India China LAC & International Border Discussions

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ninja hattori

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what is deployed?? can anybody decode this ?

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Something big big big big big and unique has come !! Was taken to Ladakh yesterday along with PM !! You will see a massive massive behaviour change (tail in her legs) in China’s tone and actions in coming days !!

Jai Hind !!!


Something big big big big and unique has come !! Was taken to Ladakh yesterday along with PM !! You will see a massive massive behaviour change (tail in her legs) in China’s tone & actions Why exactly after 2 hours of PM,s visit there was a sudden emergency meeting in Pakistan


Why Pakistan got so scared after PM’s visit to Ladakh yesterday that it’s selected PM called for a sudden & Emergency meeting (not scheduled before) with all senior Army,Navy,NDMA,Airforce, ISI etc etc What did China tell them? China’s tail in her legs already !!
Save this!!

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and that proves his sudden visit.

was really scratching my head that y rajnath visit was cut off ,

and modi is not a person who although at this time will just go for speech and photo op,

thumb rule for modi is always,

what he shows is not actually whats happening.
 

mokoman

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List of 5th generation fighter jet programs (other than US, Russia and China)

Mitsubishi X-2 (Japan)

View attachment 52015

HAL AMCA (India)

View attachment 52016

KAI KF-X (South Korea)

View attachment 52017

TAI TF-X (Turkey)

View attachment 52018

IAIO Qaher-313 (Iran)

View attachment 52019

Flygsystem 2020 (Sweden)

View attachment 52020
Also the Tempest from Britain





Going off topic but

HAL chairman claims AMCA flying prototype will be out by 2026

Anyone believe that ? :dude:
 

ARVION

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Does rate of fire affects tank battles? Type15 tank has 105mm gun, why would you send a light tank against an obvious overkill?

Speed and rate of firepower is deadly in tank battles?

105mm rounds are obviously smaller, but that also means higher attenable velocities, so if you make Armor peircing rounds and fire them at higher rate, does it increases the probability of heavier tank to get damaged and becoming sitting ducks. Meaning crew is safe but you got a dead tank?
Type 15s aren't designed to take on T-90s because the T-90s are MBTs while ZTQ-15s are light tanks for mountain regions and swamps On the other hand, the issue is more how to conduct reconnaissance? Conventional MBTs can do recon-by-force because they're well-armored and well-protected so that if they get ambushed, the tanks are unlikely to get routed. Drone reconnaissance is good, since drones are cheap and disposable, but copter reconnaissance by Z-19s and Z-10s are going to end up meeting MANPADS and getting slaughtered. Type-15s, on the other hand, are more limited to being infantry support tanks because of their inability to knock out a T-90 in a fair fight

Moreover, if the chinis want to do deep penetration into Indian lines, the only tank that can actually get there would be the ZTQ-15, and when you set them up as requiring Z-10 and Z-19 support to take out T-90s, both the ZTQ-15 and helicopters are vulnerable in the assault role
I'm not bashing the ZTQ-15 as a bad tank, for what it provides extreme high-altitude mobility, excellent infantry support functions
 

scatterStorm

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Wow ! That is some serious inferiority complex there ! I mean a carbon copy of other cities , hell I still can't believe it , is it true ? Or a fake pic ? This is what happens if you allow a "cultural revolution" from the commie c**ts ....


Yup, that flying bird was a big big black mark on the whole movie and ruined what was otherwise the best action war movie to have come from brothelwood so far. It's like the movie makers thought "hmm...we have to show we are not Hollywood but Brothelwood...how to ruin this Film, a love story is too common, ok lets put a fungsuk wangdoo...." :facepalm:
BTW it seems the hero actor Vicky Kaushal is a librard ?
Anyway lets get back on topic...
I'll simply end this conversation with a few concepts I learned from a book that I recently read. (Sapiens)


"When human beings either are not taught the mindset of how to think, or never learn by exploring first principles to solve a problem, you've got a civilization that is bound to fall for major flaw in evolutionary progress, that's called factual learning which gives rise to imitation or seeking shortcuts to solve problems"

What we are observing is a nation that has so much insecurity in there own ideologies that they imitate other successful ones.
 

