General History Thread

asaffronladoftherisingsun

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He did have a grassroots movement all over India though.
You have to wonder though, why would a racist, Imperialist foreign regime allow this to go on without any repercussions? why was a half-clothed "Saint"'s utterances of Freedom( I know it didn't start off as full Independence, just greater rights for us poor savages ) and national unity spread all across the country ?

:troll:

That is the question to be asked.

Perhaps eventually, the Anglo realised than an urge for freedom from cumskinned parasites would cause an independence movement across the country, and rather than it be out of control with different leaders, better a Saint who empathises with the poor be raised to co-opt this sentiment, so as to ensure a peaceful transition of power with all the Macaulay's Children intact in case anything untoward happens...
Like destitution stemming from a certain World War

I mean how many did the Iran Mullahs, Mao commies or Russian commies leave alive from the previous regime?

Keep in mind here the goal was that the ideology must persist in India, not some gay love for the ex-colonizer, that would only be a cherry on top.

And so you have glorious decades of socialism, (((secularism))) and generally the whole pre-Independence establishment being there without any changes except removal of the white master and addition of the brown one.
Where is the resignation letter of gandhi from britfags army ?

We have the resignation of Subhash Chandra bose.

Where is the gandhi's letter of resignation?

Wait there is this letter.

Letter from the coomerchill asking if the Gandhi is taking glucose or not. Gandhi was the britfags babe.

Youknowyourtraitors.jpg
 

Master Chief

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And given full vip treatment and awards too.
View attachment 179408
These are letters from 1920-21 when Gandhi believed in seeking an equal status for India within the British empire. It was more in line with his work in South Africa where Gandhi organized Civil rights movements..
There are letters of Gandhi to Viceroys like Irwin, Willingdon etc.. where he does not refer to himself as an Obedient servant.. It just ends with the normal Sincerely, MK Gandhi..
Gandhi's involvement with Congress and Indian Freedom Movement really began in the 1920s. Congress and Gandhi launched the struggle for Purna Swaraj or Independence only in 1929.
CAN you show me a letter by Gandhi in 1930s or 1940s where he describes himself as a obedient servant of the British?
 
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Master Chief

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Right wing: Neta ji got us freedom
Leftards: Gandhi JI got us freedom

Truth: Gau Mata got us freedom. Cow protection movement transformed Indian National Congress from an irrelevant debate club into an actual political party.

View attachment 179543
Of course Hindus were and are religious. INDIA can be plural but never secular.. Gandhi too heavily relied upon Hindu religious symbolism to attract Hindu masses to the freedom movement
 

Master Chief

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Where is the resignation letter of gandhi from britfags army ?

We have the resignation of Subhash Chandra bose.

Where is the gandhi's letter of resignation?

Wait there is this letter.

Letter from the coomerchill asking if the Gandhi is taking glucose or not. Gandhi was the britfags babe.

View attachment 179544
Come on man.. cut Gandhi some slack.. :bplease:
Dude liked Nubiles and all.. But he was force to reckon with and had a Iron will.. :daru:
 

Tactical Doge

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It was Gandhi who made the independence movement a grass roots movement.. It had a big role in uniting a 90 percent illiterate populace in a cause where they felt they were part of something bigger.
When the first movie on Shaheed Bhagat Singh was made post independence not many Indians were even aware of him. But, almost every Indian living in the 40s was aware of Gandhi. My Grand father in South India, too was Inspired by Gandhi; crossed the British multiple times with some fellow villagers, and was thrown in jail multiple times as well.. I don't agree with a lot of things Gandhi did, but the dude played his part in the freedom struggle gaining momentum..
A good number of Netaji's followers were Tamils
At certain point, they couldn't give two shits about Gandhi
By 1944 all the hype about INC-Gandhi-Nehroo was basically dead

P.S
I also have good share of Gandhians in my family who the British gave some Jail treatment
It was not as they make it out to be, it's easy for stories to spiral into bravado
 

Master Chief

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A good number of Netaji's followers were Tamils
At certain point, they couldn't give two shits about Gandhi
By 1944 all the hype about INC-Gandhi-Nehroo was basically dead

P.S
I also have good share of Gandhians in my family who the British gave some Jail treatment
It was not as they make it out to be, it's easy for stories to spiral into bravado
You do know that there were a number of revolutionaries too who were inspired initially by Gandhi, but later lost trust in his methods, and chose the revolutionary path.. What cannot be denied is that Gandhi did light the spark for Independence in many Indians, whatever the path that they ultimately chose..
 

