DRDO, PSU and Private Defence Sector News

[porky_kicker]

ULPGM

 

[Arihant Roy]

Yes, the picture I shared is of AIM-Pheonix with payload to measure hypersonic flight. Also known as ALSM. So its not one off special case. It was a test to carry out hypersonic flight characteristic of the missile. Flight ceiling of F-15, from which it was launched is already 65000 feet which is enough for GBR to track the missile launch. So why you think it was launched at such an angle?

The answer is right there in the second graph. A high angle of launch gives more flight time for a missile which means longer range. That graph is also from the same research paper of ALSM. Its not like you cant launch a BVRAAM in a perfect horizontal position. But it would drastically bring down the range of the missile. For same reason, to work out the flight altitude and angle for optimum range gain of Astra, 50 missiles has been ordered before the bulk order of 200 odd missiles.

Now coming to the video link, do you see any horizon to make out the launch angle? If the photographing aircraft is parallel to the firing one, no matter what is the launch angle, it would appear to be fired horizontally. I too could have shared vids, but those are from DCS guys working out on the firing angle of pheonix to obtain max range. But being from DCS world, I don't want to post them.

Coming to the link you have posted, it was mentioned on the the top that service ceiling of Pheonix was 100000 feet. Its flight altitude was 80,000 feet. But where it was mentioned that after firing, it do climb to that altitude? The false assurance of the missile climbing when photographed, comes from two different facts. First the launching aircraft always level up a bit after firing it. Second, the lift coefficient it got because of its huge wings.

But even if you have any doubt on what I said, you could always approach a fighter pilot to ask for yourself.

You are wrong on many counts.

Firstly,Almost all bvraam launches in actual cbat scenario are on a level plane. Hardly does any pilot pitch up to launch his BVR missile since it falls off the pylon, levels off and then flies.

2.The tactic used to increase the range is either to light afterburner or zoom climb to a higher altitude, launch the missile and then come down and a combination of two. F-22 Raptors usually launch amraams while supercruising to give the missile an extra boost.

3. You are the only person who doesn't seem to know that the AIM-54 Phoenix climbs up after being launched for long range BVR shots.

Here are the evidences.

The “end game” performance of the Phoenix was dramatically increased thanks to its unique trajectory after the launch: in fact, since its rocket motor had better performances at high altitude, the AIM-54 climbed to 80,000 feet, at a speed between Mach 4 and Mach 5. After rocket motor burned-out the Phoenix started the descent, converting the altitude in velocity and maintaining its ability to turn against a maneuvering target.

https://theaviationgeekclub.com/how...tory-of-the-six-on-six-missile-shot-test/amp/

And now from the horse's mouth, a F-14 RIO himself.


Watch from 21:00 to 21:44.

This scheme is also used in the Vympel R-33. And the latter R-37 or RVV-BD.


4. After launch, our Astra mk3 will climb to a higher altitude after launch for achieving 300+ km range for very long range shots.

5. Don't make the assumption that I haven't talked with fighter pilots .

Thanks.

 

[flanker99]

Great setup inside ADA. On par with the Western OEM.

View attachment 165909

Notice the titled aesa array ok Tejas mk2 .

The aesa on Tejas mk1 can track more than 64 targets at once. Whether it's Uttam or the EL/M-2052 isn't clear at this point.

where did u watch the report?...

 

[porky_kicker]

If its VL launched Akash-NG, are we planning to limit and possibly replace Barak 8 in the coming years?

No idea DRDO / services will only know

 

[Aditya Ballal]

since you've tagged me i'm going to reply,
one thing that i'd like to mention is, i don't think this is list of contenders for the said tender, rather just a list of available ;indigeneous; (degree varies) options

SSS Defense P-72
- seems like AK based design in new receiver body
- feeds from traditional AK pattern magazines, BUT they haven't shown any prototype in 5.56x45mm yet, but i belive it could be feeding from AK style magazines and in our case probably from INSAS pattern magazines; if not then it must feed from STANAG pattern ones - cannot afford to have all these different proprietary magazines around in our supply chains huh for even same calibre weapons
if yes then it's a huge plus as we can use existing magazines (plus ammo too, hopefully) on these guns
- ambidextrous controls, a plus for a close combat weapon
- buttstock is also modular, unlike some other options
- 3-6-9-12 picatiny rails, so attachments are also possible
--> with all things (and bakchodis alike) that SSS Defense guys have done so far, i can't say i am hopeful to see them delivering but at least interested to see their P-72 variant in 5.56x45mm

Astr Defense INDRA
- SCAR derivative, 'nuff said
- notably the 7.62 NATO variant seemed to be feeding from FAL//SLR style 'nose-in-rock-back' style magazines (in polymer i believe) so they might be having a similar downscaled variant for 5.56x45mm too, i believe ? again just like SSSD P-72 if true i hope it feeds from INSAS pattern magazines; if not then it must feed from STANAG pattern ones - cannot afford to have all these different proprietary magazines around in our supply chains huh for even same calibre weapons