WARREN SS

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Does rate of fire affects tank battles? Type15 tank has 105mm gun, why would you send a light tank against an obvious overkill?

Speed and rate of firepower is deadly in tank battles?
PLAGF Lack Experience And To much dependence theoretical Study
they never Expected IA to deploy T-90's at Ladakh

105mm rounds are obviously smaller, but that also means higher attenable velocities, so if you make Armor peircing rounds and fire them at higher rate, does it increases the probability of heavier tank to get damaged and becoming sitting ducks. Meaning crew is safe but you got a dead tank?
Depends On Protection A Heavy tank like T-90 has Heavy Armour Which Easily counter Type-15
So far Type-15 Armour Reliability Is Questionable Why ???
Because As Heavy Armour Is means more Weight added To Net MBT weight

T-90S Is Hard To Penetrate With Modern KE Sabot Round Available currently
Kontakt-5800–8301150–1350


1593885225190.png
 

HariPrasad-1

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I’ve been saying this the whole time.

We need massive fleets of diesel electric subs(40+).
And at least 15 SSNs for long range missions.
SSBNs are strategic in nature and I will not comment on that.
But gut feeling would be to have anywhere between 7 to 10 SSBNs. If these SSBNsare loaded with true Long range ICBMs,they can sit it out in anarctica and still be able to provide India with nuclear deterrence.
Having such a massive capability is always desirable bu from where the money will come from. So we should not have a big military ambition till we build a strong economy. We need to take some practical approach such as more order for Scorpene with gradual technological improvements etc.

So far as ICBMs are concern, our k series can match anything. Their payload and accuracy is so high that we can hit a target with conventional high explosive as well. K4 is superb. K5 will be even better.
 

Concard

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I’ve been saying this the whole time.

We need massive fleets of diesel electric subs(40+).
And at least 15 SSNs for long range missions.
SSBNs are strategic in nature and I will not comment on that.
But gut feeling would be to have anywhere between 7 to 10 SSBNs. If these SSBNsare loaded with true Long range ICBMs,they can sit it out in anarctica and still be able to provide India with nuclear deterrence.
We need 50 submarines. I would say out of that we should go for 25 nuclear attack submarines. And another 10 of them Nuclear ballistic missiles carrying submarines. And the rest can be on AIP submarines. We will be fighting China to deny access to Indian ocean. In case we blockade the Malacca strait they will have to leave their home bases and come and fight for supremacy in the Indian ocean to prevent their blockade. For that they have to cross that narrow strait. Here no matter how superior their numbers it doesn't matter as it would be irrelevant given the narrow strait. So 50 for me is a good number to handle Pakis and Chinese at the same time.

With respect to ships we have Andaman and Nicobar islands. They are our unsinkable aircraft carriers. We should have 3 separate squadrons on these islands to bomb Chinese ships.
 

scatterStorm

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PLAGF Lack Experience And To much dependence theoretical Study
they never Expected IA to To deploy T-90's at Ladakh


Depends On Protection A Heavy tank like T-90 has Heavy Armour Which Easily counter Type-15
So far Type-15 Armour Reliability Is Questionable Why ???
Because As Heavy Armour Is means more Weight added To Net MBT weight

T-90S Is Hard To Penetrate With Modern KE Sabot Round Available currently
Kontakt-5800–8301150–1350


View attachment 52021
Yes Armor is solid, but can you fire rounds at tracks to make it immobile, or fire at some position of tanks and scoot fast?
 

ARVION

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Having such a massive capability is always desirable bu from where the money will come from. So we should not have a big military ambition till we build a strong economy. We need to take some practical approach such as more order for Scorpene with gradual technological improvements etc.

So far as ICBMs are concern, our k series can match anything. Their payload and accuracy is so high that we can hit a target with conventional high explosive as well. K4 is superb. K5 will be even better.
That why go for smaller faster more agile SSN's hunters in large number's we could easily afford to construct and field 24 submarines in a budget of 1,00,000 crore's
 

ARVION

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We need 50 submarines. I would say out of that we should go for 25 nuclear attack submarines. And another 10 of them Nuclear ballistic missiles carrying submarines. And the rest can be on AIP submarines. We will be fighting China to deny access to Indian ocean. In case we blockade the Malacca strait they will have to leave their home bases and come and fight for supremacy in the Indian ocean to prevent their blockade. For that they have to cross that narrow strait. Here no matter how superior their numbers it doesn't matter as it would be irrelevant given the narrow strait. So 50 for me is a good number to handle Pakis and Chinese at the same time.

