Indian Navy Developments & Discussions

[blueblood]

Indian Navy doesn't like one of these....?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formidable-class_frigate

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MEKO_200

I could be wrong but neither of those count as ocean going vessels. But if that's not the case then excellent choices but not my favourite.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Álvaro_de_Bazán-class_frigate

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_Zeven_Provinciën-class_frigate

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fridtjof_Nansen-class_frigate

Very expensive platforms. IF IN intends to spend such money then why not their very own NDB's P-17A.

If it were upto then I have already stated, Type-26 will bring in tons of new tech and capabilities.

 

[Zebra]

self delete.............................................................................

 

[Pulkit]

self delete.............................................................................

OT

Are u trying to increase your message count???

 

[Zebra]

OT

Are u trying to increase your message count???

looks like..............................................

 

[salute]

//The last UPA govt and NDA govts made it clear that the last foreign manufactured naval vessel that Indian navy will buy is the INS Vikramadithya.//

First, I didn't say it was UPA alone. I mentioned NDA too.

Second in the past 15 years we have built these many big ships,

shivalik class (project 17) - three 6200 tonne stealth frigates,
Kolkata class (project 15A) -three 7500 tonne stealth destroyers,
kamorta class (project 28) four 4000 tonne Anti submarine warfare stealth corvettes,
Shardul class - Three 4000 tonne landing ship tanks - ,
Saryu class - four 2300 tonne Offshore patrol vessels.
Arihant class - one 6000-7000 tonne nuclear powered ballistic missile submarine.

This 15 years from 2000 to 2015 include both UPA and NDA.

yeah started from 2000 atal bihari vajpayee nda govt.,

traitor upa had no option other than fulfill those contracts made during vajpayees govt. and in that meantime indian military got nothing new,

watch parikkars interview he said that some of the setbacks he has been clearing was from vajpayees era still hasnt been cleared in last 10 years,why ???

indian defence industries and indian military should be doing something new at this time but they are still stuck up in clearing this last 10 years fc*king upa mess of setbacks which gonna waste more time,

not mentioning all those scams upa did.

 

[Abhijeet Dey]

India should go for 90,000 ton aircraft carrier with EMALS technology from US. The navy also said (in some old news article) they will have AWACS based aircraft in IAC-2. They should also go for naval version of AMCA.

 

[Zebra]

I could be wrong but neither of those count as ocean going vessels. But if that's not the case then excellent choices but not my favourite.



Very expensive platforms. IF IN intends to spend such money then why not their very own NDB's P-17A.

If it were upto then I have already stated, Type-26 will bring in tons of new tech and capabilities.

These maroons are spending taxpayer's $3 billions for three or four Russian designed frigates.

http://www.defenseworld.net/news/13...ndian__3_Billion_Warship_Project#.Vay8--8ViUk

 

[Zebra]

I could be wrong but neither of those count as ocean going vessels. But if that's not the case then excellent choices but not my favourite.



Very expensive platforms. IF IN intends to spend such money then why not their very own NDB's P-17A.

If it were upto then I have already stated, Type-26 will bring in tons of new tech and capabilities.

These maroons are spending taxpayer's $3 billions for three or four Russian designed frigates.

http://www.defenseworld.net/news/13...ndian__3_Billion_Warship_Project#.Vay8--8ViUk

 

[Blackwater]

so then we will sell the ships back to the Russians.

The Ukrainians are not fools, why will they sell the engines to India?

They will once frigates reaches India and change of ownership to India Ukraine will sell those engines , they don't want to supply engine till this frigate Russian own

 

[blueblood]

These maroons are spending taxpayer's $3 billions for three or four Russian designed frigates.

http://www.defenseworld.net/news/13...ndian__3_Billion_Warship_Project#.Vay8--8ViUk

Precisely the reason why I said to build more P-17A instead of Talwar class when their cost is same but capabilities are not. The frigate classes you mentioned are much more expensive than $1 billion each and India has no military ties with most of them.

 

[jackprince]

That is Indian Politicians.

NDA also suffers from (Russian) khujli , just like UPA .

Yes, you scratch my back and then I will scratch yours. Age old idea, still works!!!

Russians are helping us in nuclear submarines, Fifth generation fighters , Brahmos missiles etc. Do you think any other country would have given something like this to India? So as a friend they want something in return for their defence industry. Also Russians (a permanent member of UNSC) is supporting India internationally.

