Indian Special Forces

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Vishalreddy3

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@ALBY

I can post some cool videos like these and more content if you can open and maintain THE SF THREAD(international)

Where members like @rkhanna @abingdonboy @Killbot @Gessler @ManhattanProject etc can also contribute

sorry if i missed out some names.

We could discuss international equipment and ops there.
Hence the reason I created this!!
 

Unknowncommando 2

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I have seen recent pics where para sf were wearing exfil helmets , I think they are slowly replacing their viper p2 helmets.
Correct me if I am wrong.
They started receiving Viper P2s in 17-18 & were spotted actually using them in this years Nagrota Encounter. So not replacing those for sure.

Now they have multiple helmets in their inventory.
TATA ACH, MKU PASGT, MKU ACH of 3 Types (1)Same as Infantry, (2)With Integrated Communication (3)One like CAPFs, Orlite OR-201, PATKA, VIPER P2, Highcut (Without Rails/NVG Mount), EXFIL High Cut & Highcut Bump.
 

Trololo

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View attachment 63153View attachment 63154View attachment 63155View attachment 63156
Look guys, the way I see it, the Para SF guys are fairly well equipped. Definitely not as well equipped as the Western SOF but dollar for rupee, it's an obvious, unfair comparison. Right now, with all the different weapons platforms and gear pouring in as batches, there's a certain amount of in consistency but the Para SF operator of the near future will be homogeneously armed with the following gear and weaponry, (already in use by them, not uniformly)
High Ballistic Helmets with in ear Comms headsets connected to a radioset
Ergonomic plate carriers with molle system of attachment
All kinds of varied camo with knee and ankle pads
Thermal or single tube night vision headsets
Tavor/M4/decked out AK

And still we haven't taken into consideration the latest incoming procurements of SCARS and Mk 48 LMGs.

Sure, people are shouting about BNVDs and Integrated Ear Pro but hear me out. Even the US Army Special Forces/ Rangers haven't completely moved over to double tube. They use a mix of double tube and single tube NVGs and you simply can't compare Tier 1 guys of the US with Para SF guys cause Para SF is not a Tier 1 establishment in India. It's more geared towards a Tier 2 structure. And about integrated ear pro, that would be the only thing not in use but with the way the modernisation is working, I'm not sure it won't.
Also, you simply can't say that what the guys are seen using in Kashmir is the full kit. Kashmir is an AO where you respond in a moment's notice. And it being a domestic AO, there's a certain amount of lax in the operators. For precision operations, I'm a 100% sure, they don't just put on the bare minimum. Because then they have the time to gear up, head to toe.
I believe Para-SF can be as well equipped as western SOFs and at a lower cost provided the bulk of the kit is domestically procured. Which is quite possible, given the recent entry of private players in the defence sector. I am hopeful of seeing this change in 5 years time. I hope they will also be able to field an Indian brand's indigenous weapon as the standard issue rifle and pistol.

I don't know what is our Tier-1 force. Can someone elaborate? Is it SG or Marcos?

Also using Para-SF and I daresay army in Kashmir for anti terrorist ops within own borders is not a good idea. CRPF and JKP should have better levels of training and equipment for such tasks. Para-SF should be absolutely last resort here.

Do note that a section of the CRPF can be trained to form a second line army. Its all about the intent.
 

Killbot

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The way they are holding their guns shows that they have been trained by someone, I mean look at their trigger discipline.
Nah, they are just keeping their fingers away from trigger, like they have seen in western SF photos. Take a look at their stances for a moment. A few are kneeling in both legsl, few is kneeling on both. But what is taught in the military is to kneel on one leg, and sit back on the heel of the same. Makes it easier to transition to prone position or sitting position. These guys aren't doing that.
I doubt that they are well trained. But training has never been their strength.


Op trent.
small paragraph from it:
A member of the SAS who participated in the raid said of the terrorists that "these guys were lunatics" and that "surrender was the last thing on their minds. They would run out of the front line firing. It was something out of the First World War, these were not people, proper soldiers, who could be treated with dignity. If they had a breath left in them they would be trying to shoot you so we had no choice but to kill."[7
 

Killbot

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I believe Para-SF can be as well equipped as western SOFs and at a lower cost provided the bulk of the kit is domestically procured. Which is quite possible, given the recent entry of private players in the defence sector. I am hopeful of seeing this change in 5 years time. I hope they will also be able to field an Indian brand's indigenous weapon as the standard issue rifle and pistol.

