Immediate steps after winning the next Indo-Pak War

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meh
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Admirable sentiments mate, but you'll find that it has already happened- during partition. Of course circumstances were very different and our side who didn't start the fire, were fighting for their very life.

I will not judge their actions from the hindsight-reinforced specs of the present. They did what they had to do to counter the annihilists and jihadi bandits from the other side.
He is delusional as heck and condescending as well. Like he is a saint in real life or what. Qoran says that you can make slaves of conquered women, so they should be accepting of the reverse as well.

Under no circumstances a Punjabi or an Indian would loot the ruins of a war will rather pledge his life to protect the modesty of the women, be she is from the other side.
:crazy: I must be an alien then because I would totally throw the women there to the dogs and I am Punjabi
 

hit&run

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Admirable sentiments mate, but you'll find that it has already happened- during partition. Of course circumstances were very different and our side who didn't start the fire, were fighting for their very life.

I will not judge their actions from the hindsight-reinforced specs of the present. They did what they had to do to counter the annihilists and jihadi bandits from the other side.
धर्म एव हतो हन्ति - धर्मो रक्षति रक्षितः ।

War with Pakistan will be fought by our professional army. Telling the world at large that we will take their women as war ruin shows Indian forces in bad light.

Your example of 1947 riots is a mismatch with present day discussion as we are contemplating to teach Pakistan a lesson militarily.

If you still disagree with me then go join these people and do tell me which Pakistani women you will pick as war ruin.

I must make a distinction here that I am all for fighting a combatant rising against Indian forces regardless of the gender. Combatant is the key word. You offend me, my nation, my religion, I will offend you back.
 

mayfair

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If you still disagree with me then go join these people and do tell me which Pakistani women you will pick as war ruin..
Stop being sanctimonious mate. I neither agree nor disagree with you and disagreeing with you does equal to a desire for maal-e-ghanimat.

My point was specifically in response to this assertion of yours

Under no circumstances a Punjabi or an Indian would loot the ruins of a war will rather pledge his life to protect the modesty of the women, be she is from the other side.
I only pointed out that when forced into corner, our people did react like that, because the other side were hell bent on annihilating them and I am not going to judge them harshly because of that.

A simple glance of history will tell you that the behaviour of the other side during the events of 1947 were not just one-off.
 

hit&run

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Keep your shame, don't need it buddy. We're no saints and I bet you are not either. What bakwas, if I want a sermon I'd go to some religious forums.. Save it.
You have no answer to my argument.

It was you who thanked a religious war cry "ਸੂਰਾ ਸੋ ਪਹਿਚਾਨੀਐ ਜੁ ਲਰੈ ਦੀਨ ਕੇ ਹੇਤ " a war cry of Sikh Soldiers who were Saints as well, posted by another poster. But both of you ended up spouting profanity in the same page.

It was you people who involved religion in it and then worst was involving Indian army because any war with Pakistan will be fought by them.

You want to abuse then there is a thread already going on which was debated in detail by older posters before making it a sticky. Pakistan Terrorist Nation Something.
..........................................................................................

Post winning the war most daunting task would be controlling the influx of refuges. There will be need
for making quarantine areas as bordering population will start poring into our borders following any civil strive that may follow in Pakistan.

Risk of nuclear weapons going into wrong hands is over hyped as technology involved in assembling and detonating one is not Jihadi's cup of tea. Best the rouge elements can do is sell parts or a bomb to highest bidder which may not be targeting India but China .....who knows or for know how the designe??

To follow................after some sense is restored in this thread.
 

hit&run

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Stop being sanctimonious mate
I neither agree nor disagree with you and disagreeing with you does equal to a desire for maal-e-ghanimat.

My point was specifically in response to this assertion of yours
If you neither disagree or agree then stay out of it. You involving in this means you are defending them and take responsibility of their assertions. This is basic hard rule of blogging.

Both the posters are Punjabi and I have ethereal right to tell them if they are going wrong. How they will react is on to them. Punjabi language is sanctimonious to me and many other others who understand how to use it and maintain a decorum when going into realm of religion.

I only pointed out that when forced into corner, our people did react like that, because the other side were hell bent on annihilating them and I am not going to judge them harshly because of that.
The topic in hand is "Immediate steps after winning the next Indo-Pak War". What you are saying has no relevance here in this scenario.

A simple glance of history will tell you that the behavior of the other side during the events of 1947 were not just one-off.
We are not talking about history but future. You have better strategic and military mind than me. I have wrote few points on topic, please add more or correct me if you can.

Thanks
 

mayfair

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^^ So in an open forum discussion, a member has no right to interject?
 

hit&run

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^^ So in an open forum discussion, a member has no right to interject?
Please do. I will answer all your arguments on topic.