Tactical Doge

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The First War of Independence was not really a grass roots movement nor a pan India movement. The rebellions involved British sepoys in the Indo Gangetic plains, and did not involve the Indian sepoys in Bombay or Madras presidencies..
Also, the Rebellion in the north involved mainly upper caste Hindu and Muslim sepoys ( in Delhi they chose Mughal Bahadur Shah as the titular head ), with barely any involvement of the lower castes who form the bulk of Hindus..

So, the first War of Independence while commendable, neither had the breadth or the depth, of the Pan India grass roots movement that Gandhi inspired, which inspired even the lower castes to participate in the independence movement..

Screenshot of Areas involved in the Revolt in 1857

View attachment 179534
Rebels actually wrote letters to the king of Travancore in the extreme south(among others), to revolt, since he had a large standing army and police
Marthanda Varma II was a spineless coomer and didn't wanna go against his white masters
 

Master Chief

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Rebels actually wrote letters to the king of Travancore in the extreme south(among others), to revolt, since he had a large standing army and police
Marthanda Varma II was a spineless coomer and didn't wanna go against his white masters
That was the case with a lot of Royals in the North too. When the sepoys revolted, they just stayed loyal to the British.. Only a few like Lakshmi Bai fought..
 

Tactical Doge

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Which pan India grassroot movement did gandhi launch?

There were distinct movements in south of Bharat. For example the ones spearheaded by Rani Velu. Gandhi was not even born then. Her infantry consisted of Varna 4 as well in enough numbers.

View attachment 179538
Rani Velu Nechhyar is a literal Gigachad, her martial exploits would put her contemporary men to shame

The gunpowder prevailed unfortunately
 

asaffronladoftherisingsun

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These are letters from 1920-21 when Gandhi believed in seeking an equal status for India within the British empire.
Gandhi himself mentioned 1918-1920ad what he wanted.
1667180152546.png

gandhi.jpg



It was more in line with his work in South Africa where Gandhi organized Civil rights movements.
Lullz civil rights movements.Gandhi was a racist. He wanted to lift the Blacks and south african Indians from the Black to the non black category. Go check his letters from 1893ad in that regards.

There are letters of Gandhi to Viceroys like Irwin, Willingdon etc.. where he does not refer to himself as an Obedient servant.. It just ends with the normal Sincerely, MK Gandhi..
That does not change a thing about his letters written where he said your obedient servant. In many letters he says your obedient fren. To the coomer brits. Gandhi letter to jinnah is extremely dumb.
Youknowyourtraitors.PNG





Gandhi's involvement with Congress and Indian Freedom Movement really began in the 1920s. Congress and Gandhi launched the struggle for Purna Swaraj or Independence only in 1929.
Those were all joke movements. What was he doing from 1931-42. There were parallel govt. running with full britfags approval in this period. Nothing was achieved by any movement of Gandhi. He was like a whistle in pressure cooker.
CAN you show me a letter by Gandhi in 1930s or 1940s where he describes himself as a obedient servant of the British?
I have not come across that particular letter. There are hundreds of letters gandhi wrote. But I surely know this letter. This gandhi to linlithgow where he was giving explanation and disowning all of quit India movement because that was a joke like every other joke movement executed by Gandhi. This is a letter written in 1942ad. Then we have churchil asking if Gandhi has glucose in water in 1943. This confirms the fact that many of britfags later admitted.
Gandhi was the best policeman the British ever had in India." - ellen wilkinson the britfags mp 1945.
Gandhi writing letter was basically throwing congress under the bus for the So called Quit India. We told you that movement were a joke.
1667180697218.png


