Indian Special Forces

[Automatic Kalashnikov]

 

[Pig benis on sushy]

Dude how naive are you? No one is going to convey their real feelings on a international military exercise. There are thousands of interviews of US spec ops guys on the internet, not once have they mentioned Indian sf as equal. But you can find them gushing over the SAS and their european counterparts. They come to India mostly for show and charity, to teach us.

They don't come for charity or show they come for interoperability and both forces share their experiences same goes when we go to Indonesia or Russia teaching does not equal interoperability even in exercises large exercises in AF and navy . No one is fool to spend fuel , time and money for charity seems you are going way out of your mind too much reddit special forces .

 

[vidhwanshak]

They don't come for charity or show they come for interoperability and both forces share their experiences same goes when we go to Indonesia or Russia teaching does not equal interoperability even in exercises large exercises in AF and navy . No one is fool to spend fuel , time and money for charity seems you are going way out of your mind too much reddit special forces .

what are you saying?
Do you even realize what are you saying? How dare you talk sensibly in this thread? Dude, you are too naive.
You just don't realize that western SF fighting Taliban/ISIS who don't have radars, SAM, NV, is first grade but Indian SF conducting ops against Pakis and Chinkis who are more trained/organized peer force is second grade.
Always remeber the Manhattan mantra before posting something:

There are thousands of interviews of US spec ops guys on the internet, not once have they mentioned Indian sf as equal. But you can find them gushing over the SAS and their european counterparts. They come to India mostly for show and charity, to teach us.

 

[SGOperative]

Mods will this thread be locked now? Asking for a friend

 

[ManhattanProject]

Okay.
Naive == believing Indian operator interview
Intelligent == believing Western SF operator interview

Those arent Interviews, most like podcasts from ex SF guys, go do your own research.

 

[ManhattanProject]

what are you saying?
Do you even realize what are you saying? How dare you talk sensibly in this thread? Dude, you are too naive.
You just don't realize that western SF fighting Taliban/ISIS who don't have radars, SAM, NV, is first grade but Indian SF conducting ops against Pakis and Chinkis who are more trained/organized peer force is second grade.
Always remeber the Manhattan mantra before posting something:

Try broadening your horizon a little, i used to be like you too. I used to watch those sf rank videos and think tucking pants in shoes wearing a vest and bonnie hat makes a commando. Then as i did more research listened to experts i came to my conclusion. You can say what you want, our men are brave probably braver than most but they are not valued trained or equipped as they deserve to be. They are the best India has to offer for god sakes.

 

[Fire and groove]

Yep but according to exfarts aren't they less competent than Para SF , since they get casualties while CI/CT operations , ONE genius said it's a shame in special forces when one is hit on the chest during operations. Also Garuds should operate behind army units.

I mean, two guys on the left are already flagging their buddies.

 

[SGOperative]

I mean, two guys on the left are already flagging their buddies.

Hard to tell and most probably are not, They seem to be a bit Infront of those guys

 

[Fire and groove]

Hard to tell and most probably are not, They seem to be a bit Infront of those guys

Nah. For one, flagging doesn't require directly pointing the weapon at an individual, even ppinting your weapon in the general direction of friendlies without the contextualised need is flagging. Plus you can see that one of them is placed online while his gun points to the guy kneeling far right.

 

[vidhwanshak]

Those arent Interviews, most like podcasts from ex SF guys, go do your own research.

now you are pointing point interview/podcast mistakes. A podcast is generally just you talking and an interview involves two or more person where they ask you questions.
I never saw Indian SF podcast that's why I wrote interview and also given a link of one of those interviews just below that message.

Try broadening your horizon a little, i used to be like you too. I used to watch those sf rank videos and think tucking pants in shoes wearing a vest and bonnie hat makes a commando. Then as i did more research listened to experts i came to my conclusion. You can say what you want, our men are brave probably braver than most but they are not valued trained or equipped as they deserve to be. They are the best India has to offer for god sakes.