BTW I have made my objection and reason behind it very clear, I have nothing more to add.

Thanks.
 

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meh
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You have no answer to my argument.

It was you who thanked a religious war cry "ਸੂਰਾ ਸੋ ਪਹਿਚਾਨੀਐ ਜੁ ਲਰੈ ਦੀਨ ਕੇ ਹੇਤ " a war cry of Sikh Soldiers who were Saints as well, posted by another poster. But both of you ended up spouting profanity in the same page.

It was you people who involved religion in it and then worst was involving Indian army because any war with Pakistan will be fought by them.

You want to abuse then there is a thread already going on which was debated in detail by older posters before making it a sticky. Pakistan Terrorist Nation Something.
..........................................................................................

Post winning the war most daunting task would be controlling the influx of refuges. There will be need
for making quarantine areas as bordering population will start poring into our borders following any civil strive that may follow in Pakistan.

Risk of nuclear weapons going into wrong hands is over hyped as technology involved in assembling and detonating one is not Jihadi's cup of tea. Best the rouge elements can do is sell parts or a bomb to highest bidder which may not be targeting India but China .....who knows or for know how the designe??

To follow................after some sense is restored in this thread.
What is there to debate?

1) The Sikh quote was posted by @Pash not by me and he didn't say anything about Pakistani women. Liking it does not mean that I'm saying that what I'm saying is backed up by Sikh scriptures.

2) I have no religious justification for what I'm saying but I don't need to, like I said I'm no saint.

3) You do not have a patent over the use of Punjabi, using my mother tongue is my birth right. If your tone was bro don't say this, it would be alright perhaps but you are talking in a really condescending holier than though manner. Save it please.

4) Have you read the Qoran? Specially what it says about captured women? They are to be made the capturer's slaves.
 

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meh
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धर्म एव हतो हन्ति - धर्मो रक्षति रक्षितः ।

War with Pakistan will be fought by our professional army. Telling the world at large that we will take their women as war ruin shows Indian forces in bad light.

Your example of 1947 riots is a mismatch with present day discussion as we are contemplating to teach Pakistan a lesson militarily.

If you still disagree with me then go join these people and do tell me which Pakistani women you will pick as war ruin.

I must make a distinction here that I am all for fighting a combatant rising against Indian forces regardless of the gender. Combatant is the key word. You offend me, my nation, my religion, I will offend you back.
The thread was in lighter vein before you came in on your high horse. Who mentioned anything about the army taking their women? Assuming that the war is won by the Army who will settle Lahore on the ground? Or will it remain a muslim shithole like Kashmir? There will be another war on the ground and probably a repeat of 1947. In that case your holier than thou attitude won't get you far.
 

airtel

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I would have deleted halves of the bigoted and all the rants against women in this thread.

ਜਨਨੀ ਜਨੇ ਤਾਂ ਭਗਤ ਜਨ ਕੈ ਦਾਤਾ ਕੈ ਸੂਰ

ਨਹੀ ਤਾਂ ਜਨਨੀ ਬਾਂਜ ਰਹੈ, ਕਹੇ ਗਵਾਵੇ ਨੂਰ

Janani jane tan bhakta jan keh data keh sur
Nah~an janani ban'h rahe kahe gawave nur

Normally people think this phrase is about mothers but hell no it about her sons.

A mother should either give birth to a Saint, or a Philanthrope or a Warrior ; shall remain barren otherwise, without wasting her bodily sheen in gravidity.

Under no circumstances a Punjabi or an Indian would loot the ruins of a war will rather pledge his life to protect the modesty of the women, be she is from the other side.

Shame on you people.

what pakis did with Hindu Girls in 1971 bangladesh ??
what pakis are doing with sikh girls in uk ??

hint >> www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-23632247

there was no women with arab & turk Invaders how so many muslim children were born , why there are millions of Muslims in south Asia ??

(Hint: Rapes & forced married )

try to understand enemy ........................and please stop this Gandhigiri .
 
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meh
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what pakis did with Hindu Girls in 1971 bangladesh ??
what pakis are doing with sikh girls in uk ??

hint >> www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-23632247

there was no women with arab & turk Invaders how so many muslim children were born ??

try to understand enemy ........................and please stop this Gandhigiri .
Its not gandhigiri he is trying to apply Sikh warrior principles in very different times and a very different scenario.
 

airtel

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Under no circumstances a Punjabi or an Indian would loot the ruins of a war will rather pledge his life to protect the modesty of the women, be she is from the other side.