Of course Hindus were and are religious. INDIA can be plural but never secular.. Gandhi too heavily relied upon Hindu religious symbolism to attract Hindu masses to the freedom movement
This proves my original argument that Hindus did not need Gandhi. It was other way around.
Did not you earlier claimed that how Indians were not literate before Gandhi? I showed you distinct freedom movements long before him. So that was very hillarious remark on your side. Gandhi rather distorted the Dharmik philosophy. He claimed Ahimsa Parmo Dharma. Why he concealed full Shloka? That says

"Ahimsa Parmo Dharma Dharma Hinsa Tathev Cha"
Ahimsa is best for the establishment of DHARMA
So is Hinsa for the establishment of DHARMA

'KRISHNA of the Mahabharata actually did some of the acts attributed to him, even at the risk of being banished from the Hindu fold I should not hesitate to reject that Krishna as God Incarnate' - Gandhi, Young India, 1/10/1925.

But he was force to reckon with and had a Iron will..
You do not know this. You cannot. You are saying this not because of objectivity but some fanboyism. You certainly cannot know better than the third and most beloved son of gandhi.
Your life is a curse for the Hindu Jaati he said.

sonofthegandhi.jpg
 

asaffronladoftherisingsun

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That was the case with a lot of Royals in the North too. When the sepoys revolted, they just stayed loyal to the British.. Only a few like Lakshmi Bai fought..
Not true. There was always this gated community of traitors that rushed to britfags support. Same happened in 1857 aftermath.

Maharaj Mardan Singh and thousand others. From the villages of the Banaras Gorakhpur the entire Purbiya region extending upto Bengal RohilKhand Oudh and Maharashtra whole of it always have fought and resisted. There were at all times the pockets of resistence present in every random pockets. Be it Thakur Ranmatsingh Baghel . Scindias fought the britfags from approx 14 years before 1857 Rebellion without any support entirely on their own. @Haldilal

The fundamental point is that we certainly have expelled britfags much early if there had been no Gandhi. Because all the Gandhi did was to weaken the freedom efforts with his deadly charkha ofcourse.

As the treacherous mooghal which betrayed the Marathas in early 1800ad. By opening gates of Red Fort to the coomer britfags.
 

Master Chief

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This proves my original argument that Hindus did not need Gandhi. It was other way around.
Did not you earlier claimed that how Indians were not literate before Gandhi? I showed you distinct freedom movements long before him. So that was very hillarious remark on your side.
Well, you are not being objective here in your hatred of Gandhi. The potential for mobilization using religious symbolism, does not automatically translate itself into a pan India movement. Someone has to do the mobilizing, and that some one was Gandhi..
This strategy of using religious symbolism to mobilize Hindus was pioneered by Bal Gangadhar Tilak, who in 1894 started public Ganesh Utsav celebrations and processions in the Bombay Presidency (which continues to this day) to unite Hindus, in the struggle for Self Rule.
 

asaffronladoftherisingsun

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Well, you are not being objective here in your hatred of Gandhi. The potential for mobilization using religious symbolism, does not automatically translate itself into a pan India movement. Someone has to do the mobilizing, and that some one was Gandhi..
Which movement of gandhi were a success? Parallel govt. were running with the full britfags approval. What was the gandhi doing? I told you already. You need to read that slowly.

The mobilizing was already there w/o Gandhi before Gandhi. I have shown that already. Gandhi was mobilizing lullz. He disowned the quit India movement in 1944 itself. Are you even reading?

Youknowyourtraitors.PNG


Tell you what the mobilizing efforts look like... Gandhi did none of these.

The first person to burn down the first lot of foreign made clothes against the Bengal partition movement on the October 1905 Pune. Bal Gangadhar Tilak offered full support to Savarkar here.

Ironically approx 16 years later July 1921, Gandhi called for a boycott of foreign clothes in Mumbai.

The only Patriot who called for a boycott of the coronation festival of edward the seventh.

The first Patriot known for his opposition to the condolence proposal for queen victoria at Nasik.

The first Indian who was rusticated from ferguson College in Pune and fined β‚Ή 10 later in Kesri Bal Gangadhar Tilak wrote editorial in Savarkar's support.

