HAL Advanced Light Helicopter Dhruv

[ppgj]

ecuador chose the dhruv because it has a similar climate(tropical) as india. other factors being-IA, IN & IAF happily using it and ordering more and ofcourse the cost. they should investigate the crash in an impartial way with HAL team and then decide. crashes are common though undesirable. both the machine and the man piloting it are equally important.

 

[roma]

ecuador chose the dhruv because it has a similar climate(tropical) as india. other factors being-IA, IN & IAF happily using it and ordering more and ofcourse the cost. they should investigate the crash in an impartial way with HAL team and then decide. crashes are common though undesirable. both the machine and the man piloting it are equally important.

if you read mackintosh's post a few above , and we can guess about vested interests , an impartial inquiry is only in theory

 

[Vladimir79]

I don't reply to personal comment. And every thing in my post is not for you only. So correct yourself. Wishes

Considering you were replying to MY post, it was for me. If you think the Indian deal is the only one under scrutinty, you would be wrong.

Google Translate

The whole acquisition process is coming under fire. The Comptroller General has alot of questions to answer and widespread audits are soon to follow. So check yourself.

 

[amitkriit]

We must no defend HAL just for the sake of proving our patriotism. Truth is that over the years these government held organizations have made a mockery of "Public Money" and previledges, they get. Government of India must put into place a powerful review panel, which can review performance of these organizations.

 

[roma]

OMG!! they signed for a spacecraft and got a helicopter? No wonder they want their money back

muru - great one there - sense of humour

 

[tarunraju]

Well that's funny, I wouldn't stop buying from Ford if I skew up at driving. This incident reeks of sabotage.

 

[ppgj]

We must no defend HAL just for the sake of proving our patriotism.

amit. it is nothing to do with patriotism. dhruv is a proven machine. it is showing its worth in siachen. still there can be crashes. it holds good for any other aircraft or helicopter.

LiveFist - The Best of Indian Defence: NEWSPAPER REPORT: MoD Says Dhruv Accident Caused By Pilot Error

Truth is that over the years these government held organizations have made a mockery of "Public Money" and previledges, they get. Government of India must put into place a powerful review panel, which can review performance of these organizations.

now you are being one sided. HAL and DRDO have acheived a lot inspite of unhelpful international technology denial. if one/two crashes were to determine the status of their standing, there would be no institution including boeing, LM etc...

 

[khatarnak]

Do you always have such a victim mentality? The Ecuadorian media is either state-run or bullied by the government, like Venezuela, so whatever they are saying is the view of the government.

Sorry, you CAN NOT rely always. i.e. HAL is govt owned org.-if HAL says that IA or IAF will order more equipment, we dont believe unless supported by IA or IAF. it not govt's view, its the HAL's view.

correct me if i m wrong

 

[Yusuf]

An Mi 17 crashed day before. Is India going to return all of those to Russia and ask for its money?
Like I said before, there is a hidden agenda here. The Ecuadorians lost no time in announcing the return of the choppers even before any inquiry was constituted. I guess we will get the answer when we know who is the next supplier for choppers to that country.

 

[Ray]

It is a question of percentages.

 

[Vladimir79]

Sorry, you CAN NOT rely always. i.e. HAL is govt owned org.-if HAL says that IA or IAF will order more equipment, we dont believe unless supported by IA or IAF. it not govt's view, its the HAL's view.

correct me if i m wrong

Considering the Attorney General has called for an audit by the Comptroller General, and it is PAIS that pushed that audit, then it is backed by powerful forces in the Ecuadorian government. Ecuador is a one party state since 2007 when Correa and his movement dismissed the Congress in favour of his party PAIS. They run the show and they have pushed the prosecutors to act. The press is run the same way as Venezuela.

Ecuador Copies Venezuela on Press Freedom | Cato @ Liberty

If you hear something coming out of the press about certain feelings and attitudes, you better listen to it since it is a reflection of PAIS.

