F-35 Joint Strike Fighter

[BON PLAN]

Even pre-IOC F-35 can generate a constant 28°/sec pedal turn

pedal turn...... nothing more serious in stock ?

 

[BON PLAN]

A customer lost ?

http://www.ekathimerini.com/228781/...vision-that-could-freeze-arms-sales-to-turkey

100 x F35 less ?

 

[StealthFlanker]

Only non FBW plane. F35 is FBW so non relevant.

Not all FBW are the same, for example F-16 FBW limit its AoA with speed while F-18 FBW doesn't.

F14 was a flying brick. Only the Top Gun fan think it's an agile plane. In 2001, first training between F14 and Rafale was a butchery. Rafale take the lead at first turn. It need 3 turns to beat FA18.

The issue with the F-14 is very slow acceleration rate and roll rate and at high speed it's wing fold back and therefore reduce its L/D ratio and therefore reduce its STR significantly.

If max G is so useless, why the high speed, high altitude F22 is designed for high agility ?
Same about stealth : why F22, able according to some fan like you to kill its ennemy before beeing seen has 2 x AIM9 ???
But it's not your first contradiction.

1- Once again, max G for aircraft isnot the deciding factor for agility. Just because 2 aircraft have the same max G limit doesn't mean they are equally agile.
2- about F-22 and AIM-9, i can ask you the same question, why a rifle able to kill enemy from extended range still have bayonet? isn't that a contradiction?

First Farnborough show, in 1986 : Rafale made a 360° turn in less than 15 seconds. It was a written milestone in the development agreement between Dassault and french DGA. 360°/15 s = 25°/sec.

Iam asking for a reputable source (aka not forum comments or blog like picard), if it is a milestone then you should be able to find a source from Dassault for it, or at the very least, give me a video with timing just like i did.
There are dozen video of Rafale turn on Youtube, find one where it finish 360° in 15 s

And ITR of a Delta is always far superior to STR (a quality/défault well know of all the Delta plane : their ability to move the nose quickly, but with a lost of energy. So a Delta pilot has to take the lead in the beginning of a fight, because after that it will lose faster its energy than a classical tailed plane. A classical aspect of the F16 vs M2000 trainings).

ITR of all airplane are better than their STR, not just delta wing aircraft.
Regarding the Mirage vs F-16 training in particular, F-16, in general, have terrible ITR because F-16 FBW limit its AoA significantly, therefore, the aircraft never reach its Clmax (the FBW was designed that way to aid the pilot in pulling STR)

Feel free to give me reputable source about RCS of the F35.

About what part? the fact that it is stealthy or the actual RCS value

Ah Ah Ah.... 40°/sec. And why not 50° ?

Because Maths:
80/2 = 40 simple as that

In static maybe .

The more cheap comments you make, the less respect you will get from others, an old man like you should know that.

pedal turn...... nothing more serious in stock ?

a pedal turn is a side way turn in post stall. Basically a yaw turn.

A customer lost ?

http://www.ekathimerini.com/228781/...vision-that-could-freeze-arms-sales-to-turkey

100 x F35 less ?

Not exactly F-35 fault when it is the US who doesn't want to sell their equipment

US Congress approved in principle on Thursday a draft bill on the US budget for 2019 national defense which includes a provision that would halt any sale of military equipment to Turkey until the Secretary of Defense submits a report on the US-Turkish relationship to the congressional defense committees.

 

[StealthFlanker]

A customer lost ?

http://www.ekathimerini.com/228781/...vision-that-could-freeze-arms-sales-to-turkey

100 x F35 less ?

Not exactly F-35 fault when it is the US who doesn't want to sell their equipment

US Congress approved in principle on Thursday a draft bill on the US budget for 2019 national defense which includes a provision that would halt any sale of military equipment to Turkey until the Secretary of Defense submits a report on the US-Turkish relationship to the congressional defense committees.

 

[Flame Thrower]

Well Gmax at a air show and G max during combat is completly different, add a couple of heavy stores like fuel tanks and this reduces for all 4.5 gen aircraft including Rafale, Rafale with full load probably can't go beyond 5-6G.

While F-35 is 9 capable wth ful internal load, so there is no comparison. Your Rafale will be gasping to turning while the F-35 will out turn it.

