INSAS Rifle, LMG & Carbine

[Shaitan]

Who are the other guys?????

Indonesian maritime security force.

 

[ezsasa]

Close up of OFB 7.62X51 Sniper

Close up of OFB .338 Sniper

Both without scope

Nice..
sniper rifle has changed.
1) fluted barrel
2) bipod is closer to trigger now
3) cheek rest is carbon and bigger now

let there be more iterations and testing..

 

[Unknowncommando 2]

INSAS with OFB Telescopic Sight & 30 round Magazine

 

[Unknowncommando 2]

Machine Gunner's view
INSAS LMG

 

[ALBY]

Who are the other guys?????

Most probably Maldives cost guard

 

[Rchauhan]

We still have INSAS in service , Our Braves will have to fight with this piece of shit on the eastern Front .... Fukking Babus ,,,I hope this time it at-least functions and dosent fail like Kargil

 

[Unknowncommando 2]

INSAS LMG with OFB Scope

 

[Shaitan]

Most probably Maldives cost guard

Indonesian - the same uniform

Achmad Taufiqoerrochman, head of the Indonesian Maritime Security Agency

 

[ALBY]

Indonesian - the same uniform

Achmad Taufiqoerrochman, head of the Indonesian Maritime Security Agency

My bad.............

 

[Tridev123]

We still have INSAS in service , Our Braves will have to fight with this piece of shit on the eastern Front .... Fukking Babus ,,,I hope this time it atetra-least functions and dosent fail like Kargil

The INSAS has become an enigma. While it has many detractors there are also people who support it saying it is an indigenous product. It probably will be in
use in non insurgency /terrorism situations for at least a decade.

The main villain in the INSAS story is the OFB. They are accused of turning an good
design into an embarrassment through shitty manufacturing and quality control. Since we are going to use the INSAS for a further decade an radical step needs to be taken. OFB should stop making the rifle and the IPR and detailed design of the INSAS should be transferred to the private sector. Kalyani group or L&T etc should be given the licence. The Government should guarantee orders for 100,000 to 200, 000 units to equip State Armed Police battalions many of which still use Lee Enfield bolt action rifles. Also there should be no restrictions on exports with the Government notifying a negative list of countries like Pakistan etc to which exports
would not be permitted. That means barring a small number of hostile nations the private manufacturer can export to the whole world.

I believe in this type of atmosphere the private manufacturer will not only maintain quality but will also innovate in the design. We will likely see major modifications in the INSAS design to make it contemporary and appealing to the international buyers. An apparent failure can be turned into a success story. The profit motive will spur the Indian Pvt Company to somehow overcome the defects in the INSAS and find buyer's internationally.

Maybe after finding other countries buying the INSAS in large numbers our Army will take a relook at the gun. Though the 7.62 * 51 round has greater range and stopping power there is still a role for the 5.56 * 45 round. A dependable 5.56 rifle is also needed.

 

[WolfPack86]

DRDO-OFB Joint Venture Protective Carbine (JVPC 5.56×30mm) in service Credits to 'Shaitan' from Defence Forum India (DFI) for the picture.

 

[Tridev123]

they
DRDO-OFB Joint Venture Protective Carbine (JVPC 5.56×30mm) in service Credits to 'Shaitan' from Defence Forum India (DFI) for the picture.

Looks badaas. Hope it's performance is as good. We don't want Insas rifle like complaints. Jamming, magazine plastic cover breaking, oil spurting etc. Any light can be thrown on one unwelcome observation made about the JVPC - Under auto fire the foldable butt starts bending a bit. Is it true?. The folding butt cannot take the shock of the recoil well. I heard this observation in one of the many videos on the JVPC. If they have managed to develop both a gorgeous looking and also dependable sub machine gun then all imports for this calibre of firearms should be stopped and large orders placed for the JVPC.

The mass production agency chosen should not turn into a headache. Design is good but production is shitty. The Army will obviously then reject the gun. Please choose a capable production agency which can deliver a quality product.

 

[ALBY]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/englis...se-500-guns-1-5-lakh-bullets-kerala-1.4051335
Even if we deduct the price of ammo, we get the cost per Insas rifle as approximately 59000 rupees.Even an M4 costs less than that in US.

 

[Flying Dagger]

The INSAS has become an enigma. While it has many detractors there are also people who support it saying it is an indigenous product. It probably will be in
use in non insurgency /terrorism situations for at least a decade.