I don't know what is our Tier-1 force. Can someone elaborate? Is it SG or Marcos?

Also using Para-SF and I daresay army in Kashmir for anti terrorist ops within own borders is not a good idea. CRPF and JKP should have better levels of training and equipment for such tasks. Para-SF should be absolutely last resort here.

Do note that a section of the CRPF can be trained to form a second line army. Its all about the intent.
We don't have a 'Tier-1' SOF unit. No one except Uncle Sam does. No other country has the money to maintain a tier one SOF.

MARCOS, while reasonably equipped for an Indian unit, do not have nearly operations under their belt for us to tell how good they are. They only do CASOs with RR, so I guess they aren't trusted to do ops along LoC.

SG is an intelligence unit. Cannot be compared to the rest. And we know too little about them.

Para SF being misused has been what the last few pages are all about. Please go through them.

And no, gear made in India will not cost that much less than anywhere else, without compromising on quality. There is no such a thing as cheap and effective; its either cheap or effective. And, make no mistake, Para SF gear right now is absolute shit.
 

FalconSlayers

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Nah, they are just keeping their fingers away from trigger, like they have seen in western SF photos. Take a look at their stances for a moment. A few are kneeling in both legsl, few is kneeling on both. But what is taught in the military is to kneel on one leg, and sit back on the heel of the same. Makes it easier to transition to prone position or sitting position. These guys aren't doing that.
I doubt that they are well trained. But training has never been their strength.


Op trent.
small paragraph from it:
A member of the SAS who participated in the raid said of the terrorists that "these guys were lunatics" and that "surrender was the last thing on their minds. They would run out of the front line firing. It was something out of the First World War, these were not people, proper soldiers, who could be treated with dignity. If they had a breath left in them they would be trying to shoot you so we had no choice but to kill."[7
How do they get so much modern equipment from and that too American?
 

rkhanna

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Op trent.
small paragraph from it:
A member of the SAS who participated in the raid said of the terrorists that "these guys were lunatics" and that "surrender was the last thing on their minds. They would run out of the front line firing. It was something out of the First World War, these were not people, proper soldiers, who could be treated with dignity. If they had a breath left in them they would be trying to shoot you so we had no choice but to kill."[7
The most stark thing. They didn't suffer any casualties. And it was a long sustained firefight
 

shade

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How do they get so much modern equipment from and that too American?
The proper Afghan army is made of unmotivated druggies and generally low energy people who only want to collect paycheck, similar to the modern Iraqi Army.
The chad generic jihadi just walks over, and these people run away, or they kill them and loot all their US sponsored/provided gear.
ISIS apparently got a lot of maal from northern Iraq this way some ~5 years ago when ISIS was at peak.

Say what you will about the Talibs but they are actually motivated for the job, if these US puppet state armies were adequeate you wouldn't have US bases in those countries with a few thousand US troops all around.
 

armyofhind

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We don't have a 'Tier-1' SOF unit. No one except Uncle Sam does. No other country has the money to maintain a tier one SOF.

MARCOS, while reasonably equipped for an Indian unit, do not have nearly operations under their belt for us to tell how good they are. They only do CASOs with RR, so I guess they aren't trusted to do ops along LoC.

SG is an intelligence unit. Cannot be compared to the rest. And we know too little about them.


Para SF being misused has been what the last few pages are all about. Please go through them.

And no, gear made in India will not cost that much less than anywhere else, without compromising on quality. There is no such a thing as cheap and effective; its either cheap or effective. And, make no mistake, Para SF gear right now is absolute shit.
That's incorrect. MARCOS has a lot of operations under their belt, including those carried out in Sri Lanka, Arakan Mountains and Nepal, but most of these ops are classified. I know of a few through some personal interactions, but cannot talk much on the details.

Same goes for the SG as well, they are the closest equivalent we have to a Tier-1 unit, (Not comparable in terms of Tech to US Tier-1 of course). Lot of Ops, including some in Afghanistan before the advent of the Afghan Civil War.

But these things are kept fairly low key, as they should be. But just because We dont make movies about them, does not mean it hasnt been done.

A good resource to get some idea about SG Ops is a book - "RAW - A History of India's Covert Operations" by Yatish Yadav. You'll find some details there, nothing outright though.
 

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