.

Just so its clear, I still hold this opinion....but all opinions are welcome...

I am pretty sure gripen can supercruise in the air too and not just on the paper....
And for the mwf supercruise was never envisaged....so not so sure about that...
But I also hope for some serendipity...

 

[Karthi]

Tejas uses f404 , gripen NG uses f414 , mwf will use f414 and will supercruise in name only just like gripen NG.

Tejas won't super cruise even with GE 414.

 

[ARVION]

Tejas won't super cruise even with GE 414.

Who said about full cruise capabilitie's.

 

[Karthi]

Don't know why everyone is Like J20 is not threat , Mig 31 is better MKIs better Tejas can beat J20 . Total crap thinking . To develop anything we need Money , Testing and Research facilities , human resources China has everything , they can develop Fifth generation Aircraft's , what we are doing , finding excuses everytime , just chilling by saying J20 won't work , then they developing J31 again We are like J31 is junck , MKI can handle , Rafale can handle it etc then now they are researching on Sixth generation fighters what would be our reaction Sixth generation is junck or MKI can defeat Sixth generation . This is pathetic

 

[ARVION]

Don't know why everyone is Like J20 is not threat , Mig 31 is better MKIs better Tejas can beat J20 . Total crap thinking . To develop anything we need Money , Testing and Research facilities , human resources China has everything , they can develop Fifth generation Aircraft's , what we are doing , finding excuses everytime , just chilling by saying J20 won't work , then they developing J31 again We are like J31 is junck , MKI can handle , Rafale can handle it etc then now they are researching on Sixth generation fighters what would be our reaction Sixth generation is junck or MKI can defeat Sixth generation . This is pathetic

We ar talking about current J 20's not the future variant's.

 

[IndianHawk]

Tejas won't super cruise even with GE 414.

Neither does gripen NG in any meaningful way. Just broucher specs.

 

[Emperor Kalki]

Hate to say this, but most of the threads (especially all the fighter jet ones) have turned into just places for fanboy speculation and for non-stop silly and unproductive blabbering.....
I am not being hypocritical or sanctimonious, but there it is, that's what i feel....

 

[ARVION]

Hate to say this, but most of the threads (especially all the fighter jet ones) have turned into just places for fanboy speculation and for non-stop silly and unproductive blabbering.....
I am not being hypocritical or sanctimonious, but there it is, that's what i feel....

I never speculate but mere stated the facts available at now, correct or not, we overly under estimate the Rafale's over the J 20 's.

 

[Emperor Kalki]

correct or not, we overly under estimate the Rafale's over the J 20 's.

I was not talking about that...this is my opinion about all the fighter threads be it the tejas one, mwf, all of them have turned more or less trash..... I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings but what the hell....

Our Chinese friends think they will control the world but even Japan is not in better situation, J-20 is a pride weapon, somethink to make the chinese nationalists proud, the reality on a nuclear armed conflict weapons of mass destruction are higher priority because those really weaken the enemy, J-20 has DSI intakes that at the most will boost it to Mach 1.8, it will never reach hypersonic weapons speeds, and it is more expensive that hypersonic weapons, the Tu-160 is far more capable, Russia does not build a stealth bombers because if you add range of Tu-160 plus hypersonic cruise missiles, then you make a Tu-160 as capable as a B-2 or even more, stealth is propaganda, India if really wants to focus on deterrance just needs better ICBMs, or SLBMs and good SAMs and a token force of good fighters, China is like the communist party pure propaganda

 

[IndianHawk]

Don't know why everyone is Like J20 is not threat , Mig 31 is better MKIs better Tejas can beat J20 . Total crap thinking . To develop anything we need Money , Testing and Research facilities , human resources China has everything , they can develop Fifth generation Aircraft's , what we are doing , finding excuses everytime , just chilling by saying J20 won't work , then they developing J31 again We are like J31 is junck , MKI can handle , Rafale can handle it etc then now they are researching on Sixth generation fighters what would be our reaction Sixth generation is junck or MKI can defeat Sixth generation . This is pathetic

J20 falls way short by china's own standard. It's definitively engine is no where is sight . It's underpowered . It's canards are anti stealth unless they don't move at all which is ridiculous.

It only has limited frontal stealth and rear rcs is huge. Even that frontal aspect is compromised by movement of canards. Plus without stealth engine it will glow like a volcano in Infrared spectrum.

It's avionics is easily a generation behind rafale . Spectra is in whole different league compared to even American avionics. Chinese are simply no where close.

And then it's missiles are inferior to meteor or even derby ER. Pl15 is probably just good against awacs at range and I have yet to find it's authentic weight. Still to fight Indian jets it will have to bring them within NEZ of pl15 and pl12 which is not more than 40km in best case scenario. At 40-50km distance su30mki or rafales irst /ols passive sensors would have tracked and locked j20 already.

Infact rafale would lock it at much larger distance with meteor and passive tracking. Not to mention rafale has active cancellation.

A thorough assessment tells us j20 is not a real threat right now. It will become a threat in next 8-10 years as Chinese mature it and improve their avionics which is hopeless right now.

By that time either we shall have large numbers of rafale and su30 upgrade going on or we shall be looking at su57 mature version with new engines in limited numbers as we mature AMCA in the next decade.

 

[Emperor Kalki]

I was not talking about that...this is my opinion about all the fighter threads be it the tejas one, mwf, all of them have turned more or less trash..... I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings but what the hell....

Maybe i just need some break from all this....