Indian Navy Developments & Discussions

[Shashwat]

Are kya ho raha he yaha?
Bhadra vs Shashwat why?

He is the one who started it. Calling me trade union rep - #4921 - I merely stated that its nonsensical to create duplicate assets when you have a stable platform it creates logistic nightmare. No country in the world creates alternate imported platform when it own similar asset.

The follow the sequence of post and you will understand..
It is no Vs. It is just outright abusing determination of this street urchin who is venting his frustation on why MoD issued an RFI and why there are respondent.

Their mental makeup is a Naxalite type abuses. Do nothing, thrive on public money and prove your work by assembling machine that are killers of own soldiers.

As if rather than being an industry they own MoD.

Dude you are hopeless. You have not backed even one stupid fact, yet you have the gall to justify the travesty that you are. Please don't show your upbringing by calling people Naxals, we may have difference of opinion but it doesn't warrant such absurd statement, stick to diarrhoea and street urchin thats more fitting to your personality.

You have said nothing but absurd statement from get go- Dhruv is costlier than gold its a lab rat and what not and when challenged with facts you started abusing.

Oh and that CAG report is from 2010, those PIB numbers are from 2017. Localisation in not instantaneous like diarrhoea coming out from your mouth, it takes times to prepare industry and content.

Edit - Calling it now! No more OT.

 

[Bhadra]

The main problem is lack of indigenous engines. India has already started HTSE1200 project for this in FY16. This will need 5-6 years and by FY22, this will be ready. So, the ALH ordered now will eventually have indigenised engines and hence indigenisation of 90% or more.

Buying foreign items is never a meaningful option when India has already started the project to get the helicopters indigenised fully and the project is in its last stages of completion

We all dream of such a situation and very much love to have our own. We waited till cows came home.

But the govts of india who is the owner of PSUs and OFB from time to time have laid down procedures for procurement under laid down financial and procurement regulations.

Under the laid down procedure if MoD has issued an RFI, why should an urchin like @Shashwat start writing filth against air marshals, admirals and generals and further against the uniformed community as a whole. Those guys have nothing to do with procurement procedure. If he has a little moral courage and self esteem he must immediately change his avatar as those machine are flown by men of honour and not a gutter worm like him.

Why should this @Shashwat announce that he was actually had by some uniformed fellow so badly that he needs to ire his vent . Had he been in front of me .... I would have also had him...by the wall.

 

[Bhadra]

He is the one who started it. Calling me trade union rep - #4921 - I merely stated that its nonsensical to create duplicate assets when you have a stable platform it creates logistic nightmare. No country in the world creates alternate imported platform when it own similar asset.



Dude you are hopeless. You have not backed even one stupid fact, yet you have the gall to justify the travesty that you are. Please don't show your upbringing by calling people Naxals, we may have difference of opinion but it doesn't warrant such absurd statement, stick to diarrhoea and street urchin thats more fitting to your personality.

You have said nothing but absurd statement from get go- Dhruv is costlier than gold its a lab rat and what not and when challenged with facts you started abusing.

Oh and that CAG report is from 2010, those PIB numbers are from 2017. Localisation in not instantaneous like diarrhoea coming out from your mouth, it takes times to prepare industry and content.

Edit - Calling it now! No more OT.

you so and so..
In last ten posts of yours, have you written any thing about the three vendors who have offered thie bids ?

Where did Dhruv came In ? You brought it with your motherly inherited abuses just for nothing and then you thought you are safe behind anonymity of internet.

No. I have seen thousand of miserable cowards like you. who are Shaswat on internet only but nowhere in life !!

 

[WolfPack86]

Airbus has two platforms – the H 145M and the Panther AS565 – on offer in partnership with Mahindra Defence. The American side has offered the Sikorsky S 76D while Russia has offered the Kamov Ka 226T.

 

[Bhadra]

Airbus has two platforms – the H 145M and the Panther AS565 – on offer in partnership with Mahindra Defence. The American side has offered the Sikorsky S 76D while Russia has offered the Kamov Ka 226T.

I committed gravest sin of producing The RFI and youtube videos of the machines of the three vendors without knowing that entire uniform community will be called names for two days by a seemingly SSB reject or at best a diploma type lathe assistant. or a file pushing Babu.

I stand terrorised .....

 

[Shashwat]

We all dream of such a situation and very much love to have our own. We waited till cows came home.