Savarkar the only barrister who after clearing exam refused reading the oath of being faithful to britfags and for this reason was not awarded the title of a barrister.

Savarkar was the first author whose work, "1857, the first war of independence," was banned before it was even published! Bhagat Singh was the first person to get the book printed in India at his own payment. Each copy was sold at β‚Ή 300 very high price at that time.

Savarkar was the first revolutionary whose litigation had gone to the International Court but due to the combined conspiracy of the britfags french was unable to get Justice.

Savarkar was born leader and extremly influential that even the son of marx agreed to fight his case.

Savarkar who after suffering imprisonment from the britfags for 30 years pre independence. He was again imprisoned by nehru in 1948 on the false charge of Gandhi's murder but was forced to free him when the Court found out he was falsely implicated.



This strategy of using religious symbolism to mobilize Hindus was pioneered by Bal Gangadhar Tilak, who in 1894 started public Ganesh Utsav celebrations and processions in the Bombay Presidency (which continues to this day) to unite Hindus, in the struggle for Self Rule.
Tilak was objective and down to earth fellow. He did not issued any dumb statements as Gandhi did. Tilak knew who is the real fighter and who to support. Tilak exactly knew and did not agree with dumb distortion of Gandhi's Ahimsa Parmo Dharma. Infact Tilalk were entirely opposite. He belonged to that breed of freedom fighters who had deeply internalised BHARAT's culture. Bal Gangadhar Tilak saw Karma Yog Shastra in Gita and Gandhi saw non-attachment. Tilak knew what the BHAGVAAN KRISHNA exactly taught. Krishna’s ahimsa is described in Bhagavadgita 18:17 killing someone for Dharma without ego and or attachment is not himsa.

A soldier kills at the border protecting the motherland. He is not committing any Hinsa thats what the Shri Krishna meant and taught us all in the BhagvadGita.

Hence all of your arguments are all erroneous.
 

asaffronladoftherisingsun

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Tilak was not the first to use religious symbolism but he merely continued that tradition and amped it up because of the SarvaDharma Sambhav fraud of Gandhi had taken over. Sarva Dharma Sambhav is not found in any of the Dharmik texts. Its a fraud insertion. We all know why.
 

asaffronladoftherisingsun

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You like Gandhi that is not problem but when you claim Gandhi is the only who gets us freedom for mass grassroot lullz. Then its ridiculous factually incorrect and hence becomes extremly problematic .
 

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You like Gandhi that is not problem but when you claim Gandhi is the only who gets us freedom for mass grassroot lullz. Then its ridiculous factually incorrect and hence becomes extremly problematic .
I never said Gandhi was the only one that got us freedom.. I said that he had the most impact.. Of course there are thousands of leaders ( big and small) who contributed in the freedom struggle..
 

asaffronladoftherisingsun

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I never said Gandhi was the only one that got us freedom.. I said that he had the most impact.. Of course there are thousands of leaders ( big and small) who contributed in the freedom struggle..
Did not you claim that allegedly Indians were all illiterate before gandhi?

Which impact buddy?

When I have already showed you freedom movements and resisting across BHARAT from before Gandhi. The existence of Gandhi hence becomes null and void. You need to curb your fanboyism. Gandhi was a politician not a saint and not any freedom fighter. He was giving the same advice to jews as the same advice to the Hindus. He was asking the jews to walk to the gas chambers. He was asking the Hindus to go and die. He needed professional help. If you are asking a whole community to surrender to mass slaughter. Then you are not a freedom fighter of even atom's worth. Forget the grassroot.

1667190190914.png
 

Master Chief

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Did not you claim that allegedly Indians were all illiterate before gandhi?
Of course 90 percent of India was illiterate at the time of independence.. That today we are 75 percent literate is an important achievement, although we could have done better.
Which impact buddy?

When I have already showed you freedom movements and resisting across BHARAT from before Gandhi. The existence of Gandhi hence becomes null and void. You need to curb your fanboyism. Gandhi was a politician not a saint and not any freedom fighter. He was giving the same advice to jews as the same advice to the Hindus. He was asking the jews to walk to the gas chambers. He was asking the Hindus to go and die. He needed professional help. If you are asking a whole community to surrender to mass slaughter. Then you are not a freedom fighter of even atom's worth. Forget the grassroot.