My friend correct me if I am wrong....

Combat maneuverability of a plane is tested with around 50% of the fuel and two wvr missie. This load is considered to test the maneuverability of fighter during dogfights.

Now plane also has to do extreme maneuvers to evade an incoming BVR missiles. Even during this time, heavy loads like bombs or fuel tanks will be ejected. Sure there are EW systems, but pilots are often trained to use EW systems and evasive maneuvers. No evasive maneuvers are done with heavy bombs or fuel tanks.

So, Maneuvers done during airshows (usually with 50% of fuel and smoke rockets resembling 2 wvr missiles) are worth considering. Usually all the skills and tricks are not shown, but they are worth considering.

Thus I rest my case.

 

[asianobserve]

Navy Receives Northrop-Built F-35 Electronic Warfare Simulator

The U.S. Navy has accepted delivery of a Northrop Grumman-built multispectral test platform designed to prepare the service branch’s F-35 aircraft for complex missions in electromagnetic spectrum environments.

Northrop said Tuesday it shipped the Combat Electromagnetic Environment Simulator, Signal Measurement System and the Synchronizer Controller System (CEESIM) to the Naval Air Warfare Center Weapons Division in Point Mogu, Calif.

CEESIM is designed to simulate multiple radio frequency emitters simultaneously and equipped with the Advanced Pulse Generation technology that works to generate electronic warfare mission scenarios.

SMS employs recording, signal measurement and analysis tools built to validate a test environment and examine the performance of a system.

SCS consists of threat radars, communications signals and electro-optical/infra-red signatures intended to program and execute an integrated training scenario.

http://blog.executivebiz.com/2018/0...-f-35-electronic-warfare-simulation-platform/

 

[BON PLAN]

ITR of all airplane are better than their STR, not just delta wing aircraft.
Regarding the Mirage vs F-16 training in particular, F-16, in general, have terrible ITR because F-16 FBW limit its AoA significantly

Delta planes are know to have a particulary high ITR but, after time, a reduce STR because of a lack of energy.
M2000 has a better ITR than F16. It's the sole option it has to win a duel : the beginning. After that M2000 degrades too much it's energy and F16 takes the lead. Rafale has a better aerodynamism than M2000 (closed coupled canards) and better T/W ratio, so it degrades lesser it's energy (F22 pilots knows that).

 

[BON PLAN]

Iam asking for a reputable source (aka not forum comments or blog like picard), if it is a milestone then you should be able to find a source from Dassault for it, or at the very least, give me a video with timing just like i did.
There are dozen video of Rafale turn on Youtube, find one where it finish 360° in 15 s

5 minutes research : See that
a 360° from 3.43 to 4.05 (= 22 seconds) BUT WITH 3 x 360° roll ! Difficult to give proper time to each roll. Saying 1sec to 1.5sec and add the penalty because the all roll can't be made at the same AoA...

 

[BON PLAN]

It came from a french air force new general (written in 2015, when he was colonel) :

Roll onset rate is determined by aircraft’s responsitivity to control inputs, which includes efficiency of control surfaces as well as roll inertia. Roll inertia itself is very sensitive to wing span and vertical location of aircraft’s center of mass relative to center of lift. Latter however is similar for most fighters, as they have to fulfill basic stability parameters to achieve controlled flight. Instantaneous turn rate is dependant on lift-to-weight ratio, approximated by wing loading, while acceleration can be determined by climb rate. Ability to sustain turn meanwhile can be approximated by thrust-to-weight ratio.

F-15 has very classical wing-tail aerodynamic configuration and wing span of over 13 meters. This results in comparatively sluggish transient performance (roll response at maximum Angle of Attack is poor), especially when coupled with large inertia due to heavy weight. Instantaneous turn rate is good due to the low wing loading of 278 kg/m2 at combat weight of 15.729 kg. Instantaneous turn rate is 25,5 deg/s and sustained turn rate is 12,85 deg/s.