Kalyani-Thales P90
- Australian fork of AUG
- feeds from STANAG magazines, good enough but sadly we might have to induct bunch of these magazines for this gigantic order as they are second in numbers after INSAS pattern ones giving to its prevalence etc, but still manageable as there are plenty of ways to get them
- AUG design, hhmm, we tested O G AUG back in late 80s when we were trying to get a standard issue assault rifle thing itself to replace 1A SLRs, and rejected it, many things happened afterwards and end result was INSAS... i am not sure how would army find it to test another AUG fork after all these years but let's see, still miles better than those suicidal Sterling ;9mm carbines;

Kalyani-ARDE Carbine
- INSAS derivative in SIG SG540 // SG-550 style two-section receivers
- my favourite out of all
- not ambidextrous from factory itself, but can be made using armory level jugaads
- again has top rail and bottom section in handguards, no side sectional rails but at least has mount for screwing 3 and 9 position rail sections if needed, so that way it's very elementary gun but miles better than Sterling so yeah
- feeds from new generation INSAS polymer magazines, not translucent this time but ok, so adapting it to existing supplies would be easy peasy thing
- buttstock hhmm, just folds, not modular (doesn't have adjustable length or cheek piece) but hopefully they could provide a replacement one if armed forces asks for it or chalo still better than Sterling
- training-transition on it would be simpler if not simplest, as ;it's just another AK // another INSAS; with slightly different steps in disassembly, otherwise operating is just same thing so a big yay that way
- my biggest *copium* with this design is if it succeeds in getting huge orders and becomes prevalent in armed forces *maybe* we might see future derivatives coming out from this base design of two-section receiver for Assault Rifle, LMG, DMR etc etc ? that way i am giga hopeful but knowing things well...sigh...

OFB//AWEIL INSAS 1C
- well what to say, it's offshot of INSAS Excalibur in milled receiver design
- training, transition etc on it would be simplest of all because ;it's just another AK // another INSAS;
- very essential design, doesn't have much rails and stuff except some sections on top-bottom handguards and sides etc
- feeds (and hopefully fires INSAS ammo) INSAS pattern magazines, so that way huge plus
- sadly doesn't have ambidextrous controls, but i believe doable at armory level jugaad if needed
- buttstock...same as above, like wtf they show offed AR style modular buttstock on certain derivative work of OFB R-2 that's like upscaled 1C in that vdo by Sandeep Unnithan...why didn't they make it standard huh...but anyway still better than Sterling so it goes...

Adani-PLR-IWI
(i)Carmel
- AR-18 derivative, competitor of ASTR INDRA // CZ Bren 2
- fully ambidextrous, even charging handle can be switched over on both sides; but i believe it is too much parts and fragile and what not
- offers swappable barrel feature
- feeds from STANAG pattern magazines, read what i said above
- my only concern is it's a brand new design and i am kind of skeptical of its performance on actual battle zone, like not even Israelis are adopting it yet. It just looks like IWI's attempt to squeeze some monies off american civilian shooters and/or import heavy army like ours , does nothing much better than already existing and successful rifles in market
(ii)Arad
- AR-15 derivative, enough said
- short stroke gas piston system, ambidextrous controls, feeds from STANAG magazines; something very similar to what we've been using here with M4, SIG556 etc in special forces and with SIG716i now also similar to that in general army so ;training, transition; etc could have been easied
- additionally has swappable barrel (using tools) and so
- overall a very good alternative to what army originally intended to bring here with those CAR816
(iii)ACE
- call me biased whatever but for me least desirable weapon design for this tender, simply because it's just another AK in 5.56x45mm and we could've done it here at home,heck we already have ARDE Carbine and INSAS 1C and ;imporing another AK in this age and time is just stupid; (*sigh, sadly that's what we tried to do with that AK-203 tender huh )
- 3-6-9-12 rails, ambidextrous controls, feeds from Galil pattern original 5.56mm magazines duhh (on ACE 22) and alternatively STANAG pattern magazines in another variant (on ACE 21) so either way magazines gonna be a thing if we move ahead with this
- training on it would be simple as...it's just another AK
- IWI decided to put their own bracket (a triangular design tube) for that modular buttstock that is not compatible with AR pattern one (since AR one is cylindrical tube) huuuuh despite being so similar in function and design to that, classic tactic; so in case we go ahead with this one we would have to either buy a replacement buttstock adapter to put AR stock or just make do with whatever these happy merchants are providing not a big deal in complete package but maintenance wise it's kinda a thing yeah

Caracal-Indian Partner (?) CAR816
- AR-15 in short stoke gas piston system, HK416 derivative by same designers, enough said
- ambidextrous control, design is known thanks to M4 and SIG556 in service with SF, so training-transitions going to be easier
- winner of previous tender but now... who knows
- another undesirable weapon for me despite all check marks in terms of technical advantages, simply because it's from UAE and we already have Arad, SSS Defense's AR based rifle (huh ?), Jindal-Taurus T4 (basically M4) as AR alternatives here

