Indian Special Forces (archived)

[rkhanna]

Strange you quote OPSEC? all ops are gen known in more or fewer details after those have been executed... Even the brigade plus which occupied Chusul sector had OPSEC... But some vague details are known now... Ask ADGPI as to why..!!

I thought you would grant everyone in the forum some basic sense no to ask about OPSEC things..

Knowing place and deployment of a SOF units deployment is basic hygiene and if that basic info is not covered by OPSEC we have no clue of what an SOF unit is supposed to be.

Also, hope you realise Details being release post facto is different from people knowing and then disclosing deployment of units in the current 'live' senario

 

[Waanar]

Yes they are tough on camera , till they go up against the Israelis, then they run like their Goats got raped. Sorry but Hamas would get raped on the battlefield.

Oh, now, this is right up my alley.
I've read a few books on Hezbollah's recent operations and capabilities. These guys are no joke.
I can't judge Haqqani network beyond what I've heard about them but Hezbollah's performance during the Israel Lebanon war and now, having smuggled literally hundreds of thousands of rockets into Lebanon under Israeli nose, that too with a godfather racked with US sanctions (Iran) while sustaining operations against FSA, HTS and other Jihadi groups in Syria, stopping ISIS from entering beyond Lebanon's town of Arsal even as the military faltered etc are just some excellent feats of organizational efficiency.

On a strategic scale, Hezbollah has accomplished nearly everything it set out to do.
Freed Lebanon, stopped ISIS from entering Lebanon, freed Lebanon, ended SLA control over South Lebanon.

Now, freeing Palestine is a whole different ballgame and I've a feeling they're not even considering that beyond mere rhetoric.
Let's hope our bureaucrats see the sense in preparing such a group to function as an extension of the state's reach across the borders (and HR laws ).

 

[Waanar]

You missed Naxals from that list though nowdays they are nowhere near their prime days.Still they have the tactical capabilities to give sleepless nights to central forces.Unlike the Hesbolla or Haqqanis thry achieved this without any direct support.

The Naxals take inspiration from Che and Fidel's method of warfare focused on generosity of the people rather than a strong state backing.
Fidel overthrowing Batista is their image of a perfect operation.
They're "revolutionaries" rather than "militants" in their head.
The difference between Batista's Cuba and Modi's India is very vast.
Ours is not a puppet leader, intent on making India a drug tourism capital and a whorehouse, which is what lent to Cuba's population and even the Military being sympathetic to Fidel's cause.

Now, this approach has it's own share of sh*t like Che getting informed upon by the Bolivians and getting executed, so as soon as hearts and minds leave, all you're left with is guns n glory.

And we have too many men who find that exciting.

The Naxal "hearts and minds" policy might've worked when there was no development and politics inevitably ended up ruining civilian lives but now, it's limited and viable only among the impressionable, virgin minds of the adivasis, distant from modern society.
That too, would've come crashing down, had Salwa Judum continued.

We don't have good case studies of Naxal operations, do we?
Any good books you guys can recommend to understand how they performed their operations on a tactical level?

 

[rkhanna]

I can't judge Haqqani network beyond what I've heard about them

Read the book Outlaw Platoon by John Bruning and Sean Parnell

Details the mission of a platoon of 10th Mountain Div in South Afghanistan. Great details and opinions from various US Mil combat leaders , SF, intel on the Haqqani network

 

[Indopacific Arya]

Oh, now, this is right up my alley.
I've read a few books on Hezbollah's recent operations and capabilities. These guys are no joke.
I can't judge Haqqani network beyond what I've heard about them but Hezbollah's performance during the Israel Lebanon war and now, having smuggled literally hundreds of thousands of rockets into Lebanon under Israeli nose, that too with a godfather racked with US sanctions (Iran) while sustaining operations against FSA, HTS and other Jihadi groups in Syria, stopping ISIS from entering beyond Lebanon's town of Arsal even as the military faltered etc are just some excellent feats of organizational efficiency.

On a strategic scale, Hezbollah has accomplished nearly everything it set out to do.
Freed Lebanon, stopped ISIS from entering Lebanon, freed Lebanon, ended SLA control over South Lebanon.

Now, freeing Palestine is a whole different ballgame and I've a feeling they're not even considering that beyond mere rhetoric.
Let's hope our bureaucrats see the sense in preparing such a group to function as an extension of the state's reach across the borders (and HR laws ).

A recruit soldier when go through numerous training, he changed not only physically but also improved his mental stability through many folds...But for BABUs, they did not go through that type of process, so lacking of this, their risk taking capability is just limited...And more worriedly,without any knowledge,they pretend to be an expert as situation demand. They could be a good organizer but not a good strategist..People often did mistake that only Ministers holds the power but practically Only BABU's controlling whole India...
So in short, we cant imagine Hezbollah like organisation as Babu's are shortsighted....

 

[Waanar]

So in short, we cant imagine Hezbollah like organisation as Babu's are shortsighted....

Agree on some points, disagree on others.
We've had Pir Panjal scouts, Ikhwans, Salwa Judum etc used to enforce internal state stability.

You can also think of SFF's mandate as being similar to Hezbollah but yes, a lot of stuff needs to be rectified to allow a smoother transition into this era of "indirect warfare", if you will.