.
Its not gandhigiri he is trying to apply Sikh warrior principles in very different times and a very different scenario.
From wikipedia
"Sikhs and Sikh Empire[edit]
Following the Sikh occupation of Samana in 1709, the Sikh army participated in a massacre of the city's residents. 10,000 unarmed Muslim men and women were slain.[39] Following the Siege of Sirhind, Banda Singh Bahadur ordered that all men, women and children be executed.[39] All residents of Sirhind, whether they were men, women or children were all burned alive or slain.[39] In December 1757, Sikhs pillaged the Doab and the city of Jullunder.[40] During this pillaging, "Children were put to the sword, women were dragged out and forcibly converted to Sikhism" and Mosques were defiled by pigs blood.[40] The body of Nassir Ali was dug out by Sikhs and flesh was thrust into it.[40]

Ranjit Singh went to Peshawar and pillaged the city, cut down trees for which the city was famous, burnt the palace of Bala Hissar and its mosque was defiled.[citation needed] Diwan Chand became the first Hindu Governor of Kashmir after 1354AD and enacted dozens of anti-Muslim laws. He raised the tax on Muslims, demolished the Jama Masjid of Srinagar and prohibited cow slaughter. The punishment for cow slaughter was the death penalty without any exception. He abducted all the Pashtun and Uzbek women and infamously sold them at Hira Mandi, a very popular market in Lahore (the Sikh Empire Capital).[41][42][43] Maharaja Ranjit Singh in lieu of helping Shah Shuja the grandson of Ahmad Shah Durrani asked for the ban of cow slaughter in Afghanistan and with Ranjit Singh's help, Shuja regained the Kabul Throne and imposed a ban on cow slaughter in Kabul.[44]
 

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meh
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From wikipedia
"Sikhs and Sikh Empire[edit]
Following the Sikh occupation of Samana in 1709, the Sikh army participated in a massacre of the city's residents. 10,000 unarmed Muslim men and women were slain.[39] Following the Siege of Sirhind, Banda Singh Bahadur ordered that all men, women and children be executed.[39] All residents of Sirhind, whether they were men, women or children were all burned alive or slain.[39] In December 1757, Sikhs pillaged the Doab and the city of Jullunder.[40] During this pillaging, "Children were put to the sword, women were dragged out and forcibly converted to Sikhism" and Mosques were defiled by pigs blood.[40] The body of Nassir Ali was dug out by Sikhs and flesh was thrust into it.[40]

Ranjit Singh went to Peshawar and pillaged the city, cut down trees for which the city was famous, burnt the palace of Bala Hissar and its mosque was defiled.[citation needed] Diwan Chand became the first Hindu Governor of Kashmir after 1354AD and enacted dozens of anti-Muslim laws. He raised the tax on Muslims, demolished the Jama Masjid of Srinagar and prohibited cow slaughter. The punishment for cow slaughter was the death penalty without any exception. He abducted all the Pashtun and Uzbek women and infamously sold them at Hira Mandi, a very popular market in Lahore (the Sikh Empire Capital).[41][42][43] Maharaja Ranjit Singh in lieu of helping Shah Shuja the grandson of Ahmad Shah Durrani asked for the ban of cow slaughter in Afghanistan and with Ranjit Singh's help, Shuja regained the Kabul Throne and imposed a ban on cow slaughter in Kabul.[44]
True but Baba Banda Bahadur and Ranjit Singh are not Sikh gurus.

Edit: of course he is delusional and stuck in a trap of political correctness about no Punjabi ever having done it and not doing it in future.
 

airtel

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True but Baba Banda Bahadur and Ranjit Singh are not Sikh gurus.

Edit: of course he is delusional and stuck in a trap of political correctness about no Punjabi ever having done it and not doing it in future.
My comment was a Joke but he became serious .

and involved religion & honor of Indians ..............
 

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meh
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My comment was a Joke but he became serious .

and involved religion & honor of Indians ..............
Yeah true, I was not serious as well. Also, he is right morally of course. But screw being right, where has it gotten us so far.
 

hit&run

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It is quite funny people are talking about me how I am not a hawk. I eat 1000 Left Wingers in my breakfast and can turn any of their argument on its head without much effort. I see plenty of food in this very thread but that will be like eating my own clan. So please Gentlemen stop talking about me but learn what I am saying.

You can not fix your history by taking avenge today or in future. We learn our history so that we shouldn't repeat it but not to live in our history.

I am sorry to say, I can not lose a war in the hands of Idiots.

Like Brig. Ray used to say 'Chinese are not fools'. They are watching us. Many avid India watcher are waiting us to do a mistake. From espionage, diplomatic maneuvering to movement of military hardware, nothing is spontaneous. The war is already happening with everyone not only Pakistan.

