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Johny_Baba

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Thing is Tata,Kirloskar and Mahindra have been manufacturing Engines. But when the question came of producing heavy tipper engines - Both relied on benz/cummins/navstar. I am afraid only CVRDE has competence which could undertake 1500hp engine development among Indian companies. In 2020 we heard prototype was complete with some hot run tests. We haven't heard anything new about its status as of yet.

As per @Chinmoy 1500HP was realized, they were developing 1800HP as anticipate mission creep way back in 2021. Given now Armata has compact 2000 HP engine. I guess another project shall now be needed to up rating from 1800HP to 2000 HP.. if cvrde does not want army to fail their project again in favor of russian.


View attachment 222572
:yawn: or maybe, we can try to put HAL HTSE-1200 turboshaft which generated about 1600 shaft horsepower maximum on Arjun; something similar solution to that to Abrams and T-80

I mean c'mon at least try to do something instead of khali haath baithe rehna
 

SwordOfDarkness

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:yawn: or maybe, we can try to put HAL HTSE-1200 turboshaft which generated about 1600 shaft horsepower maximum on Arjun; something similar solution to that to Abrams and T-80

I mean c'mon at least try to do something instead of khali haath baithe rehna
Biggest issue with doing that is idling power. In heli, you are rarely idling. In tanks, you are idling half the time. Reducing power consumption in idle is the biggest issue, one of the reasons why T80 never worked that well.
 

Azaad

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Biggest issue with doing that is idling power. In heli, you are rarely idling. In tanks, you are idling half the time. Reducing power consumption in idle is the biggest issue, one of the reasons why T80 never worked that well.
The Abrams seems to have accomplished that . Nor sure which vintage ? Why can't we ?
 

SwordOfDarkness

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The Abrams seems to have accomplished that . Nor sure which vintage ? Why can't we ?
Abrams when it started out, had that issue also. It is only now after decades of improving that engine that they have gotten it down to comparable to regular engines (still not as good).

Only advantage of turboshaft over piston engines in tanks is that they tend to have better torque bands, but that problem can be worked around and is not worth the trouble.

Big advantage of piston engines (if you bother to do, as US army is now doing with ACE program) is that it is easily scalable. 6 piston, 8 piston, 12 piston and boom, same basic engine can power your entire fleet of armoured vehicles from 20 tons to 50 tons.
 

karn

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The Abrams seems to have accomplished that . Nor sure which vintage ? Why can't we ?
Naah they have the same issue . The logistic strain is well known . It has 8hour fuel for running the turbine . They are trying to add APUs to mitigate it but most tankers won't turn off their engines in any risky scenario since restarting the engines takes minutes .
 

Azaad

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Abrams when it started out, had that issue also. It is only now after decades of improving that engine that they have gotten it down to comparable to regular engines (still not as good).

Only advantage of turboshaft over piston engines in tanks is that they tend to have better torque bands, but that problem can be worked around and is not worth the trouble.

Big advantage of piston engines (if you bother to do, as US army is now doing with ACE program) is that it is easily scalable. 6 piston, 8 piston, 12 piston and boom, same basic engine can power your entire fleet of armoured vehicles from 20 tons to 50 tons.
Naah they have the same issue . The logistic strain is well known . It has 8hour fuel for running the turbine . They are trying to add APUs to mitigate it but most tankers won't turn off their engines in any risky scenario since restarting the engines takes minutes .
What about fuel consumption ? The US is actually studying equipping the Abrams & future tanks with modular N reactors . I'm hunting the article. Perhaps you guys can help .
 

SwordOfDarkness

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What about fuel consumption ? The US is actually studying equipping the Abrams & future tanks with modular N reactors . I'm hunting the article. Perhaps you guys can help .
I dont think thats true. See the ACE program, I believe that is the piston engine they are switching to.

Nuclear reactor for a tank seems like an unnecessary complication, not to say inefficient. How will it speed up and down suddenly? Nuclear reactors take time to ramp up and go down in power production.
 

Azaad

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I dont think thats true. See the ACE program, I believe that is the piston engine they are switching to.