To be frank I just want to have the same level of clarity as you in this regard. Please bear with me and read this:
Unlike you, I don't think that western SF are breed apart as compared to Indian SF. I do agree about types of equipment. Gears could have saved the lives of many soldiers and operators lekin MoD deti nahi hai.
Ab rahi baat ops ki, mujhe yaad nahi hai ki konsi western SF ne apni peer force ke khilaf ops kiye hai recent times me. Agar pata ho to pls bataao. Lekin Indian SF ne kiye hai, bina casualty ke kiye hai.
Abhi kuch forum memeber bol rahe the ki Indian SF ka to kashmir me casualty ho jaata hai lekin unhe pata bhi hai kitne Americans soldiers and SF ke operator mare the Afganistan me?

Jaake wiki pe padh lo. Indian soldier ko bhi same logo se ladna padta tha Kashmir me. Taliban bhi pakistan dawara trained the aur Kashmiri Insurgents bhi. Infact, 400+ Talibani maare gaye hai kashmir me. @FalconSlayers ne data share kiya tha terrorist killed aur unki nationality ka.

Overall casualties of coalition

This is Indian record in kashmir

Ye sab dekh ke mujhe nahi lagta ki western soldiers and western SF zaada acche hai Indian soldiers/SF se.
Lekin mai chahta hu ki mai bhi aapki tarah badi badi baate likhu aur army ko crticise karu acche se.

Mai pahle hi bata dena chata hu comparison bilkul sahi hai:
Taliban and Kahmiri Insurgent train kiye gaye hai Pakistan dawara. Western SF ke pass uss time bhi bullet proof jacket and helemt the. Apne soldiers ke pass nahi the. Ye wala factor maine include nahi kiya kyuki this is our own inability that we aren't able to provide them with gears.

Please apne counters rakhe jisse thread zaada productive bane.
Meri analysis me jo khaami hai please bataao kyuki unlike you, I am not an expert.
Thank you for reading.

Data taken for tthe western soldiers and SF from:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Enduring_Freedom

United States military casualties in the War in Afghanistan - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

.

For Indian:

Insurgency in Jammu and Kashmir - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Fire and groove]

You're looking at statistical outcomes without a y cont

now you are pointing point interview/podcast mistakes. A podcast is generally just you talking and an interview involves two or more person where they ask you questions.
I never saw Indian SF podcast that's why I wrote interview and also given a link of one of those interviews just below that message.


To be frank I just want to have the same level of clarity as you in this regard. Please bear with me and read this:
Unlike you, I don't think that western SF are breed apart as compared to Indian SF. I do agree about types of equipment. Gears could have saved the lives of many soldiers and operators lekin MoD deti nahi hai.
Ab rahi baat ops ki, mujhe yaad nahi hai ki konsi western SF ne apni peer force ke khilaf ops kiye hai recent times me. Agar pata ho to pls bataao. Lekin Indian SF ne kiye hai, bina casualty ke kiye hai.
Abhi kuch forum memeber bol rahe the ki Indian SF ka to kashmir me casualty ho jaata hai lekin unhe pata bhi hai kitne Americans soldiers and SF ke operator mare the Afganistan me?
View attachment 148174
Jaake wiki pe padh lo. Indian soldier ko bhi same logo se ladna padta tha Kashmir me. Taliban bhi pakistan dawara trained the aur Kashmiri Insurgents bhi. Infact, 400+ Talibani maare gaye hai kashmir me. @FalconSlayers ne data share kiya tha terrorist killed aur unki nationality ka.
View attachment 148175
View attachment 148176
Overall casualties of coalition
View attachment 148178


This is Indian record in kashmir
View attachment 148177


Ye sab dekh ke mujhe nahi lagta ki western soldiers and western SF zaada acche hai Indian soldiers/SF se.
Lekin mai chahta hu ki mai bhi aapki tarah badi badi baate likhu aur army ko crticise karu acche se.