F-16 is the only USAF fighter ever designed specifically to perform well in dogfight. F-16C has good thrust-to-weight ratio of around 1,2 at combat weight and good transient performance, but its turning ability is harmed by high wing loading (almost 400 kg/m2 at combat weight of 10.936 kg) and inability to reach 32 degrees of angle of attack it requires for maximum lift – widening of the nose for the larger radar resulted in unacceptable lack of directional stability at higher angles of attack, resulting in it being limited by flight control software to a maximum of 25,52 degrees. Sharp LERX and high degree of wing-body blending does result in large amount of body lift, and unlike statically stable F-15, horizontal tail surfaces add to lift when turning. Relatively low 40* wing sweep angle does result in comparatively low drag when turning. Instantaneous turn rate is 26 deg/s and sustained turn rate is 18 deg/s.

F-18 is another fighter that came out as a result of lightweight fighter competition. It does not have as good turn and transient performance as F-16 (it is limited to 7,5 g and its greater wingspan hurts roll performance), but is not AoA limited as much as F-16 is, being capable of achieving 50 degrees AoA. Combat weight is 13.505 kg, resulting in wing loading of 355 kg/m2 and thrust-to-weight ratio of 1,19.

F-22 is a replacement for F-15 and has similar aerodynamic configuration. Its instantaneous turn and pitch rates are better than those of the F-15 due to its more refined aerodynamics, particularly 70*-sweepback LERX which generates strong vortex over the wing, delaying air flow separation. Wing sweep is 48*, resulting in a lower drag when turning. It also has improved transient performance. Combat weight is 24.579 kg, with wing loading of 314 kg/m2 and thrust-to-weight ratio of 1,29. Instantaneous turn rate is 35 deg/s and sustained turn rate is 28 deg/s at 20.000 ft.

F-35 is allegedly an F-16 replacement, but its instantaneous turn rate is lower than F-16s due to higher wing loading and weight (18.270 kg and 428 kg/m2 at combat weight). High drag and comparably low thrust-to-weight ratio (1,07 at combat weight) mean that it cannot accelerate well, and also cannot sustain turn rate. Roll onset rate in level flight should be about as good if not better than F-16s, but roll performance at angle of attack is likely inferior to F-16s due to weaker vortices. Instantaneous turn rate is 26,5 deg/s and sustained turn rate is 11 deg/s.

Typhoon has acceptable instantaneous and sustained turn rates due to its low wing loading and high thrust-to-weight ratio, however its roll performance is lacking. Pitch rate is good as it has long moment arm canards, but canards do not help lift or wing control surface effectiveness so it may not be better than Rafale’s or Gripen’s. Comparably high wing sweep results in high drag when turning, but also allows excellent acceleration performance when combined with high thrust-to-weight ratio. Climb rate is 315 meters per second maximum, and 200+ meters per second in air policing configuration. Instantaneous turn rate is 35 deg/s and sustained turn rate is 27 deg/s.

Rafale has close coupled canards, LERX and anhedral wings. Vortexes created by canards and LERX keep air flow connected to the wings even at comparably high angles of attack, thus improving turn rate, improving wing responsiveness to control surface inputs, and keeping trailling-edge control surfaces effective, while wing-body blending means that it also has large amount of body lift while turning. Close coupled canards also cause vortex lift to start earlier, thus reducing drag for given lift. This results in excellent transient performance (roll onset and pitch onset rate) and excellent instantaneous turn rate, though sustained turn rate is lower than F-22s due to lower thrust-to-weight ratio. Climb rate is 305 meters per second maximum, implying marginally lower acceleration than Typhoon’s, and 250+ meters per second in air policing configuration. Instantaneous turn rate is 36 deg/s and sustained turn rate is 27 deg/s.

Gripen has mostly all aerodynamic advantages of Rafale, but lack of LERX and higher wing loading mean that its instantaneous rate is likey slightly lower. More importantly, canard dihedral and lack of wing anhedral result in lowered roll and roll onset rate. Sustained turn rate is harmed by very low thrust-to-weight ratio, as is acceleration, though low drag due to good aerodynamical configuration compensates for it somewhat. Climb rate is quoted as 254 meters per second maximum and 200+ meters per second in air policing configuration.

 

[StealthFlanker]

Delta planes are know to have a particulary high ITR but, after time, a reduce STR because of a lack of energy.
M2000 has a better ITR than F16. It's the sole option it has to win a duel : the beginning. After that M2000 degrades too much it's energy and F16 takes the lead. Rafale has a better aerodynamism than M2000 (closed coupled canards) and better T/W ratio, so it degrades lesser it's energy (F22 pilots knows that).

