DRDO, PSU and Private Defence Sector News

Samej Jangir

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This is the article

And page number 2413 of drdo thread
Deliberate discussions have been done no point to bring it here again
But I know u won't as all u want is to draw conclusion on basis of idea u have
Go ahead
It is under paywall but I managed to read it by stopping the page from fully loading. Even this article says that the idea is to make DRDO focus on high tech R&D rather than low tech ones like drones or product management, production of units etc.

It is pretty logical that DRDO must focus on subsystems development and toolings development and simply hand over the TOT to production agencies. Also, the drone development as displayed in defence expo by DRDO could have been done by private companies as it was just about coding, image processing etc and could be done by others too
 

jai jaganath

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It is under paywall but I managed to read it by stopping the page from fully loading. Even this article says that the idea is to make DRDO focus on high tech R&D rather than low tech ones like drones or product management, production of units etc.

It is pretty logical that DRDO must focus on subsystems development and toolings development and simply hand over the TOT to production agencies. Also, the drone development as displayed in defence expo by DRDO could have been done by private companies as it was just about coding, image processing etc and could be done by others too
Point is to divert drdo to only strategic systems and other things should be responsibility of pvt companies
We are not advanced nation like usa or china where non strategic systems have been developed and a huge mic running it introducing further iterations and owning the particular segment

Wars are not fought with strategic systems only
U need tanks ifv artillery helis aircrafts pgms tbm AD and many more stuffs these fall under non strategic systems u can exclude aircrafts but still everything is required to win decisively
If we would have had running mic and 1000s of orders then it's fine to shift drdo to strategic systems and the production companies can make developments in these sectors
But right now this decision will backfire as pvt cos and even psu will prefer screwdriver over rnd as existing industry is absent
 

Samej Jangir

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Point is to divert drdo to only strategic systems and other things should be responsibility of pvt companies
We are not advanced nation like usa or china where non strategic systems have been developed and a huge mic running it introducing further iterations and owning the particular segment

Wars are not fought with strategic systems only
U need tanks ifv artillery helis aircrafts pgms tbm AD and many more stuffs these fall under non strategic systems u can exclude aircrafts but still everything is required to win decisively
If we would have had running mic and 1000s of orders then it's fine to shift drdo to strategic systems and the production companies can make developments in these sectors
But right now this decision will backfire as pvt cos and even psu will prefer screwdriver over rnd as existing industry is absent
First of all, IFVs can be done by private companies. DRDO only needs to provide the material tech like nitride steel and subsystems like fire controls, night vision etc. The mechanical work like design, welding, weight balance etc will be done by industry. Helicopters also come under similar domain. DRDO only needs to develop engine and subsystems like fire controls, FBW, radars, missile integration etc. In PGMs, DRDO only need to provide the homing/targeting technology. Artillery does not need DRDO at all.

As for aircraft, especially fighter jets, it is strategic. Air defence, BMD are all highly strategic along with missiles, nuclear technology, seekers, satellites, SLVs, submarines, engines etc. These need to be completely made by DRDO/ISRO or other R&D organisations.

Indian industry may not be advanced but things like designing, coding etc does not need advanced equipments. It just need talented people from top institutions being recruited at high pay by startups. Why should DRDO use manpower to do these work? The same DRDO manpower has access to extremely sophisticated equipments and laboratories for making much more strategic technology.
 

jai jaganath

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First of all, IFVs can be done by private companies. DRDO only needs to provide the material tech like nitride steel and subsystems like fire controls, night vision etc. The mechanical work like design, welding, weight balance etc will be done by industry. Helicopters also come under similar domain. DRDO only needs to develop engine and subsystems like fire controls, FBW, radars, missile integration etc. In PGMs, DRDO only need to provide the homing/targeting technology. Artillery does not need DRDO at all.

As for aircraft, especially fighter jets, it is strategic. Air defence, BMD are all highly strategic along with missiles, nuclear technology, seekers, satellites, SLVs, submarines, engines etc. These need to be completely made by DRDO/ISRO or other R&D organisations.