Examples of history and modern warfare in the age of nation states working along UN mandates are two different things.

Not only it is a gross digress but fails the very basic doctrine Indian army operates under the umbrella of minimum credible nuclear deterrence. I am not simply using big words for heck of it but they are binding because these capabilities makes us target of nuclear attack by nuclear war fighting powers.

Any war will commence with propaganda of massive proportions by all stake holders. Losing a propaganda war will be as deleterious as losing it militarily. Contemplating Human rights violation like examples of history given by poster is handing over victory (both moral and military) to the enemy and his supporters in a platter. Heck those who come out to support us will chicken out.

We will fight Pakistan with our declared doctrines, abiding by the Geneva convention and all other conventions. The professional word is not just a word but a demand asking your men to win playing by the rules of the game.

Of course there will be violation and population may become the target, but then there will be safety nets to explain, cover up and do damage control.

Having said that there are many subtle ways to defeat their ideology and make them implode to take so called avenge. A militarily defeated nation looks for help from the victor thus they will come to us rather us going after them. They will look upon us for ideology, culture, refuge, aid and shelter. There will be window of opportunity for hawks to assimilate or at least make them more homogeneous with your ideology.

Looking at current affairs it seems Hindus are struggling at home to defend their own ideology at alone taking it offshore in an expedition.
 

hit&run

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From wikipedia
"Sikhs and Sikh Empire[edit]
Following the Sikh occupation of Samana in 1709, the Sikh army participated in a massacre of the city's residents. 10,000 unarmed Muslim men and women were slain.[39] Following the Siege of Sirhind, Banda Singh Bahadur ordered that all men, women and children be executed.[39] All residents of Sirhind, whether they were men, women or children were all burned alive or slain.[39] In December 1757, Sikhs pillaged the Doab and the city of Jullunder.[40] During this pillaging, "Children were put to the sword, women were dragged out and forcibly converted to Sikhism" and Mosques were defiled by pigs blood.[40] The body of Nassir Ali was dug out by Sikhs and flesh was thrust into it.[40]

Ranjit Singh went to Peshawar and pillaged the city, cut down trees for which the city was famous, burnt the palace of Bala Hissar and its mosque was defiled.[citation needed] Diwan Chand became the first Hindu Governor of Kashmir after 1354AD and enacted dozens of anti-Muslim laws. He raised the tax on Muslims, demolished the Jama Masjid of Srinagar and prohibited cow slaughter. The punishment for cow slaughter was the death penalty without any exception. He abducted all the Pashtun and Uzbek women and infamously sold them at Hira Mandi, a very popular market in Lahore (the Sikh Empire Capital).[41][42][43] Maharaja Ranjit Singh in lieu of helping Shah Shuja the grandson of Ahmad Shah Durrani asked for the ban of cow slaughter in Afghanistan and with Ranjit Singh's help, Shuja regained the Kabul Throne and imposed a ban on cow slaughter in Kabul.[44]
Ranjit Singh's empire and Sikhism are not same.

Fighting for 'Deen ਦੀਨ' and fighting for Kingdom are not same either.

If Ranjit Singh conflated both and we can not see it, then our reading of history is flawed.
 

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meh
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Having said that there are many subtle ways to defeat their ideology and make them implode to take so called avenge. A militarily defeated nation looks for help from the victor thus they will come to us rather us going after them. They will look upon us for ideology, culture, refuge, aid and shelter. There will be window of opportunity for hawks to assimilate or at least make them more homogeneous with your ideology.
Good luck assimilating anybody who has been corrupted by islam. They will fight kafirs until their last breath.

I see plenty of food in this very thread but that will be like eating my own clan
Not my intent either, even though you called me an idiot :)
 

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meh
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They fight we kill. Simple. .............................
That is naive. I'd like to paste this from the book 48 Laws of Power:

LAW 15: CRUSH YOUR ENEMY TOTALLY The real world is unforgiving and shows no mercy. The moment you let your guard down be prepared for someone to take advantage of this opportunity, preventing you from reaching your goals. It's only human nature. No one in this world will show mercy for you so will you show mercy for them? CRUSH your enemy totally then. They will show no mercy for you so in return show none for them. Do not allow them an opportunity to recover. An enemy that you keep around is like a half dead viper that you nurse back to health. If you allow them to recover they will retaliate and it will lead to your downfall. Crush them totally and give no further opportunities. Do not sympathize, do not show pity or hope, do not negotiate. Crush them totally and toss them aside. It may seem cruel and amoral but in the real world it's you or them and you must do what is best for yourself and loved ones. Be the wolf among the sheep. Remove your enemies COMPLETELY or they will remove you.
 

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