Indian Army: News and Discussion

binayak95

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Back after a long time.

Recently Indian delegates were shown some newly developed Ukranian Armoured Vehicles. We will check them and will try to analysis if procured, will they be a good platform or not.

T-72AMT

View attachment 25783

Heavily upgraded T-72A. With 840 max hp diseal engine, this latest development will comlement both Bulat and Oplot. It has 125 mm 2A46 main gun. It can fire Kombat ATGM which is reported to be capable of defeating 750 mm of RHAe at a distance of 5 KM. It has Knife APS too.
But will it be a good decision to procure? (if procured, just being showcased doesn't mean being negotiated, but has a chance )
View attachment 25784
A big NO!

Why, will explain.
No need to explain bro. It'd be foolish to buy upgraded T72s from Ukraine when our own Ajeya MK II program is in full swing. But, can you give details on the Ajeya Mk II, its ERA, armour and gun specs. Have been hearing chatter of HN Steel armour and desi OFB kanpur guns on T90s and T72s
 

Vinod DX9

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1) ERA II by DRDO, officially says as good as Russian Kontakt K-5, but not explained if original Russian standard one or export quality, doengraded equivalent. I am considering it as good as standard version.
2) Kanchan Armour we use in our T-72 Ajeyas too, in glacis, instead of Russian texolites, but don't know if we have replaced Al-Rubber in turret too or not. To mount ERA, in latest models, a seperate box cage is placed, like the box turret in T-90s. Upon the cage, ERAs are mounted. See in Russian T-72B3s there are gaps between ERAs as they are mounted upon a cast armour.
t72b3.jpg

But in case of our latest modified Ajeyas no gap, just like Bhismas.
d5l3wAh.png

3) Possibly same old 2A46 or equivalent gun.
4) No HNS Armour in Arjun or Bhismas.
 

Vinod DX9

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Yes, sir, definately vulnerable. T-72 series tanks have spherical turret, even early T-90s too. So while mounting there are gaps. Later cast box armour solved the problem. Many nations like Ukraine Serbia Poland have added a layer (can't say spaced armour or solid armour added without gap) on their spherical turret, to make them box like or wedge shaped. So that ERAs can be mounted easily without leaving gaps between them. But added spaced armour also increases vulnerability against HEAT rounds.
 

12arya

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https://www.indiatoday.in/india/sto...t-wrong-about-army-uniform-1252439-2018-06-06

How Rahul Gandhi got it wrong about Army uniform


Is the Indian Army in such penury that it can't even buy uniform for its soldiers?

This is exactly what some media reports going viral in social media seem to suggest. What is even more surprising is the fact that leaders like Rahul Gandhi and Digvijay Singh have lapped up these reports and chose to tweet them from their twitter handles with stinging comments.

A ministry of finance office memorandum dated August 2, 2017 reveals that the rules regarding supply of uniforms were changed last year with the implementation of the recommendations of the Seventh Central Pay Commission. According to the recommendations, the system of providing uniforms and various kinds of allowance regarding dress and its maintenance were merged into one consolidated "Dress Allowance", to be paid annually.

The order (point no. 3) clearly says that "categories of staff who were earlier being provided uniforms, will henceforth not be provided with uniforms". The order was implemented with effect from July 1, 2017.

According to the memorandum:
The officers of the Army/IAF/Navy/CAPFs/CPOs RPF/RPSS/IPS/Coast Guard will get Rs 20,000 annually while personnel below officers' rank will get Rs 10,000 annually as Dress Allowance.
The amount of Dress Allowance shall be credited to the salary of employees directly once a year in the month of July.
The rates of Dress Allowance will go up by 25 per cent each time Dearness Allowance rises by 50 per cent.
The allowance covers only the basic uniform of the employees. Any special clothing like that provided at Siachen glacier or inside a submarine will continue to be provided as per existing norms.
The copy of the office memorandum available on the website of the ministry of Finance can be accessed here.


The media reports quoted by Rahul Gandhi and Digvijay Singh to underline the scarcity of funds also tries to make another point apart for the emotive issue of uniforms. The reports suggest that due to shortage of funds "Army has decided to drastically cut down its supplies from state owned Ordnance Factories. This move is to ensure that the money spent is instead used to procure adequate stock of critical ammunition and spares for a short intense war."

This inference about cutting down on the supplies from Ordnance Factory is also misleading. The decision to cut down the supplies from the Ordnance Factories was taken last year in April.

