INS Vikrant Aircraft Carrier (IAC)

[Cruise missile]

You are right.
But see where the Kaveri is. Far away the target. Despite decades.
Sorry if it hurts you, it's not my goal.

Well it gave us good lessons u will see derivative of kaveri in UCAV.

 

[johnq]

You are right.
But see where the Kaveri is. Far away the target. Despite decades.
Sorry if it hurts you, it's not my goal.

Are you Chinese?

 

[silentlurker]

20 years is a long time. With time and scientific ingenuity, all things are possible. Do not underestimate the brilliance of Indian engineers and scientists. They proved the world wrong on the Tejas, and they will do the same when it comes to engines.

Indians are better at coming up with ideas/solutions than the Chinese: This is mainly due to India being an open society that welcomes independent thought, vs China being a closed society where thoughts and ideas are deeply censored.

Then there are also the technological restrictions placed on China because of the lack of trust with the CCP and the PLA. Forget the west, even Russia is not willing to share critical technologies with China.

Indian researchers and engineers, on the other hand, can be found on the teams of the most cutting edge projects. I foresee a future where India and the west will collaborate on new technologies, as both are open societies.

Kaveri started in 1996, it's been 20 years already...

 

[BON PLAN]

Are you Chinese?

NO. Fully French.

 

[BON PLAN]

Are you Chinese?

I don't want to use the chinese exemple becaus I know the bad relations between you, but see how many money, how many engineers, how many time they spent to master fighter engine technology. It's not made yet (but I think they are near the graal).

 

[johnq]

I don't want to use the chinese exemple becaus I know the bad relations between you, but see how many money, how many engineers, how many time they spent to master fighter engine technology. It's not made yet (but I think they are near the graal).

Chinese copies of russian AL-31 engines break down after 80 hours, and they are still not operational; they are still using Russian engines on their operational aircraft and the Chinese ones are just used for propaganda purposes. They tried to steal it from the Russians, but were unsuccessful, even after 2 decades. By the time they do succeed, the world will have moved on.

There is a right way and a wrong way to do things. Chinese Communist government always takes the wrong path of lying, cheating and stealing because they are criminals. India follows the rules and gets help through legitimate means like paying for technology licenses. India will be successful precisely because of this.

France is currently helping India work out the final issues with its engines, and India will succeed in operational engines soon, with legitimately licensed technologies from France.
These will be modern engines that are reliable, unlike the unreliable poor copies made by the Chinese. The Chinese still use Russian engines on all their aircraft (and even exports like JF-17s) precisely because of this reason.

India has access to these licensed technologies because of good relations/trust with France and other countries. Communist China doesn't have access to these technologies from anyone (including Russia) because nobody trusts them. Everyone knows they are IP thieves and criminals who never follow the laws, which is why they will be left behind.

 

[FalconSlayers]

You are right.
But see where the Kaveri is. Far away the target. Despite decades.
Sorry if it hurts you, it's not my goal.

No it may not be useful for Fighters but Kaveri has been selected for our Stealth AURA UCAV project, it will power the Ghatak UCAV of the AURA project.

 

[Kumata]

I don't want to use the chinese exemple becaus I know the bad relations between you, but see how many money, how many engineers, how many time they spent to master fighter engine technology. It's not made yet (but I think they are near the graal).

you can go this far only with stolen and copycat techs . Think Johnq have beautifully put it together. We have made the needed progress and where we are lacking, we get that from partners like france / US / russia in a legit way respecting their R & D and paying fully for it.

Our way is bit costly and lengthy but in the end , it pays off beautifully. There is a reason we managed to develop tejas in house sans engine....and the moment, we break that glass ceiling with Kaveri, there is no looking back...

 

[Maharaj samudragupt]

Are you Chinese?

He is a French

 

[BON PLAN]

No it may not be useful for Fighters but Kaveri has been selected for our Stealth AURA UCAV project, it will power the Ghatak UCAV of the AURA project.

Indeed. All is not to scrap, but the goal was too high, specially to developp simultaneously the jet (the smaller of its categorie) and the engine.