This is politics dude!!!!......................

Russia is not a friend of India, but an ally. They are doing none of what you mentioned out of their bigger heart, but for money only. You just look into the money that India invested in those programme, and you will see the actual picture. When it is true that Russia shared some of the Tech and goodies with India, they also knew they had to if to keep India at their side and get the money from India.

So according to this news, Talwar class and P-7A will cost the same ie $1 billion.

I hope some sense prevails in MOD.

How did you come to the figure of $1 Billion? The $427million is the cost for upgradation of all the talwar class and Delhi class together, if I read the report right.

Btw, we are not going for older version frigate, but updating older ships.Mid life upgrades are not something new and unique for high-value weapon's systems. Also, the systems of the ships are already mated with Russian systems, which will help integration the codes easier

 

[blueblood]

How did you come to the figure of $1 Billion? The $427million is the cost for upgradation of all the talwar class and Delhi class together, if I read the report right.

Post no. #2638

http://www.defenseworld.net/news/13480/Russia_Selects_Pipavav_For_Indian__3_Billion_Warship_Project#.Va0ynrU5Hcd

Btw, we are not going for older version frigate, but updating older ships.Mid life upgrades are not something new and unique for high-value weapon's systems. Also, the systems of the ships are already mated with Russian systems, which will help integration the codes easier

You are confused saar. We are going for 3-4 new units of improved Talwar class which makes no sense at all as far as the price is concerned.

 

[Bheeshma]

Has a design been finalized for P-17A? I am yet to see any drawings. I hope MDL and GRSE start working on them soon. IN needs at least 10-12 destroyers and 18-21 frigates by 2030 so more ships are always welcome.

 

[cobra commando]

Israeli-designed underwater defence system launched in Kochi

 

[bengalraider]

http://news.yahoo.com/france-seeking-buyers-mistral-warships-122138157.htmlhtml

BRUSSELS (AP) — If you're looking for a boat to carry 16 helicopter gunships, 700 troops and up to 50 armored vehicles, the French may be ready to make you a super deal.

After France reached agreement to cancel the sale of two warships it had been building for Russia, the French defense minister was on the radio Thursday talking up the vessels' merits.

"These are good ships," said Jean-Yves Drian, "ships that can serve multiple purposes," from force projection and command to acting as floating hospitals.

The 1.2 billion euro ($1.3 billion deal) for the Mistrals was supposed to be the largest arms sale ever by a NATO country to Russia, but France put the deal on hold after Moscow's 2014 annexation of Crimea from Ukraine.

Le Drian said a number of unspecified countries have "made their interest known" in the boats, which are similar to the U.S. Navy's San Antonio class of amphibious transport dock ships.

Finding another buyer, or buyers, may not be quick or easy, and may require the French to engage in creative deal-making, Ben Moores, senior defense analyst at IHS Jane's, a London-based defense research company, told The Associated Press.

Over the next 10 years, Moores said, there will be an estimated demand for 26 ships like the Mistrals in countries that France can trade with legally.

Those potential customers range from France's NATO allies like Turkey and Canada to India, Australia and Singapore.

"A problem for the French is a lot of those countries weren't expecting deliveries to occur before 2020," said Moores. "So they won't have money immediately in their budget to pay for those ships."

Whoever ends up with Mistrals, which are now at a shipyard in the western French city of Saint Nazaire, will need to repaint them to cover up the Russian Navy names and markings they now bear.

We should buy these boats, would be very cheap at only 600$million each

 

[Abhijeet Dey]

http://news.yahoo.com/france-seeking-buyers-mistral-warships-122138157.htmlhtml

BRUSSELS (AP) — If you're looking for a boat to carry 16 helicopter gunships, 700 troops and up to 50 armored vehicles, the French may be ready to make you a super deal.

After France reached agreement to cancel the sale of two warships it had been building for Russia, the French defense minister was on the radio Thursday talking up the vessels' merits.

"These are good ships," said Jean-Yves Drian, "ships that can serve multiple purposes," from force projection and command to acting as floating hospitals.

The 1.2 billion euro ($1.3 billion deal) for the Mistrals was supposed to be the largest arms sale ever by a NATO country to Russia, but France put the deal on hold after Moscow's 2014 annexation of Crimea from Ukraine.