Our Military string pullers seem to be caught up with the idea of a World War 3 (which is not an impossibility) but even then, the idea of such an entrenched group getting steamrolled without putting up a heavy fight is just far fetched.

These groups encompass military, civilians and police and have the capability to open a whole new dimension of warfare. Basically, make the triservice a "Quadservice".

Can you imagine not having an Air Force or Navy?

Well, in our neighborhood, it's much like that to not have a group which is off the books but backed by state.

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

You missed Naxals from that list though nowdays they are nowhere near their prime days.Still they have the tactical capabilities to give sleepless nights to central forces.Unlike the Hesbolla or Haqqanis thry achieved this without any direct support.

Because Central forces are poorly trained and carry low morale thatswhy.

Naxals are nothing.

Naxals attack with 400 armed people against 80 Jawans.If the attack is going well they continue or else they run away in the jungle.

In the jungle the only thing they are very good at is making IEDs.

Poorly equipped,physically not very strong,no tactics just attacking in numbers is what naxals are.

Look at Cobra...they are successful against Naxals and if you ask me i would put cobra just a little below than Ghataks.

Hammas and all are different level bro.Even the Kashmiri terroists now are nothing as compared to the Afghanis and Other nationalities that used to come.

Those people came for a fight..not to run.

I know of a incident(dont know true or not) where 4 afghani terroists stopped a Army convoi for days.(ambush(

 

[rkhanna]

A recruit soldier when go through numerous training, he changed not only physically but also improved his mental stability through many folds...But for BABUs, they did not go through that type of process, so lacking of this, their risk taking capability is just limited...And more worriedly,without any knowledge,they pretend to be an expert as situation demand. They could be a good organizer but not a good strategist..People often did mistake that only Ministers holds the power but practically Only BABU's controlling whole India...
So in short, we cant imagine Hezbollah like organisation as Babu's are shortsighted....

Just one point. Good number of Offsars also become 'babus' after a certain rank.

Ps - I am not a big fan of a 'hez' like organization - they always always bite the hand that feeds it. History is littered by a 100 examples. Nobody has ever been able to fully control an insurgent force. - just look at AQ / FARC / LTTE as a few off the the top. JUST look at the state of affairs in Pak.


An insurgent capability like this is about power projection. How long before something like that is used by someone in power within india/'s own borders ? Corruption and thirst for power in a poor country make the risk way to high and not worth it in the long run - the ikwaans also didn't work out as thr system got way too abusive and corrupt.

imo it's better to have a SOF with deep FID capability to work with locals elsewhere with a arms lenght relationship.

 

[rkhanna]

Hammas and all are different level bro.Even the Kashmiri terroists now are nothing as compared to the Afghanis and Other nationalities that used to come.

As you would well know. The breed of fighters that flooded the valley in the 90s were completely different from the children running around with guns and insta pages today.

When the Americans leave astan be prepared for another such "surge"

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

As you would well know. The breed of fighters that flooded the valley in the 90s were completely different from the children running around with guns and insta pages today.

When the Americans leave astan be prepared for another such "surge"

Oh ya the qomb will have another war to shed blood in..thats the mindset.

 

[Vishal reddy]

Marcos recruits receiving training in Andaman and Nicobar islands.
Sry if the picture is posted earlier!

 

[Edyk12]

 

[rkhanna]

Interestingly the 2 operators wjth m4 are sporting supressors. These are the long Barrell m4s while the shorter tavors don't sport any.

We don't have supressors for the tavors?

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

Interestingly the 2 operators wjth m4 are sporting supressors. These are the long Barrell m4s while the shorter tavors don't sport any.

We don't have supressors for the tavors?

Looks like 21.

Their game is good ..very impressed with their drills.

 

[rkhanna]

Looks like 21.

Their game is good ..very impressed with their drills.

Yea all thanks to a certain Col. Who later got fucked over by the army.

 

[abingdonboy]

Interestingly the 2 operators wjth m4 are sporting supressors. These are the long Barrell m4s while the shorter tavors don't sport any.

We don't have supressors for the tavors?

Have seen M4s, Uzis and MP9s with suppressors quite a bit in Indian use especially SFs, maybe seen a Tavor with one once. Another procurement fubar for sure.

 

[Unknowncommando 2]

Interestingly the 2 operators wjth m4 are sporting supressors. These are the long Barrell m4s while the shorter tavors don't sport any.

We don't have supressors for the tavors?

We do

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

Yea all thanks to a certain Col. Who later got fucked over by the army.

Best officers or Award winners rarely get the staff car bro.

 

[rkhanna]

Have seen M4s, Uzis and MP9s with suppressors quite a bit in Indian use especially SFs, maybe seen a Tavor with one once. Another procurement fubar for sure.

Iike in unknowns picture have seen the same as what you mentioned and tavors. However never more than 2 per squad / unit. I.e these would be given to the point men in a patrol + for sentry killing.

They can easily be rolled out unit wide for a 100 reasons. + The Tavors have the Barrel lenght to accomodate them and not become a sore stick. We need AR15 platforms with 11inch barrels . Suppressors on full lenght m4 can really unbalance thr gun and become a bitch in CQB

 

[Ghost68]

Wha

Yea all thanks to a certain Col. Who later got fucked over by the army.

What Col.? What is the story?