Mirage ITR is higher than F-16 because: F-16 can't reach its CLmax since Fbw limit its AoA with G-load. The fact that STR of delta aircraft aren't particularly high, has nothing to do with their T/W but rather the fact that Cl-alpha curve of delta wing is very shallow and not as steep as a straight wing, on the otherhand, delta wing will stall later, so they can always go to higher AoA to get higher Cl. But that only work for ITR. For STR, higher AoA mean higher drag, which means going higher AoA will harm your STR, but at lower AoA then obviously CL of straight wing is better. That why STR of F-16 is better.

5 minutes research : See that
a 360° from 3.43 to 4.05 (= 22 seconds) BUT WITH 3 x 360° roll ! Difficult to give proper time to each roll. Saying 1sec to 1.5sec and add the penalty because the all roll can't be made at the same AoA...

360/22 = average only 16.3°/sec STR
Even when discounted 4 seconds for roll, 360/(22-4) = average only 20°/sec STR
Not even remotely close to your claimed 25°/sec STR (25% slower basically).
Moreover, You claimed Rafale STR is 25°/sec based on the performer in Farnborough show, in 1986, so where is the video of that?

It came from a french air force new general (written in 2015, when he was colonel)

I can be 100% sure that he isn't a French air force general given how many laughable mistakes in that paragraph, more like he just copy paste some acronyms here and there, then put in some random numbers he finds on the internet together

Edit: ok, i just checked after writing my reply, turn out that paragraph came from Picard, no wonder it contains so many laughable and random values. If any of you may ask, no Picard isnot a French air force general, he is a Rafale fanboy with little touch with reality

Instantaneous turn rate is dependant on lift-to-weight ratio, approximated by wing loading

No, different airframe have different CLmax so Instantaneous turn rate cannot be approximated by wing loading unless two aircraft have the exact airframe.

Ability to sustain turn meanwhile can be approximated by thrust-to-weight ratio.

Once again, no
Sustain turn cannot be approximated by thrust-to-weight ratio, not in any shape or form. Thrust varied with altitude, speed and inlet pressure recovery. STR is also affected by drag, which change significantly with AoA and velocity. So STR cannot be approximated by thrust-to-weight ratio. Given that the quoted T/W on the internet is literally just static T/W (meaning the thurst of engine is at sea level , zero air speed, no inlet loss)

F-15 has very classical wing-tail aerodynamic configuration and wingspan of over 13 meters. This results in comparatively sluggish transient performance (roll response at maximum Angle of Attack is poor), especially when coupled with large inertia due to heavy weight. Instantaneous turn rate is good due to the low wing loading of 278 kg/m2 at combat weight of 15.729 kg. Instantaneous turn rate is 25,5 deg/s and sustained turn rate is 12,85 deg/s..

Simply laughable, anyone has access to F-15A/C manual will know that its STR is far bigger than 12.85°/sec, peak at over 20°/sec at Mach 0.7, sea level

F-15 manual doesn't state exact ITR, however with Clmax of 1.6 and no AoA limit, its ITR will be far better than F-16

F-16 is the only USAF fighter ever designed specifically to perform well in dogfight.Relatively low 40* wing sweep angle does result in comparatively low drag when turning. Instantaneous turn rate is 26 deg/s and sustained turn rate is 18 deg/s.

Once again, simply laughable
Anyone who have access to F-16 manual, will know that its Instantaneous turn rate peak at 24.9°/sec at Mach 0.55 while its sustained turn rate peak at around 22°/sec at around Mach 0.7

F-18 is another fighter that came out as a result of lightweight fighter competition. It does not have as good turn and transient performance as F-16 (it is limited to 7,5 g and its greater wingspan hurts roll performance), but is not AoA limited as much as F-16 is, being capable of achieving 50 degrees AoA. Combat weight is 13.505 kg, resulting in wing loading of 355 kg/m2 and thrust-to-weight ratio of 1,19.

actually, F-18 ITR is higher than F-16 at all speed, STR is better than F-16 at slow speed regime
so its post stall maneuver is also much better.
The main issue of F-18 is acceleration and STR at high speed regime.