Indian industry may not be advanced but things like designing, coding etc does not need advanced equipments. It just need talented people from top institutions being recruited at high pay by startups. Why should DRDO use manpower to do these work? The same DRDO manpower has access to extremely sophisticated equipments and laboratories for making much more strategic technology.
U r contradicting ur own statement mate
What u have written wrt ifv helis and pgms are critical susb systems and as u said it has to be developed by drdo
But if we go by article and the meaning of it is completely taking away those systems from drdo domain and make them focus on strategic systems

Things like fire controls, night vision, FBW, radars, missile integration, engines and homing tech and many more numerous things are critical but not strategic

And moreover our present industry can't do that coz we don't have mature industry and well oiled supply chain
Even their perspective is very small and definitely baring few cos most of them will prefer screwdriver products as their understanding and expectation from military is very low
 

Blademaster

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It's not under pay wall dumbass
I don't know what problem u have got with your internet
First of all I am not entitled to ur orders "explain again"
It's u who forgot the matter idiot
So I posted the page number coz repeated discussion add no value to the thread
I have written a post and also anupu ji has written a detailed explanation
But retards like u know only to pick baseless issue and repeatedly posting it
My last post on this
And stop giving ur opinion on others when u have no idea better keep quite or hit ur head somewhere else
I can't do if retards don't want read and understand even when spoon feeding is done
:bplease: Thank you for proving beyond all shadow of doubt that you know jackshit and are making wild baseless claims. You couldn't even be bothered to post that article or anupu's post to back up your claims so we could see how you arrive at your blackpilled conclusion.

And who are you to tell me about my opinions? I am not the one who got banned twice for blackpilling.
 

jai jaganath

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:bplease: Thank you for proving beyond all shadow of doubt that you know jackshit and are making wild baseless claims. You couldn't even be bothered to post that article or anupu's post to back up your claims so we could see how you arrive at your blackpilled conclusion.

And who are you to tell me about my opinions? I am not the one who got banned twice for blackpilling.
Idiot why are u in such a hurry to prove urself a dumbass
U don't have an iota of idea why did I ask u to visit page number 2413
Everything has to be spoon feed like 4 year old baby
Use atleast 2 neuron cells to visit the page and read anupu's post or the article posted there
I am not here to spoon feed u
U have anything specific then it's worth discussing

And pls refrain from guessing and assuming things u don't have that capacity and intellect, and moreover it sounds way too stupid
@mods pls move these unnecessary posts to chit chat
 

Samej Jangir

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U r contradicting ur own statement mate
What u have written wrt ifv helis and pgms are critical susb systems and as u said it has to be developed by drdo
But if we go by article and the meaning of it is completely taking away those systems from drdo domain and make them focus on strategic systems

Things like fire controls, night vision, FBW, radars, missile integration, engines and homing tech and many more numerous things are critical but not strategic

And moreover our present industry can't do that coz we don't have mature industry and well oiled supply chain
Even their perspective is very small and definitely baring few cos most of them will prefer screwdriver products as their understanding and expectation from military is very low
Just develop the subsystems and allow its usage across various platforms by the industry. That is the idea of DRDO. Pretty much all electronics, semiconductor, radar, explosives and complex engines are strategic but their modification to be used in different systems are not strategic.

There is a difference between subsystem and whole system. Subsystem like night vision can be used in rifles, drones, tanks, IFVs, helicopters, fighter jets etc. Same with radars, missile integration, seekers etc. These are strategic as they are used across various equipments. But the equipments themselves are not strategic. In case of engines, heavy diesel engines like the ones used in ships, light weight high powered engines for drones, turbofans, turboprops are also strategic.

