INS Vishal (IAC- II) Aircraft Carrier - Flattop or Ski Jump

[IndianHawk]

They were discussing about the large carrier matter since decades, also Carriers won't sail alone, and you can't even know there is a carrier sailing nearby or not,

Our Vishal sized same like Charles de Gaulle, not a gigantic Ford size

You can exactly know where the carrier is .
With so many satellites in the orbit with resolution in meters a Carrier is always visible.
Yes carriers sail in battle groups. But that is more protection from Sea based platforms . Missiles can still overwhelm any defense layer.

Vishal size is about 65000ton displacement as per report that goes into super carrier category by definition .

 

[IndianHawk]

You must assume the designers are aware of this and have everything into consideration while releasing this. Most of the missile signatures are well know in the defence circles so should be a problem for direct energy weapons. Assuming this they might want to make such carriers.

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It's not missile signature or even warhead but the sheer speed that has emerged as new threat. A hypersonic bramhos will hit a Carrier deck it could lock one . Once fired at Mach 5 it just can't be stopped as of now.

Now with long range cruise as china claims they can hit a Carrier even at a distance from where the carrier aircraft can't reach the Chinese shore. That negates the whole logic of aircraft carriers as an attack platform. They are still formidable at sea control mind you.

 

[IndianHawk]

and you peoples still thinks, America strike their enemy after enemy fired a shot..

Well America hasn't take on enemy with such technological capabilities of late .

 

[Screambowl]

problem with emals is .. if its down.. it would take time to repair the coiling.

 

[republic_roi97]

Also the follow on Arihant's are doubler the size than ATV Arihant, and we know few of them already in construction..I sure they pack more than some 120 MW reactor inside it

In the development of vishal, i doubt that we will have problem in making the propulsion system or integrating the nuclear reactors, the problem would mostly the CATOBAR configuration, which would not be much in the case, we opt for the proven steam catapult. But the problem with EMALS is that it is still a amateur technology and we have to wait for first few years after the first american carrier gets inducted and see how it performs and all the tweaks and improvements after which it becomes sufficiently mature design, or we could independently work on our own EMALS technology and let it improve over time, but I guess that would take some time for us to figure out.

 

[republic_roi97]

It's not missile signature or even warhead but the sheer speed that has emerged as new threat. A hypersonic bramhos will hit a Carrier deck it could lock one . Once fired at Mach 5 it just can't be stopped as of now.

Now with long range cruise as china claims they can hit a Carrier even at a distance from where the carrier aircraft can't reach the Chinese shore. That negates the whole logic of aircraft carriers as an attack platform. They are still formidable at sea control mind you.

US is working on laser beam based air defence system (so is India, Russia, China) for quite a while now and its technology might be implemented before a hypersonic missile is fabricated.

 

[IndianHawk]

US is working on laser beam based air defence system (so is India, Russia, China) for quite a while now and its technology might be implemented before a hypersonic missile is fabricated.

Lasers have a long way to go now my friend .
Missiles are almost here. Scramjet engines are being tested already and rest of the mechanics is well developed as fron ballistic missiles experiences we know how to handle hypersonic speeds .

If you look at overall picture it's always easier to attack than defense. It's also more probable . That is we are looking at concepts like distribute warfare where your forces are scattered and networked.
A huge carrier goes against the concept.

 

[SajeevJino]

You can exactly know where the carrier is .
With so many satellites in the orbit with resolution in meters a Carrier is always visible.
Yes carriers sail in battle groups. But that is more protection from Sea based platforms . Missiles can still overwhelm any defense layer.

Vishal size is about 65000ton displacement as per report that goes into super carrier category by definition .

actually it's not work like that, It's very hard to monitor a moving target with satellite 24x7

 

[SajeevJino]

problem with emals is .. if its down.. it would take time to repair the coiling.

The ship must have two EMALS, if one fails, other can ..Ford has four

 

[IndianHawk]

actually it's not work like that, It's very hard to monitor a moving target with satellite 24x7

Yes I agree it's hard and that it will be twice as much hard to monitor two smaller carriers. Anywhich way logic bends towards smaller carriers :biggrin2:

 

[SajeevJino]

Yes I agree it's hard and that it will be twice as much hard to monitor two smaller carriers. Anywhich way logic bends towards smaller carriers :biggrin2:

US wants to keep big number of fighter jets in one floating base which can able to launch more number of fighters in very less time, and wants the carrier safe from enemy AShM range..

Marines and Navy too had small LHD's which can launch F 35 B and AV 8B

 

[wuzetian]

Indian navy already learned well the Steam catapult's by using the R 11, now it's time for more modern more capable EMALS

You think our Navy can't able to handle the EMAL

The viraat didn't have steam catapults. It was a ski jump carrier

 

[wuzetian]

Indian navy already learned well the Steam catapult's by using the R 11, now it's time for more modern more capable EMALS

You think our Navy can't able to handle the EMAL

I have visited both the Viraat and the new under construction Vikrant at Cochin shipyard ..

 

[IndianHawk]

US wants to keep big number of fighter jets in one floating base which can able to launch more number of fighters in very less time, and wants the carrier safe from enemy AShM range..

Marines and Navy too had small LHD's which can launch F 35 B and AV 8B

US being US they can still field multiple super carriers and complicate the game plane. We'll have to do with just one super carrier .

They will not be for off from enemy ashm as ashm are approaching 2000km+ ranges.
And that more than combat range of most carrier aircrafts. ???

 

[republic_roi97]

Why not to modify a oil tanker or ore carrier like MS Ore Brasil which happens to be 400,000 tons. Lets just modify it from the inside to carry airplanes and missile launchers beneath the hull and deck, I think that would be cool, the moment we invade the territory of the enemy, we deploy our systems just like tanks are deplyed from landing dock ships, just without getting to the land.

 

[republic_roi97]

The viraat didn't have steam catapults. It was a ski jump carrier

INS Vikrant (R11), the decommissioned one, used to have steam catapult but later on it was removed and modified to be a STOBAR.

 

[kurup]

The viraat didn't have steam catapults. It was a ski jump carrier

R11 is INS Vikrant-1 ... our first aircraft carrier ...... It had steam catapults .

 

[wuzetian]

R11 is INS Vikrant-1 ... our first aircraft carrier ...... It had steam catapults .

Thank you ... My mistake I thought about R22 Viraat

 

[wuzetian]

INS Vikrant (R11), the decommissioned one, used to have steam catapult but later on it was removed and modified to be a STOBAR.

But why were the Catapults removed? Were they considered inferior to ski jump

 

[Filtercoffee]

But why were the Catapults removed? Were they considered inferior to ski jump

R11 had sea harriers.

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