But the govts of india who is the owner of PSUs and OFB from time to time have laid down procedures for procurement under laid down financial and procurement regulations.

Under the laid down procedure if MoD has issued an RFI, why should an urchin like @Shashwat start writing filth against air marshals, admirals and generals and further against the uniformed community as a whole. Those guys have nothing to do with procurement procedure. If he has a little moral courage and self esteem he must immediately change his avatar as those machine are flown by men of honour and not a gutter worm like him.

I never any such things or blamed someone out of bounds. Is it your habit to put your words into someone else mouth? I merely stated a fact that Air Chief was convicted of a crime by Apex court and out on bail. So are other very well known cases where people have either being disbanded or reprimanded for their doing by the armed forces themselves, if you have so much issue with the state of the country find some place else.

With such hate for each institution and person how do you survive?

Ohh and why my Tejas avatar irks you? By your logic tejas is even more junk than ALH. You should be happy that urchins like us use shityy avatar and not some pristine imported fighter.

Why should this @Shashwat announce that he was actually had by some uniformed fellow so badly that he needs to ire his vent . Had he been in front of me .... I would have also had him...by the wall.

Not only you have low IQ you are brute too. What an irony, you called me Naxal but your showing a trait of one. Get physical if you can't stand a debate. Classic Communist. Bravo! Sir, bravo! Claps.

you so and so..
In last ten posts of yours, have you written any thing about the three vendors who have offered thie bids ?

Where did Dhruv came In ? You brought it with your motherly inherited abuses just for nothing and then you thought you are safe behind anonymity of internet.

No. I have seen thousand of miserable cowards like you. who are Shaswat on internet only but nowhere in life !!

Please don't bring my mother into it. I questioned your upbringing not your parents. I hope brutes like you can understand the difference. Or is it normal for your kind to bring parents into the fray?

What you gonna do shoot me? So if you can't stand a debate you'll show your real face? There are thousands of pricks like you from high institution who think they are almighty. Recently an army man got arrested for slapping a person and the latter died. Why you ask? Because simpleton motorcycle touched his almighty car and despite simpleton saying sorry and pleading guilty that runt army person slapped him hard which led to his demise. Glad he is rotting in prison. People who dont obey law of the land or can act humane are shitholes irrespective of the position they hold.

Chill sir. I know you are an army guy and can't take an argument. What I simply don't understand is what benefit you get by dishing out an indian good? Arguing over capability is fine but to go ahead and completely junk Dhruv over foreign maal isn't very nice, ohh and what about the old CAG data? 30% local maal? All got evaporated after facts were put in place?

Chill sir. I am as anonymous as you are. The power of internet gives us a platform for debate else dictators like you had us killed. Think what you are implying - Armed forces job is to uphold peace not threaten people for argument. Ohh and no one is sacrosanct! Om Shanti.

 

[Shashwat]

Just one last and final point, One Air chief got convicted for little money on the other hand Retd Navy Chief DK Joshi let go of his post owning to Moral responsibility to submarine accident. Two people from similar services but with polar opposite principles. Hats off to people like DK Joshi that are shining examples of grace and prudence but for anyone to expect me to sing praise for a convict won't happen.

 

[Sanglamorre]

We should have a betting pool on how fast a thread in DFI devolves into Bhadrabowl and the number of times the words OFB/DRDO and foreign maal are used.

 

[IndianHawk]

Besides engines, Imported Content :

Upper Control System (UCS)
Main Gear Box (MGB) ZF’s BK-117 MGB
Design consultancy ( who left without finalising any good design)
ARIS Vibration Dampers.
No Facilities for Large Scale Powered Model Testing
No development of Local Vendor facilities making parts.
All weapons except Helina required to be integrated imported (even a 20mm canon)

A multipage scathing report of CAG on ALH ( CAG is not an air marshall .....)

/Union_Performance_Commerhttps://cag.gov.in/sites/default/files/audit_report_filesical_Activities_Public_Sector_Undertakings_10_2010_chapter_3.pdf

All these things will be indegeniosed in due course. We started with 0 Indian content and now we are at 70-75% . If you'll need defense news regularly you will find we are steadily replacing foreign system across platforms.

Only few days ago I found out that Astra had indegenios seeker since 2017. We are getting there , entering into domain of complex delicate engineering systems . It will take few more years but we'll do it nonetheless.