The main villain in the INSAS story is the OFB. They are accused of turning an good
design into an embarrassment through shitty manufacturing and quality control. Since we are going to use the INSAS for a further decade an radical step needs to be taken. OFB should stop making the rifle and the IPR and detailed design of the INSAS should be transferred to the private sector. Kalyani group or L&T etc should be given the licence. The Government should guarantee orders for 100,000 to 200, 000 units to equip State Armed Police battalions many of which still use Lee Enfield bolt action rifles. Also there should be no restrictions on exports with the Government notifying a negative list of countries like Pakistan etc to which exports
would not be permitted. That means barring a small number of hostile nations the private manufacturer can export to the whole world.

I believe in this type of atmosphere the private manufacturer will not only maintain quality but will also innovate in the design. We will likely see major modifications in the INSAS design to make it contemporary and appealing to the international buyers. An apparent failure can be turned into a success story. The profit motive will spur the Indian Pvt Company to somehow overcome the defects in the INSAS and find buyer's internationally.

Maybe after finding other countries buying the INSAS in large numbers our Army will take a relook at the gun. Though the 7.62 * 51 round has greater range and stopping power there is still a role for the 5.56 * 45 round. A dependable 5.56 rifle is also needed.

Insas use MINSAS round 30mm not 45 mm. The time for that round is over as an assault rifle.

INSAS is done and dusted. Army will likely fall in love with New Aks and ARs.

Perhaps private industry can compete and bring better or similar iteration of them.

 

[Flying Dagger]

The INSAS has become an enigma. While it has many detractors there are also people who support it saying it is an indigenous product. It probably will be in
use in non insurgency /terrorism situations for at least a decade.

The main villain in the INSAS story is the OFB. They are accused of turning an good
design into an embarrassment through shitty manufacturing and quality control. Since we are going to use the INSAS for a further decade an radical step needs to be taken. OFB should stop making the rifle and the IPR and detailed design of the INSAS should be transferred to the private sector. Kalyani group or L&T etc should be given the licence. The Government should guarantee orders for 100,000 to 200, 000 units to equip State Armed Police battalions many of which still use Lee Enfield bolt action rifles. Also there should be no restrictions on exports with the Government notifying a negative list of countries like Pakistan etc to which exports
would not be permitted. That means barring a small number of hostile nations the private manufacturer can export to the whole world.

I believe in this type of atmosphere the private manufacturer will not only maintain quality but will also innovate in the design. We will likely see major modifications in the INSAS design to make it contemporary and appealing to the international buyers. An apparent failure can be turned into a success story. The profit motive will spur the Indian Pvt Company to somehow overcome the defects in the INSAS and find buyer's internationally.

Maybe after finding other countries buying the INSAS in large numbers our Army will take a relook at the gun. Though the 7.62 * 51 round has greater range and stopping power there is still a role for the 5.56 * 45 round. A dependable 5.56 rifle is also needed.

Insas use MINSAS round 30mm not 45 mm. The time for that round is over as an assault rifle.

INSAS is done and dusted. Army will likely fall in love with New Aks and ARs.

Perhaps private industry can compete and bring better or similar iteration of them.

 

[piKacHHu]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/englis...se-500-guns-1-5-lakh-bullets-kerala-1.4051335
Even if we deduct the price of ammo, we get the cost per Insas rifle as approximately 59000 rupees.Even an M4 costs less than that in US.

It works out to be less than INR 50,000 per piece against the current dollar rate. And we flaunt cheap labor and production cost in India to woo the FDIs !
Such a criminal misuse of taxpayer money to buy a junk rifle and awarding the incompetence of OFB babus.

"FN’s contract with the Army is $77 million for the first 120,000 rifles, which works out to a bottom line of just under $642 per M4A1. These will be manufactured at FNH USA in South Carolina along side the M16A4s and M249s FNH USA currently produces for the U.S. armed forces."

FNH Lands Army M4 Contract, Underbids Colt, Remington :: Guns.com

In this final round of bidding for the U.S. Army contract for up to $180 million's worth of M4A1 carbines, FNH has placed the last and lowest bid.

www.guns.com

Fortunately, good sense prevailed and we ordered SIGs; which will definitely come handy on Chinese front due to longer effective range. But we can't rule out OFB/MOD's continuous efforts to shove down their another crap in .308 caliber INSAS down the throat of IA. Hope this time, IA wouldn't let them succeed in their shenanigans.

 

[Wisemarko]

OFB made Hi Power 9 mm Pistol. Mint Condition.

Note the beautiful Parkerization (Phosphate finish) on the pistol.

https://www.gunauction.com/buy/8161...fZHl4-7UxeRjrAcT8-8Vt_kOb0Z-g5S84vHekH1s262og

Wonder if these handguns are exported to the US. Hi-power copies sellout fast. This looks identical to Inglis version.

