Indian Special Forces

armyofhind

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Since we are discussing hypothetical scenarios about the rescue of 300 Indians kept hostage in Myanmar -

Does it make sense to constitute a mission-specific team of NSG operators, present and erstwhile; who have backgrounds in 21 Para SF?
 

abingdonboy

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Since we are discussing hypothetical scenarios about the rescue of 300 Indians kept hostage in Myanmar -

Does it make sense to constitute a mission-specific team of NSG operators, present and erstwhile; who have backgrounds in 21 Para SF?
Given the issues that would arise in coordinating between MHA and MoD (in fact MHA would probably struggle to be agile enough for these sorts of things abroad) it makes more sense to have a SMU carved out inside MoD drawing from the SF battalions (preferably made up of a core of guys who have served in NSG) that can conduct CT/HR/special missions abroad. Basically a Delta type unit

again, this is a highly hypothetical scenario in an alternate reality where logic feeds into reality inside Indian strategic thinkers.

in this alternate reality such a unit would be backed by a JSOC type structure which had semi-conventional forces to support them (like how Rangers work for SOCOM), in the Indian context this could be a specially raised Ghatak battalion or by converting one of the Li regiments into a commando type force.

Basically, as it stands india isn’t really well suited to launching these kinds of ops to protect its own interests away from its territory and any such mission would be highly ad-hoc And thus prone to failures/risks
 

ALBY

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it depends on the nature of the hostage situation. If it’s a legitimate hostage rescue op then no one outside of NSG has the expertise in india to conduct a complex HR op. It would probably be worth sending a platoon of SF with them to act as a fire support/blocking force

FYI missions like this is pretty much the exact reason JSOC exists. India has no SOP for such things and NSG’s mandate is almost entirely domestic. I don’t know if they are designed to operate in non-permissive environments (I know apparently they were on the ground in Kabul during the IC814 hijack to takedown the plane but apparently there was also SG around to act as a blocking force)
Fully agree..if its a true hostage situation then Nsg is the only way forward
 

ALBY

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@abingdonboy you are critical of our SF of not employing gucci gear in many scenarios.I too agree with that in many aspects.But from personal experience,in scenarios especially in NE where there is steep slopes and visibility is barely under 30 metres , rag tag militia looks are best as many things like red dots dont offer much help also the weapons with rails are difficult to hold compared with wooden furniture ones if they don’t have any grips.Even grips are not much of good use.Also the slings are more of nuisance and disturbance than of actual use in such jungle environments .Helmets too adds up weight so are heavy bpjs.In such environments minimal equipments are better suited than highly suited up SF gear.
PS:I am not saying about Kashmir or any other plain topography but dense jungle topogry where every ounce of weight matters
 

abingdonboy

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@abingdonboy you are critical of our SF of not employing gucci gear in many scenarios.I too agree with that in many aspects.But from personal experience,in scenarios especially in NE where there is steep slopes and visibility is barely under 30 metres , rag tag militia looks are best as many things like red dots dont offer much help also the weapons with rails are difficult to hold compared with wooden furniture ones if they don’t have any grips.Even grips are not much of good use.Also the slings are more of nuisance and disturbance than of actual use in such jungle environments .Helmets too adds up weight so are heavy bpjs.In such environments minimal equipments are better suited than highly suited up SF gear.
PS:I am not saying about Kashmir or any other plain topography but dense jungle topogry where every ounce of weight matters
Everything you’ve listed has been addressed in the last 20 years of PPE and weapons development Im afraid, largely thanks to GWOT

-P-rails have been out of vogue for at least a decade by the cutting edge units (MLOK was developed because it’s lighter and doesn’t present the same grip issues as P-rails)
- lightweight high cut helmets and shooter cut plate carriers are designed to be extremely ergonomic, that said jungles is only one environment, the same rag tag look is applied universally by PARA SF

I do agree that given what they have to hand (mostly early 00s era junk) they don’t have many options but to cut corners
 

Fire and groove

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Nice, go praise the cowardly attacks that Pakistan did on isolated posts as “bravery”. Ambush my ass.

Pakistan resorts to cheap ass tactics like attacking when there is an active ceasefire, as they lack conventional ability.
So do we mate, there's no such thing as honour on the battlefield. If you're an enemy combatant, everything goes as long as it furthers efficiency and effectiveness. The ball only stops rolling when the enemy surrenders and becomes a true non-combatant (macro or micro), at which point they should be cleared for sensitive info, secured and handed off to military police. "Honour" in a realm that involves killing people is just masked sadism, and the very concept makes me sick.
 

Kumaoni

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So do we mate, there's no such thing as honour on the battlefield. If you're an enemy combatant, everything goes as long as it furthers efficiency and effectiveness. The ball only stops rolling when the enemy surrenders and becomes a true non-combatant (macro or micro), at which point they should be cleared for sensitive info, secured and handed off to military police. "Honour" in a realm that involves killing people is just masked sadism, and the very concept makes me sick.
Attacking in a ceasefire is fair game?
 

Kumaoni

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He's not talking about the tactics, but the poor diplomacy of the Rajputs. They let their enemies live and eventually got destroyed by the same enemies. All in the name of honour
Any example of this?
 

Kumaoni

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About 300 Indian are supposedly being held Hostage in Myanmar. Supposedly by Chinese Criminal Org / Myanmar Mil.

This is the place where our SOF capacity should be used to force project and protect our interest in our neighborhood. Can we ?
If the higher ups decide to give the army that the hands.
 

Killbot

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Any example of this?
1st battle of Tarain is a prime one.

This isn't exactly diplomacy. But after Mahmud of Ghazni's forces were routed, the Rajputs packed up and went home, not bothering to pursue Mahmud himself. A year later, Mahmud came back and India fell into Muslim rule for the next 7 centuries. But there are many such instances.

Off topic..
 

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