F-22 is a replacement for F-15 and has similar aerodynamic configuration. Instantaneous turn rate is 35 deg/s and sustained turn rate is 28 deg/s at 20.000 ft.

I like the F-22 but that simply laughable, almost a child dream, i know this came from a video where an US colonel general talking about the F-22, but to be frank, he either mistaken between a sustained turn rate and a pedal turn in post stall situation (the aircraft is falling while maintaining a 28 degrees/sec nose rate) or he simply tries to spread propaganda nonsense. Either way, there is simply no way F-22 can sustain 28 deg/s or pull 35 deg/s at 20.000 ft.
F-22 KPP document shows that at 30.000 ft, Mach 0.9, it can sustain 3.7G, which is actually slightly less than a F-15 with DI=0 at the same altitude. There is absolutely no reason for the same F-22 to suddenly have double the STR of the same F-15 when altitude reduced to 20.000 ft. Not a chance in hell.

F-35 is allegedly an F-16 replacement, but its instantaneous turn rate is lower than F-16s due to higher wing loading and weight (18.270 kg and 428 kg/m2 at combat weight).

Absolute nonsense, F-35 has demonstrated far better ITR than F-16 in airshows, even without knowing those visual evidence , it is so simple to predict that F-35 ITR is better given that F-35 AoA is not limited with G-load like F-16 so F-35 Clmax will be much bigger (in fact, F-16 can't even reach Clmax, its AoA is limited to merely 15deg at 9G).

High drag and comparably low thrust-to-weight ratio (1,07 at combat weight) mean that it cannot accelerate well, and also cannot sustain turn rate. Roll onset rate in level flight should be about as good if not better than F-16s, but roll performance at angle of attack is likely inferior to F-16s due to weaker vortices.

Actually, F-35 subsonic acceleration is better than F-16, roll performer at high angle of attack is much better (given that F-35 can take advantage of post-stall maneuver, while F-16 can't

Instantaneous turn rate is 26,5 deg/s and sustained turn rate is 11 deg/s.

Typhoon has acceptable instantaneous and sustained turn rates due to its low wing loading and high thrust-to-weight ratio,Instantaneous turn rate is 35 deg/s and sustained turn rate is 27 deg/s.

Rafale has close coupled canards, LERX and anhedral wings. Vortexes created by canards and LERX keep air flow connected to the wings even at comparably high angles of attack, thus improving turn rate, improving wing responsiveness to control surface inputs, and keeping trailling-edge control surfaces effective, while wing-body blending means that it also has large amount of body lift while turning. Close coupled canards also cause vortex lift to start earlier, thus reducing drag for given lift. This results in excellent transient performance (roll onset and pitch onset rate) and excellent instantaneous turn rate, though sustained turn rate is lower than F-22s due to lower thrust-to-weight ratio. Climb rate is 305 meters per second maximum, implying marginally lower acceleration than Typhoon’s, and 250+ meters per second in air policing configuration. Instantaneous turn rate is 36 deg/s and sustained turn rate is 27 deg/s.

Gripen has mostly all aerodynamic advantages of Rafale, but lack of LERX and higher wing loading mean that its instantaneous rate is likey slightly lower. More importantly, canard dihedral and lack of wing anhedral result in lowered roll and roll onset rate. Sustained turn rate is harmed by very low thrust-to-weight ratio, as is acceleration, though low drag due to good aerodynamical configuration compensates for it somewhat. Climb rate is quoted as 254 meters per second maximum and 200+ meters per second in air policing configuration.

Those are literally just random number without any supporting evidence anywhere whatsoever, i won't even bother looking at his words soup

 

[StealthFlanker]

Combat maneuverability of a plane is tested with around 50% of the fuel and two wvr missie. This load is considered to test the maneuverability of fighter during dogfights.

Now plane also has to do extreme maneuvers to evade an incoming BVR missiles. Even during this time, heavy loads like bombs or fuel tanks will be ejected. Sure there are EW systems, but pilots are often trained to use EW systems and evasive maneuvers. No evasive maneuvers are done with heavy bombs or fuel tanks.