Look at mwf fighter. It will have desi radar and desi missiles Astra mk1 ,mk2 and sfdr , ngram and bramhos NG. Along with Indian ew suite and irst . It's indegenios content will be over 90%.

Same goes for AMCA.


Sent from my C103 using Tapatalk

 

[binayak95]

Just one last and final point, One Air chief got convicted for little money on the other hand Retd Navy Chief DK Joshi let go of his post owning to Moral responsibility to submarine accident. Two people from similar services but with polar opposite principles. Hats off to people like DK Joshi that are shining examples of grace and prudence but for anyone to expect me to sing praise for a convict won't happen.

Moral responsibility my ass - he did it in protest, as a slap to that chutiya AK Antony who refused to sign simple deals for FUCKING EXIDE batteries because he wanted to keep his dhoti spotless.

Assholes like Antony, the babudom in MoD and the useless workers in OFB munitions are the reason behind the deaths of hundreds of soldiers.

They should be lined up and shot.

 

[Suryavanshi]

I don't think anyone here is shilling for OFB or HAL.
@Bhadra u have most likely got it wrong.

I think most of the folks here want indignisation of key weapons like howitzer,ships,airplanes,trucks etc etc.

Of course we can get hands on premium products we sure will buy it.
Like for example Anti sumbarine P8 and Chiook we know we don't have the infrastructure to make these types of wepaon and won't have it for a long time so we simply buy it.
We need indigenous product either throug private public or government.

 

[Bhadra]

I don't think anyone here is shilling for OFB or HAL.
@Bhadra u have most likely got it wrong.

I think most of the folks here want indignisation of key weapons like howitzer,ships,airplanes,trucks etc etc.

Of course we can get hands on premium products we sure will buy it.
Like for example Anti sumbarine P8 and Chiook we know we don't have the infrastructure to make these types of wepaon and won't have it for a long time so we simply buy it.
We need indigenous product either throug private public or government.

I too am not selling any thing. But giving an abusive lecture of a system like Dhruv which is under development for last 10 years since 2009 when Navy wanted to buy 197 Naval Utility Helicopters in 2009 itself.
HAL jumped in and claimed they are capable of making it and scuttled procurement proposals.
The first LUH prototype (ZG4620) conduct its maiden flight outside HAL's manufacturing facility at Bangaluru on 6 September 2016. Till now HAL has made three prototypes.

Trial of LUH have been carried out by IN who accepted the usefulness of LUH for Indian Coast Guard but not for IN.
Now the RFI issued by MoD has been responded to but HAL has not responded to RFI knowing that it their mal does not meet requirement and they can have a backdoor entry as always.

Most of the fundamental requirements of IN are not met by HAL LUH.

HAL LUH is a single engine craft - Navy has asked for twin Engine.
Naval LUH has ship / deck landing problems - IN wants deck landing by day and night.
All up weight is less (carrying capacity is below required)
Operating Range is 350 km with 450 kg weight which is restrictive for many uses like anti piracy, coastal operations, MARCOS operation and anti submarine operations.
Folding main rotors now incorporated are untested and unproven.
More Time on Task - In requires that Helicopters must have capability to spend 2 hours 20 minutes on task with full load - with additional 20 minutes as reserve. Dhruv is simply incapable of it.
The platform is not equipped with any tarpedos which nullifies their utility for prime Naval operations.

That is why they have not responded to IN's RFI but waiting for their unscrupulous means to stop procurement.
But here in the forum there are many jumping jacks who will start shouting abuses. None of the above is being discussed. Only "save the dollar" (as if HUL has been made and shall be manufactured free of dollars) and then "economy of Scale" - two areas is not the job of HAL. There are many others including Secretary Defense Production to look after it.

What astounds me is their propensity to start filthy insulting abuses that derails complete things. And then start patting each others back like a pack of scavengers.

 

[Bhadra]

.................................................................

 

[vampyrbladez]

We should have a betting pool on how fast a thread in DFI devolves into Bhadrabowl and the number of times the words OFB/DRDO and foreign maal are used.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. This guy has a higher seniority and more experience. If you cannot offer a rebuttal then observe and learn.

 

[Bhadra]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. This guy has a higher seniority and more experience. If you cannot offer a rebuttal then observe and learn.