The Department of Defence Production letter dated April 27, 2017 reveals the real reasons behind it. The letter clearly says that on the basis of the reports of two committees, which were constituted for increasing the operational efficiency of the Ordnance Factories, it has been decided that the production facilities for non-core items being produced by these factories has to be closed down or put on PPP model.

The letter said that now it will NOT be mandatory for the Army to buy the 143 non-core items from the Ordnance Factories and it can float open tenders for them in which the OFB (Ordnance Factory Board) can also participate.


When questioned about the reports claiming shortage of funds, Defence Minister Nirmala Sitaraman in a press conference on Tuesday strongly refuted it.

"The defence expenditure has been highest in 2017-18 if you look at it since 2004-05. In same manner, it was second highest in 2016-17 & third highest in 2015-16. The fourth highest defence expenditure since 2004-05 was in 2014-15."

- Smt @nsitharaman on Defence Expenditure

Raksha Mantri (@DefenceMinIndia) June 5, 2018
It is clear that even the curtailing of expenditure on Ordnance Factories has nothing to do with the paucity of funds. This policy decision was based on numerous complaints regarding the quality of products being manufactured by Ordnance Factories.

Not only the government had to face questions in Parliament regarding the poor quality of the products being doled out by OFs, even the CAG had pulled up the government for not ensuring quality control at the Ordnance Factories. Based on the assessment of the working of OFBs, the defence ministry had even taken the extreme step of sacking 13 senior Ordnance factory officers in August 2017.

While the term "paucity of funds for Defence" covers a vast arena and is a subject of wider debate, at least the inference drawn by Rahul Gandhi and Digvijay Singh regarding the uniforms for soldiers, based on some media reports, can't be termed accurate.
 

12arya

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http://www.zeebiz.com/india/news-in...efore-june-24-check-joinindianarmynicin-50680

Indian Army recruitment rally 2018: Apply online before June 24; check joinindianarmy.nic.in

Indian Army recruitment 2018: If you want to serve in the Indian Army then there is good news. The Indian Army is organising recruitment rally in various locations in East and Northeast India

Image source: Reuters

Indian Army recruitment 2018: If you want to serve in the Indian Army then there is good news. The Indian Army is organising recruitment rally in various locations in East and Northeast India. These recruitment rallies will be held at Army Recruiting Office, Siliguri (WB) and Palzor Sports Stadium, Gangtok, Sikkim WEF for the recruitment of Soldier General Duty. The Indian Army recruitment rally will be held between 10 July 2018 and 13 July 2018. The candidates can apply before June 24, 2018.

Online registration and application is compulsory to attend the recruitment rally. Candidates should register themselves and apply for the partcipation in the rally on joinindianarmy.nic.in between May 11 and June 24, 2018. Only candidates having valid admit card will be allowed to participate in the rally, the official notification said.

Admit card will be available on the Indian Army website after June 25. Canddates have to take a black and white printout from a laser printer. Candidates have to appear in the rally according to the date and time mentioned in the admit card, the notification said.

These recruitment rallies will be held at Army Recruiting Office, Siliguri (WB) and Palzor Sports Stadium, Gangtok, Sikkim WEF for the recruitment of Soldier General Duty.

Indian Army recruitment 2018: Vacancy Details

Soldier General Duty


Educational Qualification: The candidates must possess 10th pass certificate from a recognised Board.


Selection Process:
There will be a written test and Physical Fitness Test (PFT). Based on these tests, candidates will be sellected.

Candidates must read the official notification carefully for all the details. Any error can lead to the cancellation of the application. Candidates must carefully check the details about the physical standards stipulated in the notification.
Age limit:
Maximum age limit for the job is 21 years. For details about age relaxation, one must visit the official website.
 

ezsasa

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We are coming towards the end of first quarter, There have hardly any new weapons or ammunition tenders released his quarter by IA. No major RFI's issued either.

And also no info on old RFI's of new sniper rifles, 50 Cal AMR....

Only major procurements for boots on the ground seems to be BPJ , helmets, Night vision devices, sights , over a four year period.

also no new reflex shooting ranges have been issued tenders for, in last 9 months.
 
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Kay

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We are coming towards the end of first quarter, There have hardly any new weapons or ammunition tenders released his quarter by IA. No major RFI's issued either.

And also no info on old RFI's of new sniper rifles, 50 Cal AMR....