So, Maneuvers done during airshows (usually with 50% of fuel and smoke rockets resembling 2 wvr missiles) are worth considering. Usually all the skills and tricks are not shown, but they are worth considering.

Thus I rest my case.

The issue arise when the two aircraft you compared have different combat radius.
For example:
Su-27 have more than double the combat radius of F-104, so it doesn't actually make any sense to compare their agility at the same percentages of fuel. If the target area is close enough that F-104 can fly without external fuel tank, then Su-27 need around half internal fuel tank. If the target is far enough that Su-27 need full internal tank then F-104 will need external fuel tank. Once, they reach target area, F-104 can eject its external fuel tank, but it still left with 100% internal fuel whereas, Su-27 may be at 50-60% internal fuel. In short, aircraft with longer max combat radius will always need less percentage of fuel tank filled to reach the same distance. Comparing them all at 50% fuel is actually rather unfair.

 

[BON PLAN]

360/22 = average only 16.3°/sec STR
Even when discounted 4 seconds for roll, 360/(22-4) = average only 20°/sec STR
Not even remotely close to your claimed 25°/sec STR (25% slower basically).
Moreover, You claimed Rafale STR is 25°/sec based on the performer in Farnborough show, in 1986, so where is the video of that?

360/22 is BS and you know that.
1 sec by roll is very optimistic
You (and I !) can't estimate the time spent during the roll, because the plane didn't turn so high at this moment.
But we are near the target. Something like that with the flying stealthy turkey?

Let me some more time.

 

[BON PLAN]

Edit: ok, i just checked after writing my reply, turn out that paragraph came from Picard, no wonder it contains so many laughable and random values. If any of you may ask, no Picard isnot a French air force general, he is a Rafale fanboy with little touch with reality

I only know it by its avatar, and it's not Picard. But why not?
He gave us some very precise data about some french intervention during Lybia war, so he seemed very well informed.

But You, you are not a Flanker, and are not stealthy. so....

 

[BON PLAN]

F-18 ITR is higher than F-16 at all speed, STR is better than F-16 at slow speed regime
so its post stall maneuver is also much better.

FA18 or SH18?
F16 is harder to fight in WVR, so it's very surprising !

 

[BON PLAN]

F-35 has demonstrated far better ITR than F-16 in airshows, even without knowing those visual evidence , it is so simple to predict that F-35 ITR is better given that F-35 AoA is not limited with G-load like F-16 so F-35 Clmax will be much bigger

Better ITR maybe. Better STR no.

And it's not because you have a greater AoA than you have a best STR.
AoA 90° = you fall.
AoA 30°, you lose your energy in a few seconds.

 

[BON PLAN]

Actually, F-35 subsonic acceleration is better than F-16, roll performer at high angle of attack is much better (given that F-35 can take advantage of post-stall maneuver, while F-16 can't

F35 subsonic acc is better? NO !
Roll performer at high AoA is useless in air combat. You can't use that to argue the plane is agile.
It's like the Pugatchev Cobra : nice in aero show, but a motionless plane in the sky is peace of cake.

 

[asianobserve]

Israel says it is the first country to use US-made F-35 in combat

Israel is the first country to have used the U.S.-made F-35 stealth fighter in combat, the Israeli air force chief said on Tuesday in remarks carried by the military's official Twitter account.

Local media further quoted Major-General Amikam Norkin as saying in a speech to the chiefs of 20 foreign air forces convening in Israel: "We are flying the F-35 all over the Middle East and have already attacked twice on two different fronts".

Norkin also displayed a photograph of an Israeli F-35 overflying Beirut, local media said.

Manufactured by Lockheed Martin Corp, the F-35 is also known as the Joint Strike Fighter and, in Israel, by its Hebrew name "Adir" (Mighty).

Israel was the first country outside the United States to acquire the F-35. In December 2016, it received the first two planes out of an order of 50. According to Israeli media, at least nine have been delivered so far.

Israel says it has carried out scores of strikes in Syria against suspected Iranian emplacements or arms transfers to Hezbollah guerrillas in neighboring Lebanon.

Its air forces is also widely believed to have operated over against Islamist militants in the Egyptian Sinai and Hamas arms smugglers in Sudan.