Mai pahle hi bata dena chata hu comparison bilkul sahi hai:
Taliban and Kahmiri Insurgent train kiye gaye hai Pakistan dawara. Western SF ke pass uss time bhi bullet proof jacket and helemt the. Apne soldiers ke pass nahi the. Ye wala factor maine include nahi kiya kyuki this is our own inability that we aren't able to provide them with gears.

Please apne counters rakhe jisse thread zaada productive bane.
Meri analysis me jo khaami hai please bataao kyuki unlike you, I am not an expert.
Thank you for reading.

Data taken for tthe western soldiers and SF from:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Enduring_Freedom

United States military casualties in the War in Afghanistan - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

.

For Indian:

Insurgency in Jammu and Kashmir - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

You're looking at statistical outcomes without any contextualisation of the factors in play or the operational conditions.

 

[vidhwanshak]

You're looking at statistical outcomes without a y cont

You're looking at statistical outcomes without any contextualisation of the factors in play or the operational conditions.

For any sort of comparison , we need a basis.
I have taken these stats and the fact that both Kashmiri militants and Talibani were trained by Pakistan as a basis for comparison.
And, please elaborate on "contextualization". Kashmir insurgency involved urban, mountain, and jungle warfare.
The American invasion of Afghanistan is mountain warfare.
And according to me both of these ops fall under the unconventional warfare category.

 

[SGOperative]

You're looking at statistical outcomes without a y cont

You're looking at statistical outcomes without any contextualisation of the factors in play or the operational conditions.

That applies to every comparison made on this thread, comparisons dont make sense except gears imo.

 

[vidhwanshak]

That applies to every comparison made on this thread, comparisons dont make sense except gears imo.

I wholeheartedly agree with you but my comparison makes sense

 

[Fire and groove]

That applies to every comparison made on this thread, comparisons dont make sense except gears imo.

You're right, the point is ever more applicable in that sense. You can't compare apples to oranges just because they're fruits.

 

[EternalNxg]

Yep but according to exfarts aren't they less competent than Para SF , since they get casualties while CI/CT operations , ONE genius said it's a shame in special forces when one is hit on the chest during operations. Also Garuds should operate behind army units.

Yea I remember someone called elitepredators shaming them...... Imagine getting wounded by gunfire but you still manage to kill a jehadi pig only for some armchair exfart called elitepredators to shame you........

 

[FalconSlayers]

For any sort of comparison , we need a basis.
I have taken these stats and the fact that both Kashmiri militants and Talibani were trained by Pakistan as a basis for comparison.
And, please elaborate on "contextualization". Kashmir insurgency involved urban, mountain, and jungle warfare.
The American invasion of Afghanistan is mountain warfare.
And according to me both of these ops fall under the unconventional warfare category.

We never used tanks, gunships, drones, fighter planes in Kashmir, only platoon level weapons on top of that.

 

[SGOperative]

 

[vidhwanshak]

We never used tanks, gunships, drones, fighter planes in Kashmir, only platoon level weapons on top of that.

Exactly.

And it is very annoying when some forum members glorify Western SF and downplay Indian SF. Those men in maroon berets literally changed the whole situation by hunting those terrorists, doing covert operations even beyond the LOC.

Some forum members are so fickle-minded that they want validation from western sf operatives that whether PARA SF has the same level as theirs or not. And if those foreign operatives say that western sf is better, our forum members become the echo chambers of their thoughts. But, they can't even grasp simple wiki stats which show the effectiveness of tactics and training of Indian security forces.
PARA SF and RR don't need your or mine validation. Their work speaks for them.

 

[Fire and groove]

For any sort of comparison , we need a basis.
I have taken these stats and the fact that both Kashmiri militants and Talibani were trained by Pakistan as a basis for comparison.
And, please elaborate on "contextualization". Kashmir insurgency involved urban, mountain, and jungle warfare.
The American invasion of Afghanistan is mountain warfare.
And according to me both of these ops fall under the unconventional warfare category.

The factors include the political dynamics, social structures in respective AOs, military deployment size-structure-tactics-ROE, strategic goals and the nature of the campaign. It is sheer fallacy to compare a country sized deployment with vastly differing operational problems to that faced in valley.