Le Drian said a number of unspecified countries have "made their interest known" in the boats, which are similar to the U.S. Navy's San Antonio class of amphibious transport dock ships.

Finding another buyer, or buyers, may not be quick or easy, and may require the French to engage in creative deal-making, Ben Moores, senior defense analyst at IHS Jane's, a London-based defense research company, told The Associated Press.

Over the next 10 years, Moores said, there will be an estimated demand for 26 ships like the Mistrals in countries that France can trade with legally.

Those potential customers range from France's NATO allies like Turkey and Canada to India, Australia and Singapore.

"A problem for the French is a lot of those countries weren't expecting deliveries to occur before 2020," said Moores. "So they won't have money immediately in their budget to pay for those ships."

Whoever ends up with Mistrals, which are now at a shipyard in the western French city of Saint Nazaire, will need to repaint them to cover up the Russian Navy names and markings they now bear.

We should buy these boats, would be very cheap at only 600$million each

But what about Modi's "Make in India" initiative? Will it be cheaper to make it in India with foreign collaboration rather than buying since Cochin Shipyard is already making aircraft carriers for the Indian Navy?

 

[bengalraider]

But what about Modi's "Make in India" initiative? Will it be cheaper to make it in India with foreign collaboration rather than buying since Cochin Shipyard is already making aircraft carriers for the Indian Navy?

These ships are ready and waiting in St Nazaire, all we need to do is buy them and change the electronics and control fitting as we see fit. We could be a two carrier two LHD navy with these in less than two years. Cheap, proven and ready platforms with no strings attached.
Make in India is a good initiative but i don't see any LHD's joining our navy in the next five years from that.

 

[avknight1408]

But what about Modi's "Make in India" initiative? Will it be cheaper to make it in India with foreign collaboration rather than buying since Cochin Shipyard is already making aircraft carriers for the Indian Navy?

There already is a programme for that. Spain's juan carlos and France's mistral are competing. The ships to be built at Vizag shipyard and a private shipyard. L&T has offered to build Modified juan carlos.

 

[SajeevJino]

.

Earlier the Navy Rejected the french offer because of podded propulsion, and Recently french also says we have buyers for this Ship, No idea what our Navy/government is Thinking

one more Just Recently, the Brazil bought a LPD from the France,

 

[Adioz]

Indian Navy wants a 5 carrier fleet
I recently read an article on The Diplomat titled "India's New Aircraft Carrier May Face Further Delays".

The last line of the article caught my eye :

"In February 2015, retired Indian rear admiral Ravi Vohra was quoted as saying that India’s ultimate goal is the eventual establishment of a five-carrier fleet, comprising a mix of large and small carriers.

That makes me wonder......
1. INS Vikramaditya (40000t.)
2. INS Vikrant (40000t.)
3. INS Vishal (65000t. possibly)
4. INS ????
5. INS ????
The ???? might be a small carrier or a large carrier depending on what the Indian Navy considers a large carrier is. There are two options 1. ???? is a small carrier 2. ???? is a large carrier
Option 1 : Small carrier
That puts it in the 20000t. category and capable of operating only jump jets like the sea harriers (obsolete) or F-35Bs (out of reach). One might consider the LPH (Landing Platform Helicopter) / Multi role support vessel programme as the aircraft carrier they are talking about. The only one that would qualify for both roles is the Juan Carlos I. However the Indian Navy has reportedly asked for a version without the ski jump to limit the total length of the vessel. Also it has put forth a requirement of 4 such vessels. I am confused.

Option 2 : Large carrier
That puts it in atleast the 65000t. category with CATOBAR and possibly nuclear propulsion (i.e. similar to INS Vishal). This can only mean that they will be a follow on project of the Vikrant class aircraft carriers and would be operational only by 2030. This makes sense if the Indian strategy is a larger naval air fleet of 4th generation fighters (Mig-29Ks and Naval LCAs) to counter the smaller naval air fleet of 5th generation Chinese fighter aircraft (J-31). But the Indian naval air arm would then require a mammoth increase in its manpower (Also considering that they plan to have forward airfields on various naval bases in the Andaman and Nicobar islands).

Anyhow, given the smaller number of major surface combatants at Indian Navy's disposal, I would argue that they are not thinking of operating more than two CVBGs at a given time (with a third CVBG in reserve and refit)