 

[FalconSlayers]

Indeed. All is not to scrap, but the goal was too high, specially to developp simultaneously the jet (the smaller of its categorie) and the engine.

We became too ambitious for engines instead of taking baby steps we were trying for a big leap which was impossible.

 

[BON PLAN]

Chinese copies of russian AL-31 engines break down after 80 hours, and they are still not operational; they are still using Russian engines on their operational aircraft and the Chinese ones are just used for propaganda purposes. They tried to steal it from the Russians, but were unsuccessful, even after 2 decades. By the time they do succeed, the world will have moved on.

There is a right way and a wrong way to do things. Chinese Communist government always takes the wrong path of lying, cheating and stealing because they are criminals. India follows the rules and gets help through legitimate means like paying for technology licenses. India will be successful precisely because of this.

France is currently helping India work out the final issues with its engines, and India will succeed in operational engines soon, with legitimately licensed technologies from France.
These will be modern engines that are reliable, unlike the unreliable poor copies made by the Chinese. The Chinese still use Russian engines on all their aircraft (and even exports like JF-17s) precisely because of this reason.

India has access to these licensed technologies because of good relations/trust with France and other countries. Communist China doesn't have access to these technologies from anyone (including Russia) because nobody trusts them. Everyone knows they are IP thieves and criminals who never follow the laws, which is why they will be left behind.

I fully agree.
But I add something : a country that is able to developp and produce spacecraft and to land a rover on the moon is probably near to be self reliant on jet engine.

 

[FalconSlayers]

I fully agree.
But I add something : a country that is able to developp and produce spacecraft and to land a rover on the moon is probably near to be self reliant on jet engine.

Indeed

 

[BON PLAN]

We became too ambitious for engines instead of taking baby steps we were trying for a big leap which was impossible.

baby steps was the politic of Dassault. With the result we all know.

 

[FalconSlayers]

baby steps was the politic of Dassault. With the result we all know.

The problem is the sanctions Uncle Sam had imposed on us after our Nuclear Tests, the reason was not just Nukes that we tested but the fact that CIA was unable to detect our Nuclear Program and we tested our Nuclear devices under their nose hence Uncle Sam imposed sanctions out of frustration that caused the worst effect on our Integrated Guided Missile Program and LCA program and the worst affected were subsystems and engine development.

 

[Kumata]

The problem is the sanctions Uncle Sam had imposed on us after our Nuclear Tests, the reason was not just Nukes that we tested but the fact that CIA was unable to detect our Nuclear Program and we tested our Nuclear devices under their nose hence Uncle Sam imposed sanctions out of frustration that caused the worst effect on our Integrated Guided Missile Program and LCA program and the worst affected were subsystems and engine development.

were not those for cryogenic tech ... which we mastered anyways....

 

[FalconSlayers]

were not those for cryogenic tech ... which we mastered anyways....

Yes it was but the tech collaboration on various places were also affected.

 

[johnq]

I fully agree.
But I add something : a country that is able to developp and produce spacecraft and to land a rover on the moon is probably near to be self reliant on jet engine.

It's apples and oranges. Different technolgies involved. India has also launched satellites and spacecraft. Making an engine that is reliable for 8000 hours is different from say, a rocket or a missile that only has to last less than an hour. After 20 years and tens of billions of dollars, Chinese engines that are copies of 30 year old Russian AL-31 engines only last 80 hours before breaking down.

 

[BON PLAN]

It's apples and oranges. Different technolgies involved. India has also launched satellites and spacecraft. Making an engine that is reliable for 8000 hours is different from say, a rocket or a missile that only has to last less than an hour. After 20 years and tens of billions of dollars, Chinese engines that are copies of 30 year old Russian AL-31 engines only last 80 hours before breaking down.

Never underestimate a potential ennemy....

 

[Killbot]

Indeed. All is not to scrap, but the goal was too high, specially to developp simultaneously the jet (the smaller of its categorie) and the engine.

We started with a 110 kN jet engine. The bar was simply too high to succeed. But we might with another shot.