Opinion and discussing welcome but not bullshit and name calling ... even if he is chairman of HAL.

And what do you know about my rank and seniority ... ??

Show me my post where broached on the issue of HAL ... those so and so not even responded to RFI.

 

[vampyrbladez]

Opinion and discussing welcome but not bullshit and name calling ... even if he is chairman of HAL.

And what do you know about my rank and seniority ... ??

Show me my post where broached on the issue of HAL ... those so and so not even responded to RFI.

Relax bro, it's post election season and everyone needs to vent some steam.

You are a defence professional right???????????/

 

[Bhadra]

Indegenious Content - RFI lays down :

Indigenisation Content (IC). In line with the ‘Make in India’ initiative of the Government of India, the OEM is to ensure that all efforts are made to maximize the Indigenous Content (IC) of the project without any deterioration in performance standards as specified at Appendix A. India has developed a vibrant industrial ecosystem of helicopter equipment which is engaged in design and manufacture of cutting edge components and equipment for use on other Indian Projects. OEMs are to maximize Indigenous Content (IC) in the proposed design. The IC will be stipulated in the EoI and shall not be less than 40% on cost basis of the Make portion of contract as calculated in accordance with Para 13 of Chapter 1 of DPP-16.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Infrastructure Setup. The OEM would have to include the overall requirement and specifications for the infrastructure set-up required for the satisfactory implementation of the envisaged development, production, tests and maintenance, as applicable. The GSE/GHE, with quantities and all other necessary requirements with specifications, required for implementation of the envisaged development, production, test and maintenance, as applicable, should also be provided to the Indian Production Agency/ Strategic Indian Partn

 

[Bhadra]

Relax bro, it's post election season and everyone needs to vent some steam.

You are a defence professional right???????????/

That Defense Professional tag has given me very bad time in the forum ...
Any one who so desires comes and starts his "Gyan Series" of abuses on this so called Defence Professional. I have started using language which was unthinkable for me.

But I will not give up .....

 

[Deathstar]

That Defense Professional tag has given me very bad time in the forum ...
Any one who so desires comes and starts his "Gyan Series" of abuses on this so called Defence Professional. I have started using language which was unthinkable for me.

But I will not give up .....

Chill out sir ,if someone resorts to abuses instead of countering with facts and logic shows he is losing the argument

 

[Shashank Nayak]

I too am not selling any thing. But giving an abusive lecture of a system like Dhruv which is under development for last 10 years since 2009 when Navy wanted to buy 197 Naval Utility Helicopters in 2009 itself.
HAL jumped in and claimed they are capable of making it and scuttled procurement proposals.
The first LUH prototype (ZG4620) conduct its maiden flight outside HAL's manufacturing facility at Bangaluru on 6 September 2016. Till now HAL has made three prototypes.

Trial of LUH have been carried out by IN who accepted the usefulness of LUH for Indian Coast Guard but not for IN.
Now the RFI issued by MoD has been responded to but HAL has not responded to RFI knowing that it their mal does not meet requirement and they can have a backdoor entry as always.

Most of the fundamental requirements of IN are not met by HAL LUH.

HAL LUH is a single engine craft - Navy has asked for twin Engine.
Naval LUH has ship / deck landing problems - IN wants deck landing by day and night.
All up weight is less (carrying capacity is below required)
Operating Range is 350 km with 450 kg weight which is restrictive for many uses like anti piracy, coastal operations, MARCOS operation and anti submarine operations.
Folding main rotors now incorporated are untested and unproven.
More Time on Task - In requires that Helicopters must have capability to spend 2 hours 20 minutes on task with full load - with additional 20 minutes as reserve. Dhruv is simply incapable of it.
The platform is not equipped with any tarpedos which nullifies their utility for prime Naval operations.

That is why they have not responded to IN's RFI but waiting for their unscrupulous means to stop procurement.
But here in the forum there are many jumping jacks who will start shouting abuses. None of the above is being discussed. Only "save the dollar" (as if HUL has been made and shall be manufactured free of dollars) and then "economy of Scale" - two areas is not the job of HAL. There are many others including Secretary Defense Production to look after it.

What astounds me is their propensity to start filthy insulting abuses that derails complete things. And then start patting each others back like a pack of scavengers.

Dhruv is specialized for high altitude operations... Would be a lot of work to make work smoothly at sea ...