HAL Advanced Light Helicopter Dhruv

[patriots]

Hal rudra in assembly...it's for army black colour
In background hal dhruv...also for army

 

[patriots]

Is it a ..... mistake or what.....

Written imrh hangar.....is hal doing imrh

But not luh hangar

 

[abingdonboy]

View attachment 37764

Is it a ..... mistake or what.....

Written imrh hangar.....is hal doing imrh

But not luh hangar

LUH is there.

IMRH has been sanctioned internally and work has commenced.

 

[abingdonboy]

View attachment 37763
Hal rudra in assembly...it's for army black colour
In background hal dhruv...also for army

The black just looks silly and the army continues its stupid paint schemes, the only decent one is that green in the background for northern command HUs.

The black just makes the Rudra stand out especially if operating in mixed formations with ALHs and they have deployed the Rudra in this scheme even to the deserts!

 

[aarav]

Army needs to look into using Rudra's against the terrorists that is the easy way of lowering battle casualties and free up people for CI operations to their intended roles,rockets and 20mm guns are enough in counter terrorism role ,it also creates a psychological fear in the jihadis

 

[patriots]

LUH is there.

IMRH has been sanctioned internally and work has commenced.

Last report was govt has not sanctioned any money for imrh....
And it's development cost is so high that hal can't fund it internally...
Again no news of engine....,.

 

[patriots]

The black just looks silly and the army continues its stupid paint schemes, the only decent one is that green in the background for northern command HUs.

The black just makes the Rudra stand out especially if operating in mixed formations with ALHs and they have deployed the Rudra in this scheme even to the deserts!

Bdw I love the lch paint ......
Mountain camo...may be......

 

[abingdonboy]

Last report was govt has not sanctioned any money for imrh....
And it's development cost is so high that hal can't fund it internally...
Again no news of engine....,.

They have plenty of funds to get the basics done internally without govt sanction.

Engine selection can come at a much later date, it isn’t holding back any design work.

 

[Enquirer]

I just hope HAL doesn't trudge down the path of designing a 50 year old model of helo!!!

Given that any effort starting now will only yield anything tangible only in the next 8-10 years (at the least), HAL should opt for a pusher model (with compound rotor) - this will give it much faster speed and higher efficiency!

They should use ALH as base to create a tech demonstrator of the 'pusher model'

 

[patriots]

They have plenty of funds to get the basics done internally without govt sanction.

Engine selection can come at a much later date, it isn’t holding back any design work.

Bhai without a definite engine in mind..is not it difficult to design.
....we need a proper engine .
Again if they are doing the basic s..in 2.to 3 years they need engine..
Bdw I hope you are true hal is doing imrh...
As we need imrh . Badly....
Specially in

 

[abingdonboy]

I just hope HAL doesn't trudge down the path of designing a 50 year old model of helo!!!

Given that any effort starting now will only yield anything tangible only in the next 8-10 years (at the least), HAL should opt for a pusher model (with compound rotor) - this will give it much faster speed and higher efficiency!

They should use ALH as base to create a tech demonstrator of the 'pusher model'

Don’t fall for that trap. Don’t let perfect be the enemy of good enough.

If the Indian armed forces can get a domestic helo in the class of the EH101 or S92 in the 100s it will utterly transform the entire Indian armed forces. The army will be able to raise aviation brigades, the navy will fix their huge ASW issue as well as having the ability to create their own amphibious assault brigades.

They don’t need space age stuff, the IMRH will be massively advanced for its class and this class isn’t going anywhere. Let the Americans that spend $700bn/year on defence create the cutting edge niche equipment that no one else buys.

 

[Enquirer]

Don’t fall for that trap. Don’t let perfect be the enemy of good enough.

If the Indian armed forces can get a domestic helo in the class of the EH101 or S92 in the 100s it will utterly transform the entire Indian armed forces. The army will be able to raise aviation brigades, the navy will fix their huge ASW issue as well as having the ability to create their own amphibious assault brigades.

They don’t need space age stuff, the IMRH will be massively advanced for its class and this class isn’t going anywhere. Let the Americans that spend $700bn/year on defence create the cutting edge niche equipment that no one else buys.

What would IMRH do that cheap Mi-17s won't????????????????
Should Tejas have been designed just to match Mig-21 capabilities - no FBW, no composites, no FADEC?????

 

[abingdonboy]

What would IMRH do that cheap Mi-17s won't????????????????
Should Tejas have been designed just to match Mig-21 capabilities - no FBW, no composites, no FADEC?????

IMRH is a generation ahead of MI17. It is safer, has superior performance, likely better maintainability, more automatic functions, more user friendly etc etc not to mention being INDIAN.

These might seem like modest improvements to you but for a nation that 20 years ago hadn’t even made a gyrocopter to now being able to deliver world class 12-13 ton behemoth that many militaries can’t afford let along nations build is nothing to be scoffed at.