With respect to ships we have Andaman and Nicobar islands. They are our unsinkable aircraft carriers. We should have 3 separate squadrons on these islands to bomb Chinese ships.
Better to go on a current budget of 1,00,000 crores for faster smaller submarine of 4,000 tonnes SSN's with speed to cover entire IOR Regione's at fast speed of 60 knot's with less crew and we could afford to field 24 to 30 submarine's easily on a limited budget's
 

amit19

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and that proves his sudden visit.

was really scratching my head that y rajnath visit was cut off ,

and modi is not a person who although at this time will just go for speech and photo op,

thumb rule for modi is always,

what he shows is not actually whats happening.
what could be that big and unique ??

kali 10k or ++ ?
 

mokoman

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Having such a massive capability is always desirable bu from where the money will come from. So we should not have a big military ambition till we build a strong economy. We need to take some practical approach such as more order for Scorpene with gradual technological improvements etc.

So far as ICBMs are concern, our k series can match anything. Their payload and accuracy is so high that we can hit a target with conventional high explosive as well. K4 is superb. K5 will be even better.
No money for subs but there is money for a 3rd carrier .

China has over 50 attack subs . In case of war with china our carriers will be staying at home at the harbour .
 

ninja hattori

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I'll simply end this conversation with a few concepts I learned from a book that I recently read. (Sapiens)


"When human beings either are not taught the mindset of how to think, or never learn by exploring first principles to solve a problem, you've got a civilization that is bound to fall for major flaw in evolutionary progress, that's called factual learning which gives rise to imitation or seeking shortcuts to solve problems"

What we are observing is a nation that has so much insecurity in there own ideologies that they imitate other successful ones.
people claim Chinese phones quality are great,

now 10 yrs back they didn't even produce or be able to copy even Symbian phones,

so what happened,

iPhone manufacturing started in china,

the initial tablets for google were manufactured by asus (Taiwanese company)

if we were to see in past it was actually asus which captured indian android market other than Samsung.

asus was the one driving innovations , I still remember they were the first one who came up with 3gb ram phones heck it was a big thing in 2015.

Chinese came just 5 years ago and jio boosted the data transfer capabilities.

Chinese have always developed riding on Taiwanese back.

they dnt have there own capabilities other than imitation.
 

asingha94

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The Guardian claims 2-year-old fought 1962 Indo-China, quotes Congress worker to make wildly incorrect claims about Pangong Tso and Galwan

The British daily – Guardian, who seems to be over-enthusiastic about interfering India’s affairs, on Saturday got caught spreading fake news regarding China ‘intruding’ and ‘capturing’ India’s territory during the ongoing stand-off between India and China.

In a hurry to discredit the Modi government, the British daily not only passed-off the claims made by a Congress worker as a local resident, without even referring to his political affiliation, to claim that China has occupied Indian terrorists but also went on to quote a 60-year-old individual, who according to Guardian had fought the 1962 India-China war, which was occurred 58 years ago.

In a news report titled, “Our pastures have been taken: Indians rue China’s Himalayan land grab”, Guardian made various assertions, a few backed by questionable data, to state that China has captured pasture lands in Ladakh.

In doing so, the Guardian reporters cited a person identified as Namgyal Durbuk, whose statements have been quoted extensively in their report to suggest India has lost large tracts of territory near Pangong Tso during the ongoing stand-off between two sides along the Line of Actual Control. However, in their attempt to put forward misleading claims, Guardian deliberately ignored to mention that Namgyal Durbuk is not only a local resident of Ladakh but also a worker of the Congress party.

The Guardian, in its report, quotes Durbuk who stated, “The Indian government is lying that there is no land capture by China. Our vast green pastures, where local herders used to take their cattle, have been taken over. A number of locals have been forced by this situation to sell their cattle and move towards urban settlements for their livelihood.”