Only major procurements for boots on the ground seems to be BPJ , helmets, Night vision devices, sights , over a four year period.

also no new reflex shooting ranges have been issued tenders for, in last 9 months.
Good that army is focussing on things that matter - artillery, infrastructure, logistics, bulletproof armours and night vision equipment.
 

rishivashista13

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Yess..... But most important thing is assault rifles.
Good that army is focussing on things that matter - artillery, infrastructure, logistics, bulletproof armours and night vision equipment.
Sent from my Redmi 4A using Tapatalk
 
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tharun

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What kind of Combat boots does our army use.
And who manufactures those and how comparable to other armies shoes.

Sent from my Redmi 4 using Tapatalk
 

Vinod DX9

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“Ammunition Boots, also known as Boots, ankle, General Service, were the standard footwear for the British Army and the Indian Army from the late 1880s. The term "Ammunition boots" comes from the original unusual source of the boots. They were first procured by the Master Gunner and the Munitions Board at Woolwich, the Regiment of Artillery's headquarters, rather than Horse Guards as the headquarters of the British Army was known then. Ammunition Boots were unlined ankle-boots with leather laces, iron horseshoe heel-plate and toe-plate, and a leather sole with 15 hobnails which were later reduced to 13. The vamp (front) and quarters (sides) were often made of a contrasting type of leather than the toe case (toe cap) and counter (heel cap), one made of "pebble-grained" (dimpled) leather and the other of smooth leather. They were designed to be hard-wearing and long-lasting rather than comfortable............. the extent of discomfort of our ammunition boots. The discomfort continues to date to a lesser degree, with the DMS Boot introduced in the 1980s. "


A nice article by Lt Gen HS Panag (R)
https://www.newslaundry.com/2018/06/21/ammunition-boots-army-military-training
 
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bhramos

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Major General VD Dogra becomes the first serving Indian Army officer and the only General across the world to have completed a gruelling ‘Ironman’ competition held in Austria


Major General VD Dogra became the first serving Indian Army officer and the only General across the world to have completed a gruelling ‘Ironman’ competition held in Austria on Sunday, army officers said today.

The Ironman is an international triathlon consisting of three consecutive events- 3.8 km of swimming, 180 km cycling and 42.2 km of running (a full marathon). It is considered the toughest one day sporting event in the world. The competitors have to complete the events in sequence within 17 hours to earn the title of ‘Ironman’.

Maj Gen Dogra completed the event in 14 hours and 21 minutes. “He is the only serving army officer from the Indian Army to have done a full Ironman and the only General across the globe to have done so,” said army officers privy to the matter.

The Ironman Austria was held in Klagenfurt on July 1. More than 3000 athletes participated in the event. Maj Gen Dogra, who is currently posted as Director General Resettlement, was one of the participants.

“He has been an avid sportsman all his life. However he started cycling about five years ago. He cycled from Leh to Chandigarh, a distance of 800 kms, in 8 days,” said officers.
He has also cycled from Jodhpur to Jaisalmer, Sela Pass to Bumla Pass in Arunachal Pradesh and from Akhnoor to Rajouri in Jammu and Kashmir. He has participated in several triathlons which include the Sprint category (500 metres swimming, 20 km cycling and 5 km running), the Olympic category (1500 metres swimming, 40 km cycling, 10 km running), the half Ironman and now the full Ironman.

“For the last one year he has been training after office hours and on weekends,” said officers.
The General has been a Sword of Honour and Gold Medalist of the December 1981 batch. He was commissioned in the Poona Horse (an armoured regiment), which he later commanded. He has also commanded an Armoured Brigade on the western front with Pakistan and an Infantry Division in a Strike Corps.

Video and full copyright : @Col Ravi Shankar Prasad, Indian army
 

bhramos

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Blindfold 60 second drill by CRPF women Commando in Kashmir

 

12arya

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https://www.dailyo.in/lite/politics...army-and-defence-ministry/story/1/25291.html?

1962 war: Truths that India still keeps close to its chest
By Claude Arpi

After the war, Nehru realised SPP Thorat was right in his predictions. But it was too late.


Thorat was accused of being an “alarmist and a warmonger”.
One of the biggest failures of the Narendra Modi government has been to ignore the post-Independence history. To give an example, the South Block still does not declassify historical documents and transfer them to the National Archives of India, as legally mandated.

Another disappointment is that the VK Krishna Menon Papers, held at the Nehru Memorial Museum & Library, are still kept under wraps and not accessible to researchers and scholars. Menon humiliated competent military officers, in some cases with the backing of the then Prime Minister. Why should this be kept secret?