You would rather see the ICG go waiting for endless years for a super duper transformer than have a domestic solution ?

Same with the IN and the ASW role.

Same with the IA and their aviation brigades.

In what world does India need a ultra cutting edge next generation push design helo for that? 1) those designs are at their very early stages right now and none will be in IMRH class for a long time and 2) India isn’t the US, it doesn’t need these fast long range helos that will go 1000s of KMs into enemy territory, the entire US military is designed to be expeditionary- the Indian military is not. Why ape the West blindly?

You’d have the services wait decades for something they don’t even need?

I’m sorry but if HAL could build and deliver something in the H225M class tomorrow are you really saying the services who have been screaming out for such a helo for years would turn it down?

Let’s live in the real world. By your analogy LCA should’ve been a 6G plane because that is what US is designing.


The “traditional” helo design isn’t going anywhere the USMC has sunk 10s billions into the CH53K, the US army has ordered 100s of the CH47F. Everything else is just a pipe dream that the Indian armed forces cannot afford to indulge in.

 

[Enquirer]

IMRH is a generation ahead of MI17. It is safer, has superior performance, likely better maintainability, more automatic functions, more user friendly etc etc not to mention being INDIAN.

These might seem like modest improvements to you but for a nation that 20 years ago hadn’t even made a gyrocopter to now being able to deliver world class 12-13 ton behemoth that many militaries can’t afford let along nations build is nothing to be scoffed at.

You would rather see the ICG go waiting for endless years for a super duper transformer than have a domestic solution ?

Same with the IN and the ASW role.

Same with the IA and their aviation brigades.

In what world does India need a ultra cutting edge next generation push design helo for that? 1) those designs are at their very early stages right now and none will be in IMRH class for a long time and 2) India isn’t the US, it doesn’t need these fast long range helos that will go 1000s of KMs into enemy territory, the entire US military is designed to be expeditionary- the Indian military is not. Why ape the West blindly?

You’d have the services wait decades for something they don’t even need?

I’m sorry but if HAL could build and deliver something in the H225M class tomorrow are you really saying the services who have been screaming out for such a helo for years would turn it down?

Let’s live in the real world. By your analogy LCA should’ve been a 6G plane because that is what US is designing.


The “traditional” helo design isn’t going anywhere the USMC has sunk 10s billions into the CH53K, the US army has ordered 100s of the CH47F. Everything else is just a pipe dream that the Indian armed forces cannot afford to indulge in.

Sorry to say but you're trying too hard to buttress your original declaration with much supporting arguments!

Firstly, Unlike when Tejas design was started, HAL currently has 3 separate Helo designs (albeit overlapping) that are flying successfully. The attributes that you talk about - safety, maintainability, automation, user-friendliness have all been already implemented in ALH, LCH & LUH.

Secondly, when Tejas design was being initiated use of composites, FBW was also very very advanced stuff!!! If those can be achieved then so can a simple pusher model!

Thirdly, If you realize, there is already a shaft that runs from the engines to the tail that rotates the tail rotor. The pusher model will transmit more power (that's all!). The laws of physics for a rotor to push are fairly simple......HAL has good experience in designing prop planes!

Fourthly, IMRH (even with the traditional model) first flight is not expected for another 10 years...with production at least 5 years after that! The CH53Ks that you talk about, the design work started about 15 yrs ago....and they also use COMPOUND ROTORS!

Fifthly, Speed, range and fuel efficiency are key parameters when hauling troops from one sector to another during peak battle! The slow-lumbering traditional helos will be at a disadvantage!!! It has nothing to do with US being expeditionary and India being a pacifist!!!

Compound rotor is the only new tech that HAL will need to develop.....the gear system probably will be easy enough. The complication if any would be in the 'control' part.....varying the speeds of diff rotors for turning etc. But it's not an insurmountable problem!!!

If HAL indeed wants to make a sale to IAF/IN/IA in 15 years time, then they better adopt newer designs to offer better speed, range & efficiency. If they don't hit those parameters then you'll again see IAF/IN/IA going to V22s Osprey or other pusher helos from the international market! The fanboys will continue to cry foul!!!!!

 

[WolfPack86]

Rudra attack helicopter.

 

[WolfPack86]

Rudra attack helicopter.

 

[Bleh]

Rudra attack-helicopter is basically a Dhruvs with bells & whistles.. it's body has hollow space. But LCH although slimmer is solid. What's inside there?.. that Rudra hasn't?

 

[WolfPack86]

Rudra attack helicopter firing 70 mm rockets.

 

[Bleh]

Rudra attack helicopter firing 70 mm rockets.

Those Rockets are unguided, how are they going to hit something fired at that angle?!.. How are they even aimed?

 

[Shashwat]

^^ Ever heard of parabola? Even if its unguided its path can be prejudged. The diff is that with guided rocket you can target with more precision and CEP is reduced but unguided cant be precise but that can be compensated when fired w/o moving.