“The villagers are scared by the presence of the Chinese forces. They are so close they can even see their lights in the night for the first time,” said Congress party worker Durbuk, who also claimed that India will lose entire Ladakh to China in the next 20 years.

However, the above statement of the Congress party worker claiming that Chinese troops entering and capturing troops at Galwan valley is untrue, as Prime Minister Modi had himself categorically stated that there was no intrusion by the Chinese soldiers in the Indian territory.

Interestingly, the Guardian report does not even once report that the Durbuk is a Congress party worker.

What surprising is the person – Namgyal Durbuk, is being featured by several media houses over the last several weeks claiming that the Indian government is lying about the border situation. He was also interviewed by journalist Barkha Dutt for her online venture Mojo, where he has been introduced as a former councillor of the Congress party.

Just yesterday, the Congress party leader Rahul Gandhi had tried to pass off Namgyal Durbuk as a local Ladakhi in his scripted interview. However, the former Congress President was caught by social media users for passing off Congress workers as Ladakhis to propagate his political propaganda, who also blamed him for resorting to low-level politics at such a critical time.

The Guardian makes fake, unsubstantiated claims regarding Pangong Tso
Continuing its half-truth stories, the Guardian went on to state that few former military commanders and locals said to them that India controlled the whole area i.e all the eight ridges around Pangong Tso also known as ‘Eight Fingers’, but Chinese troops have moved inside the areas in last two weeks and are now controlling four of the eight fingers. It stated that China was building a helipad and other infrastructure around Finger Four at Pangong Tso.

However,the Guardian did not put up any evidence to substantiate their above claim.

Further, the Guardian’s claim that India controlled all the eight ridges before the area prior to the stand-off and Chinese capturing Indian lands till Finger 4 is another misleading assertion.

Ever since India lost the 1962 Indo-China war, the Pangong Tso has been majorly controlled by the Chinese. Pangong Tso is still a delicate border point along the Line of Actual Control, where incursions have always happened.

In Pangost Tso, India claims that its territory extends from Finger 1 to Finger 8. However, China claims that its territory extends from Finger 1 to Finger 4. After Kargil, China had made roads from Finger 1 to Finger 4 and later, during the Congress regime, make pakka roads in the area. Both China and India patrol the Pangong Tso area and hence, to claim that any territory has been lost in the recent Galwan Valley stand-off is a complete misrepresentation of facts.

The Line of Actual Control (LAC) – the line separating Indian and Chinese troops since 1962 – generally runs along with the land except for Pangong Tso, where it runs through the water. India controls about 45 km stretch of the 135-km Pangong Tso and China the rest.

India and China have differing perceptions regarding the LAC passing through the Pangong Tso. India has always maintained that the LAC passes through Finger 8, which has been the site of the final military post of China. The Indian troops have been patrolling these areas up to Finger 8 even today.

On the other hand, China claims that the LAC passes through Finger 1 and patrols till up to Finger 4.

By extrapolating PLA troops patrolling till Finger 4 as occupation by the Chinese is not only problematic but also untrue as Indian troops at Pangong Tso continues to patrol till Finger 8 even amidst the stand-off, which suggests that PLA troops have not ‘captured’ our territories till Finger 4 as claimed by the Guardian.

The Guardian spreads fake news, makes a two-year-old boy fight the 1962 India-China war:
The Guardian further quotes, a person identified as 60-year-old Tashi Chhepal, who according to them was a retired Indian army captain who fought the 1962 India-China war, to state that Galwan Valley was considered Indian territory then and there were no Chinese posts even close to it.

Image Source: Shiv Aroor
In a hurry to interfere with India’s internal affairs and to put misinformation in public domain regarding the ongoing stand-off between India and China, the Guardian made Tashi Chhepal, who is 60 year old currently, fight a war that took place 58 years back, making him the youngest soldier on the history.

After social media users pointed out their glaring error, the Guardian has now promptly deleted the claim they had made earlier.

https://www.opindia.com/2020/07/the...M6GA8WzwswncMWRbenG7ANPbyZCjAwyFftFN6d6DIXLPA


https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...ve-been-taken-india-china-himalayan-land-grab
 
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