DRDO should hand over night vision tech & let industry use/fit it to different equipment as needed. Same with engines, radars, missiles etc
 

Blademaster

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Idiot why are u in such a hurry to prove urself a dumbass
U don't have an iota of idea why did I ask u to visit page number 2413
Everything has to be spoon feed like 4 year old baby
Use atleast 2 neuron cells to visit the page and read anupu's post or the article posted there
I am not here to spoon feed u
U have anything specific then it's worth discussing

And pls refrain from guessing and assuming things u don't have that capacity and intellect, and moreover it sounds way too stupid
@mods pls move these unnecessary posts to chit chat
Crying off to the mods already?? I did visit pg 2413 and it didn't back up your conclusions whatsoever. You are basically asking me to make the jump without any supporting facts.
 

jai jaganath

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Just develop the subsystems and allow its usage across various platforms by the industry. That is the idea of DRDO. Pretty much all electronics, semiconductor, radar, explosives and complex engines are strategic but their modification to be used in different systems are not strategic.

There is a difference between subsystem and whole system. Subsystem like night vision can be used in rifles, drones, tanks, IFVs, helicopters, fighter jets etc. Same with radars, missile integration, seekers etc. These are strategic as they are used across various equipments. But the equipments themselves are not strategic. In case of engines, heavy diesel engines like the ones used in ships, light weight high powered engines for drones, turbofans, turboprops are also strategic.

DRDO should hand over night vision tech & let industry use/fit it to different equipment as needed. Same with engines, radars, missiles etc
That's what we are trying to say here sirji
Subsystems used across various equipments are termed as critical rather strategic in Indian context atleast
In our context strategic systems include nuclear delivery mechanism, ballistic missiles, submarines, etc.

Aim of drdo is same as u have posted that is to develop these critical techs and transfer to industry from development stage itself that's why concept of DcPP was introduced

All they want is to provide all necessary critical subsystems to industry and help them reach mass production standards by military's orders and support from msme

For that we need orders and time to reach that stage where pvt cos have complete command on techs on basis of which they can derive iterations and put it in various equipments

Such reforms now will undo all the efforts that has been put by DcPP methodology
Not against the reform but against the timing
Anyways we are making a lot of assumptions let some pages of report to get revealed to further discuss
 

Samej Jangir

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That's what we are trying to say here sirji
Subsystems used across various equipments are termed as critical rather strategic in Indian context atleast
In our context strategic systems include nuclear delivery mechanism, ballistic missiles, submarines, etc.

Aim of drdo is same as u have posted that is to develop these critical techs and transfer to industry from development stage itself that's why concept of DcPP was introduced

All they want is to provide all necessary critical subsystems to industry and help them reach mass production standards by military's orders and support from msme

For that we need orders and time to reach that stage where pvt cos have complete command on techs on basis of which they can derive iterations and put it in various equipments

Such reforms now will undo all the efforts that has been put by DcPP methodology
Not against the reform but against the timing
Anyways we are making a lot of assumptions let some pages of report to get revealed to further discuss
Why are repeating same thing again and again? Did I not just say DRDO should not indulge in non sophisticated activities? What does that got to do with orders? Why DRDO involved itself in ATAGS, Tata WhAP, drone exhibition? Which of these have anything to do with orders, criticality or strategic nature?
 

jai jaganath

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Why are repeating same thing again and again? Did I not just say DRDO should not indulge in non sophisticated activities? What does that got to do with orders? Why DRDO involved itself in ATAGS, Tata WhAP, drone exhibition? Which of these have anything to do with orders, criticality or strategic nature?
I am stating that on the basis of limited info on committee report which has been given by few journalists they are planning to move drdo to completely strategic systems and leave the defence equipments rnd to only pvt cos apart from production
Drdo aimed for maturing pvt cos using DcPP method
But until now we aren't able to bear it's fruits bcoz of absence of orders
Atags and whap has to do with orders
With huge orders these things can be made better and even provide money and encouragement for rnd to pvt cos
DRDO had to involve itself coz the pvt cos during that time weren't capable of developing these systems similarly they are currently doing with Mahindra whap
Today kalyani is a experienced artillery manufacturer bcoz of many techs they acquired from foreign cos and export orders
@Chinmoy can explain better wrt kalyani

If we are on same side then no need to argue further
 

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