Further, without rewriting history, it is important to learn from past successes, victories, as well as defeats.

In fact, there is certainly more to learn from blunders, than successes.

The case of Lt Gen SPP Thorat’s report about the “Chinese Threat” on India’s borders is worth citing. On October 8, 1959, Thorat, then responsible for Eastern Command, sent a paper on the defence of NEFA to the Army chief, who forwarded it to the minister.

Thorat’s findings were outright rejected by Menon and, worse, Thorat was accused of being an “alarmist and a warmonger”.



The report began thus: “Previously, the only real threat against India which merited consideration was from Pakistan. To this now has been added the threat from China… This is primarily due to the claim made by China upon large territories which are clearly ours… (China) has also refused to recognise the McMahon Line as the international boundary and has made deliberate incursions into our territory in Ladakh, Uttar Pradesh and NEFA (North- East Frontier Agency).”

Soon after Menon took over the defence ministry, Thorat, like General KS Thimayya, the Army chief, had fallen out of Menon’s favours.

Major Gen VK Singh, who wrote one of the Army Commander’s biographies, noted that Thorat “clearly brought out that with the troops, weapons and equipment available at that time, a Chinese attack could not be contained or defeated, and the ‘forward policy’, being advocated by Menon, was not practicable.”

Thorat also provided a time table showing “how the defences would fall day by day in case the Chinese attacked.”

He advocated the use of the Air Force to counter China.

Singh further noted: “When Thimayya retired in May 1961, it was expected that Thorat would succeed him as the Army chief. He was highly decorated, had combat experience, and was held in high regard in the service. Most important, he was GOC-in-C Eastern Command, and was familiar with the situation on the borders with China.”

Unfortunately for India, Gen PN Thapar got the top job; though technically senior, he had little field experience but was pliable and close to the minister. An exchange between Gen Thapar and Lt Gen Thorat shows the pettiness of the then leaders; it occurred at a time Thorat was in the process of retiring.

At 8am on June 24, 1961, Lt Gen Thorat received a letter from the Army chief who had been “asked” by the Prime Minister for his comments “on the following allegations against you (Thorat) which have come to his notice.” By the evening Thorat had answered all the points.


Thorat had said officers must only be loyal to their superior commanders (India Today archive)



The first allegation was about a speech given by Thorat in Ranikhet where the Army commander would have said: “Indian officers were seeking promotions through political influence which was disrupting our Army, or words to that effect.”

Thorat replied that he had only said that “officers must give their loyalty to their superior commanders and through them, to the COAS (Army chief) whoever he may be. Any tendency to look in other directions for early advancement was likely to ruin the discipline of the Army.”

The habit of finding other ways of “advancement” had already sneaked into the Army, mainly due to Menon’s ways of working.

The second allegation was that Thorat would have told a senior IAF officer that he was “allergic to the defence minister whom (he) could not stand and who was disrupting the Army.”

There is no doubt that many in the Army thought that way.

Had Thorat said it openly? Thorat answered to the chief: “I recollect that some IAF officer possibly at Jorhrat or Tezpur asked why I had not been appointed COAS. To the best of my memory, I remember having replied that you were senior to me and also that the hon’ble defence minister and I were not very fond of each other.” He admitted that it was not proper to make such a statement.




This exchange, however, shows the small-mindedness of those who asked these questions just before Thorat’s retirement. The next query was worse: “Your headquarters spent large sums of money on the farewell parties, functions and parades for General KS Thimayya in Lucknow during his visit earlier this month. How much money was spent, and how many vehicles were employed under the items mentioned above?”

The Army Commander listed “his” expenses during the farewell functions:

(a) At Home: Apr 26 Nil

(b) Guest Night: Apr 29, Nil

(c) Parade: May 1, Rs 450.

He went on to provide the details for the Rs 450.

Thorat’s conclusions were: “Should (the PM) not be satisfied with my explanation, I request that I may be given an opportunity to clear myself in person, in the presence of those who have made these allegations.”

Thapar had nastily written to Thorat, “These are serious allegations and cannot be ignored.”

It is said that after the war Nehru realised how right Thorat had been in his assessments and predictions. It was too late. One can only hope that the VK Krishna Menon Papers will soon be available to the Indian public; then we may realise all the blunders committed by the arrogant minister, and learn from them.
 

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