 

[Vladimir79]

Well that's funny, I wouldn't stop buying from Ford if I skew up at driving. This incident reeks of sabotage.

If you bought a 2008 Ford and found out it had a 2005 engine installed, I think you would stop buying. No??

 

[Daredevil]

I think people should shut up and listen to what officials are saying instead of keep on speculating.

 

[hit&run]

I think people should shut up and listen to what officials are saying instead of keep on speculating.

DD Although your post^^ and valid comment has cleared all speculations.
But from day one i smelling conspiracy by India's enemies. I can see there is pattren of incedents. May be its laughable that i am thinking like pakistanis but possiblity can not be ruled out!!>

 

[Yusuf]

No, i think its a commercial thing. Some other manufacturer wants to sell their choppers and wants to screw the ALH out as it is a major contender for any chopper deal in its class.

 

[Vladimir79]

I think people should shut up and listen to what officials are saying instead of keep on speculating.

It doesn't matter what Indian officials are saying, they aren't running the investigation. You can't make a determination based on 3 seconds of tape without interviewing the pilots, looking at the datarecorder, and taking witness statements. The premature declaration of pilot error only enrages Ecuador about blaming their pilots without proof of cause. There have already been statements to that account. It only hurts India's case to point the finger so early. Ecuador doesn't have anything to lose, they can return the helos under breach of contract with or without this crash being caused by mechanical failure. Someone needs to teach HAL how to run their PR campaign because it is lacking in the social graces.

 

[indian_blues]

for someone who wants an Introduction to Dhruv

YouTube - DHRUV ( ADVANCE LIGHT HELICOPTER) - INDIA

 

[Yusuf]

But then you cannot jump to conclusions without any information as well can you? The reports of problems with the helo came as soon as the crash occured and the next day they were saying they will be returned.
Ecuadorians didnt even wait for the investigations to start before handing out their judgement.

 

[Daredevil]

It doesn't matter what Indian officials are saying, they aren't running the investigation. You can't make a determination based on 3 seconds of tape without interviewing the pilots, looking at the datarecorder, and taking witness statements. The premature declaration of pilot error only enrages Ecuador about blaming their pilots without proof of cause. There have already been statements to that account. It only hurts India's case to point the finger so early. Ecuador doesn't have anything to lose, they can return the helos under breach of contract with or without this crash being caused by mechanical failure. Someone needs to teach HAL how to run their PR campaign because it is lacking in the social graces.

While people can make wild speculations based on the very same info and officials cannot make a statement based on same observations, what an irony!!!. Obviously they (officials) will have more information than you or any other wild speculator to make a informed decision on what went wrong.

You don't know if there was a breach of contract based on media reports. It has to be dealt between the HAL and customer if at all there was a breach of contract. Trial by media doesn't work, you need to look into legalities. So, have patience till the decision comes out.

 

[Vladimir79]

While people can make wild speculations based on the very same info and officials cannot make a statement based on same observations, what an irony!!!. Obviously they (officials) will have more information than you or any other wild speculator to make a informed decision on what went wrong.

You don't know if there was a breach of contract based on media reports. It has to be dealt between the HAL and customer if at all there was a breach of contract. Trial by media doesn't work, you need to look into legalities. So, have patience till the decision comes out.

Several spectators and journalists witnessed smoke before the crash which was not included on the video. This little media report was overlooked by HAL. HAL representatives in Ecuador already acknowledged the engines were not 2008 as reported by media. Comptroller General has already been called to prosecute an immediate audit of the acquisition as reported by media. If you want to ignore the media coming out of Ecuador, then you might as well stick your fingers in your ears and hum a few bars of your favourite tune. That is in essence what you are doing. I am only trying to keep you abreast of what is going on in Ecuador as that is the only venue the final verdict will matter. This is the last I will post in this thread until it does. I have been dealing with these sorts of contract disputes for a long time. Don't be suprised when the final decision doesn't come out in your favour. :bye: