DRDO, PSU and Private Defence Sector News

[Lonewarrior]

@Lonewarrior @porky_kicker whats role of the FCG & MHD in the EMP bomb??

So let's start with EMP.

Of all the mumbo jumbo weapons EMP is theoretically the easiest to understand; electromagnetic induction in any conductor can create electric current. The same way wireless charger of phones work, they create an EM field and if the phone is in the vicinity of that field then an electric current is generated in the phone which is used to charge it. Increase the intensity of EM field, the induced electric current increases. Increase the intensity of EM field as much as you can, and the induced electric current becomes so much that it "fries" circuits.

But practically it's one of toughest weapon to create. Why? Because of good ol' SWaP constraints. When you'll try to create a powerful electromagnetic field using traditional methods like permanent magnets or coil wrapped around a soft iron core you'll need to pump in exponentially high amount of electric current in that system or you'll need a huge permanent magnet...both of which are impractical for a weapon.

So here comes cheat codes like capacitor banks, FCG, MHD; these can generate immense EM pulses without needing the Size Weight and Power requirements of traditional methods. In FCG or Flux Compression Generator the magnetic flux lines of a permanent magnets is "compressed" using a high voltage electromagnetic field and after a certain point the magnetic field lines become so much compressed that the burst out to their uncompressed state and while doing so generates a high EM pulse. The process is then repeated from start. As for MHD or Magnetohydrodynamics it's simply the interaction between magnetic field and plasma - ionised gas (the "fluid"). It can also be used for compression and high power generation.


This was the basic understanding of how these things works. Now DFI-PK will tell you how exactly to make one in your garage.

 

[Vamsi]

So let's start with EMP.

Of all the mumbo jumbo weapons EMP is theoretically the easiest to understand; electromagnetic induction in any conductor can create electric current. The same way wireless charger of phones work, they create an EM field and if the phone is in the vicinity of that field then an electric current is generated in the phone which is used to charge it. Increase the intensity of EM field, the induced electric current increases. Increase the intensity of EM field as much as you can, and the induced electric current becomes so much that it "fries" circuits.

But practically it's one of toughest weapon to create. Why? Because of good ol' SWaP constraints. When you'll try to create a powerful electromagnetic field using traditional methods like permanent magnets or coil wrapped around a soft iron core you'll need to pump in exponentially high amount of electric current in that system or you'll need a huge permanent magnet...both of which are impractical for a weapon.

So here comes cheat codes like capacitor banks, FCG, MHD; these can generate immense EM pulses without needing the Size Weight and Power requirements of traditional methods. In FCG or Flux Compression Generator the magnetic flux lines of a permanent magnets is "compressed" using a high voltage electromagnetic field and after a certain point the magnetic field lines become so much compressed that the burst out to their uncompressed state and while doing so generates a high EM pulse. The process is then repeated from start. As for MHD or Magnetohydrodynamics it's simply the interaction between magnetic field and plasma - ionised gas (the "fluid"). It can also be used for compression and high power generation.


This was the basic understanding of how these things works. Now DFI-PK will tell you how exactly to make one in your garage.

So they use the MHD to produce the GWs of power required for the HPM device ???

 

[Lonewarrior]

So they use the MHD to produce the GWs of power required for the HPM device ???

"So they may use the MHD to produce the GWs of power required for the HPM device ???"

There you go, MHD (it's more of a field of study than a particular technology) is one of the many ways of generating high power input for an EMP

 

[Chinmoy]

Something to do with economy?

Yes.

The top one is inflation graph of Turkey and the below one is of India. If you would consider the graph, the moment our inflation rate has gone past 10, we had seen change in government. Worst being 1996 to 99 where we have seen 5 regime change in 3 years. Inflation of 2010 is one major factor of 2014 regime change.

Now coming to 2022, inflation rate of Turkey hit 72% against our 7%. But even then GoI came under immense pressure of inflation hike. Now imagine the inflation going past 10%. People who are asking that why we can't spend like Turkey, would ask for Government blood if that happens.

So a nation and its government is shaped just like what its citizens or common people want them to be like.

 

[Chinmoy]

So they use the MHD to produce the GWs of power required for the HPM device ???

MHD has nothing to do with HPM primarily. It is more about the study of magnetic field flow or magnetic wave produced in a conductive liquid medium when magnetic lines pass or flow through it.

 

[Corvus Splendens]

 

[Hari Sud]

DRDO is a lame duck organization which achieved hardly anything in last 50 years. Big names like missiles, fighters and electronic devices took generation to develop. Partly it is the competence of people and partly it operates like a government department where responsibility, accountability and discipline is missing.

To become an effective defence research centre, it has to be privatized and handed over to somebody else to run it with efficiency. Government should sponsor projects with it with money and time frame. Lack of achievements of any department should be dealt with as a discipline issue or the department dismantled completely. Hiring and firing should be made easy with lack of productivity as one reason for firing. Other procedural changes to be made include reduction of government type of approval bureaucracy & processes where anything worthwhile has to go thru the approval of 40 officials/Babus before it could ever be implemented.

Other changes include retiring of people just waiting for retirement pension etc. etc.

The governments cannot do all the changes but private sector can, hence implement these.

 

[SwordOfDarkness]

DRDO is a lame duck organization which achieved hardly anything in last 50 years. Big names like missiles, fighters and electronic devices took generation to develop. Partly it is the competence of people and partly it operates like a government department where responsibility, accountability and discipline is missing.

To become an effective defence research centre, it has to be privatized and handed over to somebody else to run it with efficiency. Government should sponsor projects with it with money and time frame. Lack of achievements of any department should be dealt with as a discipline issue or the department dismantled completely. Hiring and firing should be made easy with lack of productivity as one reason for firing. Other procedural changes to be made include reduction of government type of approval bureaucracy & processes where anything worthwhile has to go thru the approval of 40 officials/Babus before it could ever be implemented.

Other changes include retiring of people just waiting for retirement pension etc. etc.

The governments cannot do all the changes but private sector can, hence implement these.

"Privatise DRDO" is the dumbest argument that is thrown up wrt improving defense research.

 

[Aniruddha Mulay]

DRDO is a lame duck organization which achieved hardly anything in last 50 years. Big names like missiles, fighters and electronic devices took generation to develop. Partly it is the competence of people and partly it operates like a government department where responsibility, accountability and discipline is missing.

To become an effective defence research centre, it has to be privatized and handed over to somebody else to run it with efficiency. Government should sponsor projects with it with money and time frame. Lack of achievements of any department should be dealt with as a discipline issue or the department dismantled completely. Hiring and firing should be made easy with lack of productivity as one reason for firing. Other procedural changes to be made include reduction of government type of approval bureaucracy & processes where anything worthwhile has to go thru the approval of 40 officials/Babus before it could ever be implemented.

Other changes include retiring of people just waiting for retirement pension etc. etc.

The governments cannot do all the changes but private sector can, hence implement these.

Privatize DRDO so that it can import weapon systems directly from a foreign OEM and add a "Make in India" label to it, sure LoL.

 

[Lonewarrior]

DRDO is a lame duck organization which achieved hardly anything in last 50 years. Big names like missiles, fighters and electronic devices took generation to develop. Partly it is the competence of people and partly it operates like a government department where responsibility, accountability and discipline is missing.

To become an effective defence research centre, it has to be privatized and handed over to somebody else to run it with efficiency. Government should sponsor projects with it with money and time frame. Lack of achievements of any department should be dealt with as a discipline issue or the department dismantled completely. Hiring and firing should be made easy with lack of productivity as one reason for firing. Other procedural changes to be made include reduction of government type of approval bureaucracy & processes where anything worthwhile has to go thru the approval of 40 officials/Babus before it could ever be implemented.

Other changes include retiring of people just waiting for retirement pension etc. etc.

The governments cannot do all the changes but private sector can, hence implement these.

There are two ways of countering your argument; one detailed and other exactly to the point (and bit blunt)

Let's start from the later.

USA has Defence Advanced Research Projects Agency, Russia has Russian Foundation for Advanced Research Projects, EU has Joint European Disruptive Initiative, China has Commission for Science, Technology and Industry for National Defense; and these are all big players compared to us. They rank above in GDP, in innovation, in getting independence and perhaps most important...level of privatization.
So are they just a bunch of ch*tiyas to still have a completely government owned defence R&D centre? Answer yourself

Now coming to a technical answer.

Is DRDO flawed? Yes Is DRDO slow? Yup Is DRDO behind the curve in terms of technology? Yes So we must sell it off? Absolutely not
God forbid your child does something bad; so you try to correct it or you simply put him/her for adoption??

DRDO has flaws and steps are being taken to tackle those. If you try to find the median age of DRDO scientist over the years you'll see a decline in it. As for "private" research we already have Make - I & II projects. The ratio of making something competitive vs simply playing catching up is improving; ATAGS and Shakti are good examples.

 

[NoobWannaLearn]

DRDO is a lame duck organization which achieved hardly anything in last 50 years. Big names like missiles, fighters and electronic devices took generation to develop. Partly it is the competence of people and partly it operates like a government department where responsibility, accountability and discipline is missing.

To become an effective defence research centre, it has to be privatized and handed over to somebody else to run it with efficiency. Government should sponsor projects with it with money and time frame. Lack of achievements of any department should be dealt with as a discipline issue or the department dismantled completely. Hiring and firing should be made easy with lack of productivity as one reason for firing. Other procedural changes to be made include reduction of government type of approval bureaucracy & processes where anything worthwhile has to go thru the approval of 40 officials/Babus before it could ever be implemented.

Other changes include retiring of people just waiting for retirement pension etc. etc.

The governments cannot do all the changes but private sector can, hence implement these.

By boy sleeps Wakes up shits on DRDO and then goes to sleep again wake up and repeat

 

[NoobWannaLearn]

 

[SwordOfDarkness]

Not quite sold on the whole rubber track thing

Yeah., less maintenance, but also 0 repairability - If it breaks or is blown up, you replace the whole thing instead of 2-3 segments.

 

[Corvus Splendens]

Not quite sold on the whole rubber track thing

Yeah., less maintenance, but also 0 repairability - If it breaks or is blown up, you replace the whole thing instead of 2-3 segments.

You could do a patch job to limp home

 

[SwordOfDarkness]

You could do a patch job to limp home

Hmm, Ill have to check up on that. Matsimus isnt that accurate wrt technical stuff. I got that from the vid by The Chieftain with the US army for the BAE vehicle that lost to the M10 Booker, where they discussed its rubber tracks.

Edit: Watched it, so a few companies have tracks that can do some degree of tempory repair or split it to sections and replace them together. A bit better than I thought IG.

 

[Hari Sud]

There are two ways of countering your argument; one detailed and other exactly to the point (and bit blunt)

Let's start from the later.

USA has Defence Advanced Research Projects Agency, Russia has Russian Foundation for Advanced Research Projects, EU has Joint European Disruptive Initiative, China has Commission for Science, Technology and Industry for National Defense; and these are all big players compared to us. They rank above in GDP, in innovation, in getting independence and perhaps most important...level of privatization.
So are they just a bunch of ch*tiyas to still have a completely government owned defence R&D centre? Answer yourself

Now coming to a technical answer.

Is DRDO flawed? Yes Is DRDO slow? Yup Is DRDO behind the curve in terms of technology? Yes So we must sell it off? Absolutely not
God forbid your child does something bad; so you try to correct it or you simply put him/her for adoption??

DRDO has flaws and steps are being taken to tackle those. If you try to find the median age of DRDO scientist over the years you'll see a decline in it. As for "private" research we already have Make - I & II projects. The ratio of making something competitive vs simply playing catching up is improving; ATAGS and Shakti are good examples.

‘When the child errs, he is disciplined. In a worst case scenario he is packed off to a boarding under a new drill master. DRDO is in the latter state. It needs a new drill master.

 

[Hari Sud]

"Privatise DRDO" is the dumbest argument that is thrown up wrt improving defense research.

‘All other arguments to improve the DRDO have been tried. Privatize is the best way to deal with slow, indisciplined organization with no accountability.

 

[SwordOfDarkness]

‘All other arguments to improve the DRDO have been tried. Privatize is the best way to deal with slow, indisciplined organization with no accountability.

"I have tried to reform my son in several ways, he is improving but too slowly. I think we should sell him off to other parents who will magically make him brilliant"

 

[Lonewarrior]

‘When the child errs, he is disciplined. In a worst case scenario he is packed off to a boarding under a new drill master. DRDO is in the latter state. It needs a new drill master.

Okkkaay...so basically you've either no idea about privatization or you've never been to a boarding school. Or may be you suck at drawing parallels

Privatization = Putting up your child for adoption or even worse, selling him or her to get rid of; for once and all
Boarding school = Change in the management structure to achieve a certain mission/vision in a set time

 

[Lonewarrior]

‘All other arguments to improve the DRDO have been tried. Privatize is the best way to deal with slow, indisciplined organization with no accountability.

So privatization is the best way. Answer just two questions

For a quite long period of time all the factory and research facilities in Russia (Soviet Union to be more precise) were all government owned...and yet we have things like Sukhois and Mikoyans and Tula and Kalashnikovs. How!?
Even more recent, China...NORINCO's a completely state owned entity and yet it's successfully marketing everything from pistols to missiles all over the globe. How!?