Jindal-Taurus T4
- basically M4a1 carbine from Brazil, 'nuff said
- whatever i've said above about Arad, CAR816 applies on it on technical grounds

NDT-MDR ? you mean Desert Tech MDR ?
- pffff lool just pass this one even without trails, jam-o-matic it is; i would rather fight with Sterlings lol
- a separate ejection mechanism thingy for muh forward ejection thing hurr durr that often rather jams it up, needs frequent maintenance, complex disassembly and stuff (literally requires tools to even open it up huuuuuuuuh), does nothing better than other options in terms of performance on firing range...meh i'd pass
- only positive i see is it's very similar in terms of controls to Tavor or X-95...wait how the fook they (da long nosed merchants) aren't offering X-95 for this tender huh perfect carbine contender also being made here since years...and our guys are damn familiar with the gun itself...except some civilian shooters in amreeka literally nobody looking at MDR so they're trying to cash on 'low hanging fruits', eh ?
tl dr, throw MDR in dustbin and pick Tavor // X-95 if going bullpup way

CMTPL - CZ arms Bren 2
- SCAR like, competitor to ASTR's INDRA
- fully ambidextrous, feeds from STANAG pattern magazines, 3-6-9-12 rails, is combat proven ( CZ-807 domestically under CRPF COBRA, Andhra's Greyhounds etc service against Naxals etc, Bren 2 internationally in Afghanistan and recent ongoing ;special military operation in Ukraine; )
- i prefer this over Carmel
- as for comparing with ASTR's INDRA, let's hope the best carbine wins between these two

You missed the SSS Defence AR-15 patterned rifle where their CEO in his conversation with me on Twitter DM and I had posted screenshots of it in the Small Arms thread, mentioned about this upcoming Carbine requirement and that they’ll also be offering an SBR variant of it for this competition.

Small arms and Light Weapons

defenceforumindia.com

 

[Dark Sorrow]

Additional info

If unknown aforementioned missile is a 'new' SAM

IMO then 2 possibilities as per known DRDO systems under development

1. LRQRSAM (Long Range Quick Reaction SAM)

2. ERSAM (Extended Range SAM) one of the missiles of Extended Range Air Defence System (ERADS) family of SAMs

What is LRQRSAM?

 

[Aditya Ballal]

 

[Saumyasupraik]

View attachment 165781

View attachment 165778


View attachment 165779
lol why do they all look different? Did they redesign or something. Even the shape of the main circle of the first 2 are different as well as their background.

Edit:The background tile is similar for first two after looking closely thx to the red line beside it and maybe the viewing angle is affecting it

First one is Elbit D-COMPASS.

 

[mist_consecutive]

Runours are afloat that we are trying to integrate Hellfire missiles on Rudra ?

Any truth to this ?

 

[rone]

Runours are afloat that we are trying to integrate Hellfire missiles on Rudra ?

Any truth to this ?

i thought it was for lch, because of the current lca situation iaf and army asked for hellfire integration

 

[NoobWannaLearn]

Around 23 mins what kind of rockets are these?

 

[lcafanboy]

EMP weapons .....

 

[ClawReed787]

Around 23 mins what kind of rockets are these?

Grad mlrs.Failed to launch?

 

[karn]

Grad mlrs.Failed to launch?

There were 5 misfires before the 2 nd rocket launched

 

[NoobWannaLearn]

Grad mlrs.Failed to launch?

I see was wondering were they imported?

 

[jai jaganath]

Folks I have doubt we conducted 1st nuke test in 1974 but we were not called a nuclear state
But when we did it in 1998 then we were called nuclear state
What we did in 1998 and not in 1974 that we were not called even a potential nuclear power

 

[ClawReed787]

I see was wondering were they imported?

Yes, just read an article saying plans there to make it in India by 2022.

 

[Love Charger]

Folks I have doubt we conducted 1st nuke test in 1974 but we were not called a nuclear state
But when we did it in 1998 then we were called nuclear state
What we did in 1998 and not in 1974 that we were not called even a potential nuclear power

These terms are decided by America.
India was firmly is soviet camp, plus to a layman observer a nuke cloud is the biggest proof of a test which didn't happen in the underground test
Doing a single nuke test actually means nothing, unless done again and it results published and validated nowadays we use supercomputers to simulate the effects instead of doing actual tests

 

[Aditya Ballal]

I see was wondering were they imported?

BM-21 Grad - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Aditya Ballal]

Yes, just read an article saying plans there to make it in India by 2022.

Source? Only a newer extended range rocket for it was developed and tested by DRDO.

Rocket 122 mm | Defence Research and Development Organisation - DRDO, Ministry of Defence, Government of India

The 122mm rocket has been developed with HE fragmentation warhead. A battery of six launchers can deliver a salvo of 240 rockets in 20 seconds to a maximum range of 20 km and saturate a target area of the size of a football field with more than four tonnes of steel fragments and high explosives.

www.drdo.gov.in

Old version

DRDO successfully test fires Enhanced Range 122mm Caliber Rocket

Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) successfully test fired enhanced range versions

pib.gov.in

New version