View attachment 179580
Localized rebellions that you cite do not have the same force of a pan India freedom movement. Yes, these smaller rebellions and movements were important too, and I don't dismiss them.. But, they don't have the same force and they don't tax the Imperial machinery the same way as for example Civil disobedience in the wake of Gandhi's Salt Satyagraha did.. People in Maharashtra, Karnataka, Gujarat, Central Provinces and Bengal defied the British by not paying Taxes, defying Forest laws, and boycotting British goods.. More than 60,000 people were jailed.. Now, that is some impact.
Gandhi's methods were a liability in an Independent India.. And since, Muslims wouldn't stop rioting at his behest, he tried persuading Hindus to disarm, since Hindus were more receptive.. Anyway, he paid with his life, for these ill thought out interventions..
 

asaffronladoftherisingsun

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Of course 90 percent of India was illiterate at the time of independence.. That today we are 75 percent literate is an important achievement, although we could have done better.
No you said before Gandhi all Indians were allegedly illiterate. What was the literacy in the eurofags 3 percent 4 percent 5 percent like this. Even the enrollments in the unis and higher education was far greater back in Bharat than anywhere else.The destruction of the Indian education system was consequence of the coomer britfags rather. Then we had start all from the beginning in 1947ad.

Can give many examples. My favorite is the shipbuilding. Before Gandhi was even born the Indians were experts and highly educated and not any illiterate at all.

DHARMAAloneTriumphs(1).PNG



Localized rebellions that you cite do not have the same force of a pan India freedom movement. Yes, these smaller rebellions and movements were important too, and I don't dismiss them.. But, they don't have the same force and they don't tax the Imperial machinery the same way as for example Civil disobedience in the wake of Gandhi's Salt Satyagraha did.. People in Maharashtra, Karnataka, Gujarat, Central Provinces and Bengal defied the British by not paying Taxes, defying Forest laws, and boycotting British goods.. More than 60,000
Which pan India freedom movement of Gandhi are you talking about? Have you read english factory records? Gandhi ke 3 movement successfull hue champaran kheda or probably Ahmedabad and that too at local level. Quit India movement were joke. The letters of gandhi are testimony to that. Rani Velu as our @Tactical Doge put had offered far effective resistence before gandhi was even born. Be it non corporaishion, civil disobedience meme, salt satyagragh was a utter failed. Gandhi called off those all writing the letters pledging total allegiance to britfags. Or he blatantly refused his hand backed off in case of his routine faliures.Whilst provincial government with britfags support were established in the provinces. Meanwhile the coomer britfags kept slaughtering and massacred randomly on the streets.

The movements w/o Gandhi had greatest impact. It is the britfags themselves agree.
20221031_130540.jpg


20221031_130424.jpg


Gandhi's methods were a liability in an Independent India.. And since, Muslims wouldn't stop rioting at his behest, he tried persuading Hindus to disarm, since Hindus were more receptive.. Anyway, he paid with his life, for these ill thought out interventions
Ram Manohar Lohiya therefore confirmed that assassination of gandhi and Partition of BHARAT are two aspects of same coin.

As I said Gandhi needed professional help back then. Those who still believe Gandhi need professional help today.
 
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Master Chief

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Be it non corporaishion, civil disobedience meme, salt satyagragh was a utter failed.
That Salt Satyagraha initiated by Gandhi in 1930 triggerred mass civil disobedience movement for years, which saw the participarion of millions ( under various regional leaders like Rajagopalachari, Kelappan, Nadkarni in the south, Abbas Tayabji, Madan Mohan Malaviya, Subhash Bose in Bengal etc....). I would call that a success..
If the measure of success is the British giving into Indian demands immediately and packing up, then, well that success was not achieved by any single movement.. The Quit India movement was a failure because the entire Congress leadership was arrested immediately after the movement was launched, and was under arrest until the end of WW2.. This was the time, when the Muslim League remained unchallenged and gained in strength..
 

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