 

[Tridev123]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/englis...se-500-guns-1-5-lakh-bullets-kerala-1.4051335
Even if we deduct the price of ammo, we get the cost per Insas rifle as approximately 59000 rupees.Even an M4 costs less than that in US.

Agree that the OFB produces inferior products at a higher cost. This is true across a variety of weapons. HAL produces Su 30mki at a higher cost than imported Russian Su30 mki. HAL wanted more manhours per Rafale and would have produced the Rafale at a higher cost. This was one of the reasons for the negotiations breaking down between Dassault and HAL.

The reasons are many. Lower productivity of the Indian workforce, higher cost of capital, higher inflation, taxes etc. The problem of high cost of production is prevalent across the entire industrial sector and is particularly acute in the public /state owned units.

I had suggested in my post that the production be given to a private sector company as they are more flexible in controlling costs.

But comparing every indigenous weapon or system to a western competitor and running down our institutions is misguided and wrong. Most of the Western Arms companies have been producing weapons for decades and have amortised costs. Most of the time our weapons will fare poorly in the comparison. But we are a developing country with a short history and we will suffer from some defects for some time. If our indigenous weapons meet minimum standards then they should be supported.

Its like wanting very fair beautiful blonde Western women as wives and looking down on Indian women. But the truth is that by marrying an Indian woman you have a greater chance of a successful marriage. The foreigner will probably dump the Indian husband in a few years.

 

[porky_kicker]

Agree that the OFB produces inferior products at a higher cost. This is true across a variety of weapons. HAL produces Su 30mki at a higher cost than imported Russian Su30 mki. HAL wanted more manhours per Rafale and would have produced the Rafale at a higher cost. This was one of the reasons for the negotiations breaking down between Dassault and HAL.

The reasons are many. Lower productivity of the Indian workforce, higher cost of capital, higher inflation, taxes etc. The problem of high cost of production is prevalent across the entire industrial sector and is particularly acute in the public /state owned units.

I had suggested in my post that the production be given to a private sector company as they are more flexible in controlling costs.

But comparing every indigenous weapon or system to a western competitor and running down our institutions is misguided and wrong. Most of the Western Arms companies have been producing weapons for decades and have amortised costs. Most of the time our weapons will fare poorly in the comparison. But we are a developing country with a short history and we will suffer from some defects for some time. If our indigenous weapons meet minimum standards then they should be supported.

Its like wanting very fair beautiful blonde Western women as wives and looking down on Indian women. But the truth is that by marrying an Indian woman you have a greater chance of a successful marriage. The foreigner will probably dump the Indian husband in a few years.

The reason of higher su30 cost manufactured in India is different

Russia played india for a fool when they inserted clause that India will need to source raw materials for su30 to be manufactured in india from Russia.

Hence the higher costs in India

Blame the idiot indian negotiators who signed the deal . Most probably bribes was paid

 

[Tridev123]

It works out to be less than INR 50,000 per piece against the current dollar rate. And we flaunt cheap labor and production cost in India to woo the FDIs !
Such a criminal misuse of taxpayer money to buy a junk rifle and awarding the incompetence of OFB babus.

"FN’s contract with the Army is $77 million for the first 120,000 rifles, which works out to a bottom line of just under $642 per M4A1. These will be manufactured at FNH USA in South Carolina along side the M16A4s and M249s FNH USA currently produces for the U.S. armed forces."

FNH Lands Army M4 Contract, Underbids Colt, Remington :: Guns.com

In this final round of bidding for the U.S. Army contract for up to $180 million's worth of M4A1 carbines, FNH has placed the last and lowest bid.

www.guns.com

Fortunately, good sense prevailed and we ordered SIGs; which will definitely come handy on Chinese front due to longer effective range. But we can't rule out OFB/MOD's continuous efforts to shove down their another crap in .308 caliber INSAS down the throat of IA. Hope this time, IA wouldn't let them succeed in their shenanigans.

Nobody wants to force the Army to accept inferior weapons. I had said that if the private manufacturer manages to make the Insas defects free and delivers a new contemporary version of the Insas the Army may be tempted to reconsider. No international buyer will pay dollars to buy an defective Insas. So it means that the private manufacturer has to improve the current version of the rifle to meet the requirements of the overseas buyers. Some design changes may be.

I had said that the Insas can replace old bolt action rifles in the States Armed Police battalions. What is wrong with that. I did not say guarantee sales to the Army. Obviously the MHA will buy the Insas only if they meet specifications. The private company will be told that we guarantee 200,000 sales only if the rifles are in acceptable condition. So nobody is being forced to buy shit.

Do you not want to see the ugly duckling turn into a beauty?. Is there no room for improvement on the Insas platform?.Allow the private sector to try.