Nuclear reactor for a tank seems like an unnecessary complication, not to say inefficient. How will it speed up and down suddenly? Nuclear reactors take time to ramp up and go down in power production.
That's what you think buddy. Future warfare in terns of air cavalry viz - hptrs & conventional tanks will be unmanned. That's a given. Yet do you read much about it ? No. What you read are fanciful stuff as given below. Need I add comments or can you guys think for yourselves without resorting to western papers & publications. Think of them as a smokescreen.

 

Johny_Baba

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Biggest issue with doing that is idling power. In heli, you are rarely idling. In tanks, you are idling half the time. Reducing power consumption in idle is the biggest issue, one of the reasons why T80 never worked that well.
Abrams when it started out, had that issue also. It is only now after decades of improving that engine that they have gotten it down to comparable to regular engines (still not as good).

Only advantage of turboshaft over piston engines in tanks is that they tend to have better torque bands, but that problem can be worked around and is not worth the trouble.

Big advantage of piston engines (if you bother to do, as US army is now doing with ACE program) is that it is easily scalable. 6 piston, 8 piston, 12 piston and boom, same basic engine can power your entire fleet of armoured vehicles from 20 tons to 50 tons.
Well i think the ruusis have already figured it out well enough that they have started BOTH refurbishing their T-80s in storage with modern equipments as well as fresh production of current standard T-80s with same; so if they can do it we sure can, and we sure should try our best with whatever we have in hand.
 

raju1982

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That's what you think buddy. Future warfare in terns of air cavalry viz - hptrs & conventional tanks will be unmanned. That's a given. Yet do you read much about it ? No. What you read are fanciful stuff as given below. Need I add comments or can you guys think for yourselves without resorting to western papers & publications. Think of them as a smokescreen.

US companies working on compact nuclear reactor.
 

Shuturmurg

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I had seen it coming ..
KF21 despite being nothig infront of F-35 , still contained too substantial tech to be shared with "bin pende ka Lota+ momin mulk" like Indonesia. Even UAE deal won't go through. Maybe only jets for thee.
Korea is going to do all the work, UAE is just going to pay money and buy. KF21 might. not be as stealthy as F-35 and F-22 but I think should be comparable to J-20 and till "tempest" and french 5.5/6th gen jets come out (sometime around 2040), KF-21 will be most advanced jet available to majority of world since US has so many export restrictions on its own jets.
 

NutCracker

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Korea is going to do all the work, UAE is just going to pay money and buy. KF21 might. not be as stealthy as F-35 and F-22 but I think should be comparable to J-20 and till "tempest" and french 5.5/6th gen jets come out (sometime around 2040), KF-21 will be most advanced jet available to majority of world since US has so many export restrictions on its own jets.
Yes , despite nonDSI intake it's geometrical stealth be quite good .
There might be some clause saying that it should always fly with luneburg lens unless literal war is happening and SK technicians on UAE/INDO airbase will maintain these jets.
 

charlie

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Total garbage. Tata Motors spend 4% that also recently increased. M&M

What is Tata Motors, L&T's revenue to R&D % compared to BMW, Lockheed. Tata Motors spend even less % than JLR! How much Reliance, Mahindea etc spend? Much less. Most of the Indian comlanies just started inceeasing R&D spending recently.

One of the reason why DRDO, ISRO etc falls shorts of expectation is lacl of support from industry. Why NASA, DARPA gets everything done by Lockheed , Boeing, Raytheon and many other MSMEs.
for defence the R&D funding always comes from the government for private companies, they don’t use their own capital, check out both US and European history. one way or other government did the hand holding.

check out Space x history how government intervene at the last moment or the company would have sunk

You can glorify drdo as much as you want but the 7 member committee they put up is for a reason. To Improve the first thing is to accept the mistake which is happening in modi government.

it’s only natural you will see more things going to private industry rather then drdo or psu.
 

Corvus Splendens

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Korea is going to do all the work, UAE is just going to pay money and buy. KF21 might. not be as stealthy as F-35 and F-22 but I think should be comparable to J-20 and till "tempest" and french 5.5/6th gen jets come out (sometime around 2040), KF-21 will be most advanced jet available to majority of world since US has so many export restrictions on its own jets.
Tempest is scrapped. It's GCAP now with UK, Italy and Japan participating.
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1694847228854.png
 

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