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/05/22/israel-says-first-country-to-use-u-s-made-f-35-in-combat.html

 

[asianobserve]

UK F-35 pilots get in gear to bring the joint strike fighter to Britain

MARINE AIR STATION BEAUFORT, S.C. — At a U.S. Marine Corps base in South Carolina, newly minted F-35 pilots from the Royal Air Force are making their final preparations for a transatlantic flight that will finally bring the joint strike fighter permanently to the United Kingdom.

But the work won’t stop once the first four jets from 617 Squadron arrive at RAF Marham in early June, or even when another five F-35Bs transfer to the base by the end of the summer. RAF pilots and maintainers will have to hustle to hit a key milestone — initial operational capability — by the end of the year.

The good news is that they will have a head start. The June flight from Marine Corps Air Station Beaufort to Marham is set to happen anytime between June 5 and June 10, weather permitting.

That’s a full two months ahead of schedule, said Wing Cmdr. Scott “Mox” Williams, the U.K.’s senior national representative at Beaufort. Williams has been tapped to lead 207 Squadron, another F-35B squadron, when it reconstitutes in 2019.

xxx

During the build-up to IOC, F-35 pilots will fly missions in the full mission simulator as well as in live flights in local training areas. They will also gain experience in working with other U.K. fighter aircraft such as the Eurofighter Typhoon and Panavia Tornado.

But perhaps most importantly, the U.K. pilots will finally have a chance to learn and practice all of the all of tactics unique to the RAF, which will exclusively be taught at Marham ahead of IOC. That makes those extra two months at home station even more important, Williams said.

The United Kingdom has committed to buying 48 F-35s, although it has said it will eventually order 138 joint strike fighters.

It will field its F-35B inventory aboard its newest Queen Elizabeth-class carriers, with the first sea-trial aboard the Queen Elizabeth slated for later this year. Those flights will be piloted by RAF test pilots based either at Eglin Air Force Base or Naval Air Station Patuxent River, Williams said.

Britain’s carrier fleet ceased to exist in 2011 as the country retired its Harriers. However, Williams said that experience with other short-takeoff-and-vertical-landing aircraft can at times be a hindrance to pilots learning the F-35 — something the RAF has termed “Harrier baggage.”

“I speak with experience, because I flew Harriers from the U.K. carriers on a number of occasions. A lot of that institutional knowledge is specific to the Harrier, the Harrier’s handling, the Harrier’s performance capabilities and the actual carrier itself,” he said.

“Nobody can treat this airplane like a Harrier replacement. If you do that, you potentially are only going to unlock a very small proportion of its full capabilities.”

https://www.defensenews.com/air/201...to-bring-the-joint-strike-fighter-to-britain/

 

[BON PLAN]

Israel says it is the first country to use US-made F-35 in combat

Israel is the first country to have used the U.S.-made F-35 stealth fighter in combat, the Israeli air force chief said on Tuesday in remarks carried by the military's official Twitter account.

Local media further quoted Major-General Amikam Norkin as saying in a speech to the chiefs of 20 foreign air forces convening in Israel: "We are flying the F-35 all over the Middle East and have already attacked twice on two different fronts".

Norkin also displayed a photograph of an Israeli F-35 overflying Beirut, local media said.

Manufactured by Lockheed Martin Corp, the F-35 is also known as the Joint Strike Fighter and, in Israel, by its Hebrew name "Adir" (Mighty).

Israel was the first country outside the United States to acquire the F-35. In December 2016, it received the first two planes out of an order of 50. According to Israeli media, at least nine have been delivered so far.

Israel says it has carried out scores of strikes in Syria against suspected Iranian emplacements or arms transfers to Hezbollah guerrillas in neighboring Lebanon.

Its air forces is also widely believed to have operated over against Islamist militants in the Egyptian Sinai and Hamas arms smugglers in Sudan.

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/05/22/israel-says-first-country-to-use-u-s-made-f-35-in-combat.html

Israel seems to be the first to use its US plane in combat. F16, now F35.

 

[asianobserve]

Israel seems to be the first to use its US plane in combat. F16, now F35.

And F-15. The IAF received its first batch of F-15As and F-15Bs in 1976 using them first for training and to develop fighting doctrines. It took the IAF three years in 1979 before they used the F-15s in combat.